Can the Democrats in Congress become an effective opposition party ?

[heelinhell]

I have maintained for years that the GQP has been a horrible governing party for decades but an effective opposition party and that the Democratic Party has been a very effective governing party but a lily livered opposition party.

The Ragin' Cajun has laid out a plan for Dems to step up and be an effective opposition party.

Will Dems want to or be able to transition from a very good governing party to being an effective opposition party.

It's not in the Dem DNA but hope springs eternal

'We live or die': James Carville has a plan to force GOP's implosion

Democratic strategist James Carville acknowledged in a New York Times op-ed that he was wrong to believe that Vice President Kamala Harris would prevail in the 2024 presidential election.However, Carville also said that he had hope that his party could make a comeback in the near future simply...

www.rawstory.com

 

[uncsig]

That was a good op-ed by Carville.

The main problems as I see them are 1) the lack of messaging discipline and 2) the absence of an amplifying media system.

 

[bassydude77]

I'm not sure they even need to be. We're (on the left) fortunate the pubs tend to do that to themselves at least in terms of actually legaslating....

 

[superrific]

Carville writes: ""Let’s start by forcing them to oppose a raise in the minimum wage to $15 an hour," he argued. "Let’s make Roe v. Wade an economic messaging issue and force them to block our attempts to codify it into law. And let’s take back the immigration issue by making it an economic issue and force the G.O.P. to deny bipartisan reform that expedites entry for high-performing talent and for those who will bring business into our nation. This year the Democratic Party leadership must convene and publish a creative, popular and bold economic agenda and proactively take back our economic turf."

I mean, that's fine and all, but will it move the needle at all? We just witnessed a campaign built on bullshit like "they are eating the pets" and "no taxes on tips" (ha ha MAGA idiots -- when was the last time you heard Trump talk about that? Oh, it was just bullshit all along? And you bought in hook, line and sinker? ). Is forcing Pubs to block attempts to codify Roe going to matter at all?

How exactly are we to make immigration an economic issue, when it is so plainly an outlet for and amplifier of coarse racism. If that wasn't already clear, the reaction to the New Orleans attack should make it indisputable. The "border" is about race. Absolutely no way Trump would have been tweeting anything about the border if the dude was norwegian.

 

[heelinhell]

Carville writes: ""Let’s start by forcing them to oppose a raise in the minimum wage to $15 an hour," he argued. "Let’s make Roe v. Wade an economic messaging issue and force them to block our attempts to codify it into law. And let’s take back the immigration issue by making it an economic issue and force the G.O.P. to deny bipartisan reform that expedites entry for high-performing talent and for those who will bring business into our nation. This year the Democratic Party leadership must convene and publish a creative, popular and bold economic agenda and proactively take back our economic turf."

I mean, that's fine and all, but will it move the needle at all? We just witnessed a campaign built on bullshit like "they are eating the pets" and "no taxes on tips" (ha ha MAGA idiots -- when was the last time you heard Trump talk about that? Oh, it was just bullshit all along? And you bought in hook, line and sinker? ). Is forcing Pubs to block attempts to codify Roe going to matter at all?

How exactly are we to make immigration an economic issue, when it is so plainly an outlet for and amplifier of coarse racism. If that wasn't already clear, the reaction to the New Orleans attack should make it indisputable. The "border" is about race. Absolutely no way Trump would have been tweeting anything about the border if the dude was norwegian.

It is not so much targeting the bigoted MAGAs as it is targeting the mainstream media to promote the narrative and reach folks with a triple digit IQ

 

[superrific]

It is not so much targeting the bigoted MAGAs as it is targeting the mainstream media to promote the narrative and reach folks with a triple digit IQ

1. How many people who are concerned about "the border" are concerned about it for reasons other than race? Almost nobody. All the race-neutral justifications are easily picked apart.

2. I think it's easy to conclude, from this last election especially, that racism is a winning issue in 2024 America. Obama was a long time ago. The Obama-Trump voters were mostly just Trump voters all along who voted for Obama because the GOP in 08 was a complete and utter shitshow and Americans again turned to the liberal Dems to get them out of a big jam that the GOP created. It was then back to normal.

I don't know what to do in response, but I'm pessimistic that we can fight racism effectively with "an economic issue that forces the GOP to deny bipartisan reform that expedites entry for high-performing talent." I mean, we had a bipartisan reform on the table this year. Trump killed it and lost nothing from it. We've made it an economic issue -- deportations will lead to huge inflation and shortages. Didn't matter.

 

[heelinhell]

1. How many people who are concerned about "the border" are concerned about it for reasons other than race? Almost nobody. All the race-neutral justifications are easily picked apart.

2. I think it's easy to conclude, from this last election especially, that racism is a winning issue in 2024 America. Obama was a long time ago. The Obama-Trump voters were mostly just Trump voters all along who voted for Obama because the GOP in 08 was a complete and utter shitshow and Americans again turned to the liberal Dems to get them out of a big jam that the GOP created. It was then back to normal.

I don't know what to do in response, but I'm pessimistic that we can fight racism effectively with "an economic issue that forces the GOP to deny bipartisan reform that expedites entry for high-performing talent." I mean, we had a bipartisan reform on the table this year. Trump killed it and lost nothing from it. We've made it an economic issue -- deportations will lead to huge inflation and shortages. Didn't matter.

I agree with you 100% that the border/immigration issue for MAGAs is all about fear and bigotry and has nothing to do with economics.

That said, if the narrative can be shifted to the adverse consequences of mass deportation, then those with a triple digit IQ will be able to understand that mass deportation is a horrible policy.

And Carville goes beyond border/immigration politics and argues that Dems should tout raising the minimum wage and other economic issues popular with the majority of Americans.

 

[lawtig02]

I'd feel differently about this if the Dems controlled either house, but in the current environment, I'm all in on a back bench strategy. Book time on every podcast, Sunday morning show, primetime cable show, etc. available and go on and on nonstop about the incompetence and harm being created by the Pubs in control of all the levers of power. Be ruthless about it. Blame them for things that are not actually anyone's fault. Pubs bought the farm. Let's see if they know what to do with it. I'm EXTREMELY confident they'll fuck it up every way imaginable.

 

[farce©]

I'd feel differently about this if the Dems controlled either house, but in the current environment, I'm all in on a back bench strategy. Book time on every podcast, Sunday morning show, primetime cable show, etc. available and go on and on nonstop about the incompetence and harm being created by the Pubs in control of all the levers of power. Be ruthless about it. Blame them for things that are not actually anyone's fault. Pubs bought the farm. Let's see if they know what to do with it. I'm EXTREMELY confident they'll fuck it up every way imaginable.

I agree, but I think GOP tax cuts for the wealthy is a winning issue for Democrats if they can relentlessly use that to demonstrate Republican disregard for the plight of the working class.

 

[Zoo_View]

I agree, but I think GOP tax cuts for the wealthy is a winning issue for Democrats if they can relentlessly use that to demonstrate Republican disregard for the plight of the working class.

Let the Republicans lower taxes on the wealthy. Tout a plan to increase taxes on incomes $700,000 and above.

 

[uncsig]

Read somewhere that Bernie was going to introduce a bill to cap credit card interest rates at 10% as Trump spouted off on the campaign trail that he supported.

 

[heelinhell]

I'd feel differently about this if the Dems controlled either house, but in the current environment, I'm all in on a back bench strategy. Book time on every podcast, Sunday morning show, primetime cable show, etc. available and go on and on nonstop about the incompetence and harm being created by the Pubs in control of all the levers of power. Be ruthless about it. Blame them for things that are not actually anyone's fault. Pubs bought the farm. Let's see if they know what to do with it. I'm EXTREMELY confident they'll fuck it up every way imaginable.

Senator Chris Murphy (who was my preferred presidential candidate if he had chosen to run ) was on the Chris Hayes show advocating for the same. He was arguing that Dems in Congress need to aggressively oppose the Trumplicans and focus upon messaging that exposes how Trump and the GQP will screw working and middle class Americans.

However, he shared my pessimism that Dems do not seem to be willing to be bare knuckled in opposing Trump and his billionaire bros.

Unless Dems in Congress grow a spine, we are in for a world of hurt

 

[mpaer]

I am not as well informed as I should be on precedures to introduce a bill in the House. But I "think" Speaker Johnson will be able to totally block Dem Bills from even coming to the floor for a vote?

 

[TangledUpInBlue06]

Carville writes: ""Let’s start by forcing them to oppose a raise in the minimum wage to $15 an hour," he argued. "Let’s make Roe v. Wade an economic messaging issue and force them to block our attempts to codify it into law. And let’s take back the immigration issue by making it an economic issue and force the G.O.P. to deny bipartisan reform that expedites entry for high-performing talent and for those who will bring business into our nation. This year the Democratic Party leadership must convene and publish a creative, popular and bold economic agenda and proactively take back our economic turf."

I mean, that's fine and all, but will it move the needle at all? We just witnessed a campaign built on bullshit like "they are eating the pets" and "no taxes on tips" (ha ha MAGA idiots -- when was the last time you heard Trump talk about that? Oh, it was just bullshit all along? And you bought in hook, line and sinker? ). Is forcing Pubs to block attempts to codify Roe going to matter at all?

How exactly are we to make immigration an economic issue, when it is so plainly an outlet for and amplifier of coarse racism. If that wasn't already clear, the reaction to the New Orleans attack should make it indisputable. The "border" is about race. Absolutely no way Trump would have been tweeting anything about the border if the dude was norwegian.

I think this is probably broadly right. The economic messaging may move some people, but probably only at the margins.

I also think Dems would quickly get distracted off this message by the weekly bullshit, stupidity, and scandals in Trump 2.0. Shiny objects they can't resist.

 

[thebruinbleedstarheelblue]

they just lost an election to a wildly unpopular clown with multiple active investigations.

Candidates, messaging, and even the democratic DOJ fumbled this away... now they're gonna be an effective opposition party against a team that does not play by the rules?

There is no evidence to suggest the Democrats would be willing effective... at this point they just have to hope that Trump drops the ball or dies.

 

[lawtig02]

they just lost an election to a wildly unpopular clown with multiple active investigations.

Candidates, messaging, and even the democratic DOJ fumbled this away... now they're gonna be an effective opposition party against a team that does not play by the rules?

There is no evidence to suggest the Democrats would be willing effective... at this point they just have to hope that Trump drops the ball or dies.

That’s a WAY oversimplified interpretation of the election, in my view. Dems made plenty of mistakes. Not denying that. But the two most important factors were (1) widespread dissatisfaction with the status quo, which is a global issue right now, and (2) Biden’s decision to seek reelection. The Dems who could be effective messengers in the next four years had very little to do with either of those issues. I think the Dems are well equipped now to be an opposition party, but it will take some guts and a willingness to take chances.

 

[ZenMode]

Carville writes: ""Let’s start by forcing them to oppose a raise in the minimum wage to $15 an hour," he argued. "Let’s make Roe v. Wade an economic messaging issue and force them to block our attempts to codify it into law. And let’s take back the immigration issue by making it an economic issue and force the G.O.P. to deny bipartisan reform that expedites entry for high-performing talent and for those who will bring business into our nation. This year the Democratic Party leadership must convene and publish a creative, popular and bold economic agenda and proactively take back our economic turf."

I mean, that's fine and all, but will it move the needle at all? We just witnessed a campaign built on bullshit like "they are eating the pets" and "no taxes on tips" (ha ha MAGA idiots -- when was the last time you heard Trump talk about that? Oh, it was just bullshit all along? And you bought in hook, line and sinker? ). Is forcing Pubs to block attempts to codify Roe going to matter at all?

I haven't seen any exit polling that shows Americans being concerned about immigrants eating pets. Is that really what you believe is concerning to Americans as it relates to the border?

How exactly are we to make immigration an economic issue, when it is so plainly an outlet for and amplifier of coarse racism.

I don't know. Maybe stop labeling as racist anyone who expresses a concern about people sneaking into the country illegally?

Absolutely no way Trump would have been tweeting anything about the border if the dude was norwegian.

Do you really think that there is equal risk between Norwegians and Arabs/Muslim? Are Norwegians flying 747s into our skyscrapers? Are Norwegians detonating explosives during the Boston Marathon? How many stories have you read talking about norwegian's covering their bodies and explosives and blowing themselves up in a crowd?

By the way, if the Democratic Party continues to play these types of political correctness games, there's a good chance you'll be talking about "what can we do as an opposition party" beyond the next four years.

 

[UNCatTech]

It is not so much targeting the bigoted MAGAs as it is targeting the mainstream media to promote the narrative and reach folks with a triple digit IQ

Are there enough of those people to actually win an election?

 

[lawtig02]

I haven't seen any exit polling that shows Americans being concerned about immigrants eating pets. Is that really what you believe is concerning to Americans as it relates to the border?I don't know. Maybe stop labeling as racist anyone who expresses a concern about people sneaking into the country illegally?


Do you really think that there is equal risk between Norwegians and Arabs/Muslim? Are Norwegians flying 747s into our skyscrapers? Are Norwegians detonating explosives during the Boston Marathon? How many stories have you read talking about norwegian's covering their bodies and explosives and blowing themselves up in a crowd?

By the way, if the Democratic Party continues to play these types of political correctness games, there's a good chance you'll be talking about "what can we do as an opposition party" beyond the next four years.

Why are you connecting immigration to terrorism? How many people who have committed terror attacks in the US were here illegally? I can’t think of any. Immigration and terrorism are separate issues.

 

[UNCatTech]

I've also read many articles about how this is a bad idea.

Read somewhere that Bernie was going to introduce a bill to cap credit card interest rates at 10% as Trump spouted off on the campaign trail that he supported.