Israel Hamas War, West Bank, Etc. | Hostilities resume
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2ManyBlueCups
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I've been following the situation there for several decades. I don't have a background with either party. Just an observer who can see the BS being levied by each side in the propaganda battle.
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I will admit that while there is so much positivity right now for Harris, this issue is still the one that I believe has the possibility of getting Trump back into contention if Iran escalates things significantly, and Israel retaliates with impunity. We don’t want a significant conflict leading into the election.
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Batt Boy
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Never said that. You said that. Poor point.
Downstream effects of Oct 7th are dreadful all around and the rage should be directed at Hamas. If you were to listen to the people of Gaza who are there, not outside, you would know this is the sentiment. Terrible situation for them.
RaiGuy
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Maybe it's just me, but I think the blame should be on the ones that are indiscriminately dropping bombs on displaced civilians in tents and the ones that snipe children for fun. No one is saying Hamas is innocent here, but they aren't the ones flattening Gaza right now.
Batt Boy
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The reality is that Hamas targets civilians and the IDF tries not to kill civilians, but it's hard since Hamas surrounds Al-Qassam with children.
RaiGuy
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What reality are you talking about? "IDF tries not to kill civilians"?? When they drop a bomb on a tented area where they had claimed was a "safe zone" and they kill 40 innocent people, how is that trying not to kill civilians?? When they have snipers that shoot at children, is that avoiding civilian deaths? When they bomb people praying, is that avoiding civilians deaths? They are as good at avoiding civilian deaths as Raygun is at breakdancing
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Yeah, I'm not buying the "IDF tries not to kill civilians" part of this. Putting total blame on Hamas for the widespread killing is BS. There is plenty of blame to go around and Likud and the IDF have a lot of blood on their hands.
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It's more accurate to say that the IDF decides that killing civilians is worth it given their larger objectives (pretty much the same rationale Hamas uses).
If they really tried not to kill civilians, the Palestinian death toll would be 1/20th of what it actually is.
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Tell you what. I’m going to be pissed at both. Bibi has Ben Givr and Smotrich in his cabinet. They are horrible men. Bibi is a horrible man. Sinwar is a horrible man. Hamas is horrible, the occupation is horrible, the settlers are horrible. Israel is not standing on moral high ground at present, not after 10s of thousands killed as collective punishment.
AMEN!
Agreed. If the IDF really cared about minimizing Palestinian casualties then the numbers from Gaza would be a fraction of what they have actually been. I am a supporter of Israel. However, I am not a supporter of this government. They have shown a total disregard for the Palestinian civilians of Gaza. One of the most defenseless people in the world.
2ManyBlueCups
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On the plus side Israel's actions in Gaza have left Hamas a shell of what it once was, and unable to launch another 10/7 type attack:
Israel has achieved all that it can militarily in Gaza, according to senior American officials, who say continued bombings are only increasing risks to civilians while the possibility of further weakening Hamas has diminished.
With the Biden administration racing to get cease-fire negotiations back on track, a growing number of national security officials across the government said that the Israeli military had severely set back Hamas but would never be able to completely eliminate the group.
In many respects, Israel’s military operation has done far more damage against Hamas than U.S. officials had predicted when the war began in October.
Israeli forces can now move freely throughout Gaza, the officials said, and Hamas is bloodied and damaged. Israel has destroyed or seized crucial supply routes from Egypt into Gaza. About 14,000 combatants in Gaza have been killed or captured, the Israeli military said last month. (The U.S. intelligence agencies use different, more conservative methodologies to estimate Hamas casualties, though the precise number remains classified.)
The Israeli military also asserted that it had eliminated half the leadership of the Qassam Brigades, the military wing of Hamas, including the top leaders Muhammad Deif and Marwan Issa.
“Hamas is largely depleted but not wiped out, and the Israelis may never achieve the total annihilation of Hamas,” said Ralph Goff, a former senior C.I.A. official who served in the Middle East.
But U.S. officials believe that Israel has achieved a meaningful military victory. Hamas is no longer capable of planning or executing an attack on the scale of Oct. 7, and its ability to launch smaller terrorist attacks on Israel is in doubt, they say.
Hamas has been so damaged in the war that its officials have told international negotiators it is willing to give up civilian control of Gaza to an independent group after a cease-fire is in place. How long Hamas will be willing to give up a measure of its power will depend on what happens after a cease-fire, and what concessions Israel is prepared to make, American officials said.
www.nytimes.com
Israel has achieved all that it can militarily in Gaza, according to senior American officials, who say continued bombings are only increasing risks to civilians while the possibility of further weakening Hamas has diminished.
With the Biden administration racing to get cease-fire negotiations back on track, a growing number of national security officials across the government said that the Israeli military had severely set back Hamas but would never be able to completely eliminate the group.
In many respects, Israel’s military operation has done far more damage against Hamas than U.S. officials had predicted when the war began in October.
Israeli forces can now move freely throughout Gaza, the officials said, and Hamas is bloodied and damaged. Israel has destroyed or seized crucial supply routes from Egypt into Gaza. About 14,000 combatants in Gaza have been killed or captured, the Israeli military said last month. (The U.S. intelligence agencies use different, more conservative methodologies to estimate Hamas casualties, though the precise number remains classified.)
The Israeli military also asserted that it had eliminated half the leadership of the Qassam Brigades, the military wing of Hamas, including the top leaders Muhammad Deif and Marwan Issa.
“Hamas is largely depleted but not wiped out, and the Israelis may never achieve the total annihilation of Hamas,” said Ralph Goff, a former senior C.I.A. official who served in the Middle East.
But U.S. officials believe that Israel has achieved a meaningful military victory. Hamas is no longer capable of planning or executing an attack on the scale of Oct. 7, and its ability to launch smaller terrorist attacks on Israel is in doubt, they say.
Hamas has been so damaged in the war that its officials have told international negotiators it is willing to give up civilian control of Gaza to an independent group after a cease-fire is in place. How long Hamas will be willing to give up a measure of its power will depend on what happens after a cease-fire, and what concessions Israel is prepared to make, American officials said.
In Gaza, Israel’s Military Has Reached the End of the Line, U.S. Officials Say
Israel has severely set back Hamas but will never be able to completely eliminate the group, U.S. officials said.
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I just wish we would take care of our business and stay out of others. No one is ever going to stop all the crazy organized religions from killing one nother though.
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It would be helpful if people could realize that this conflict has almost nothing to do with "organized religion", especially on the Palestinian side.
p5mmr9
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We are taking care of "our business" which is why we are involved in the world's conflicts. The world is an interconnected place both economically and culturally - we are in this together. Isolationism is impossible in the modern world. Our country is also home as a majority to one of those "crazy organized religions." And while religion is the justification - it is not the sole reason for the destruction and chaos.
p5mmr9
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It's origins are tribal and the religions involved are certainly a very significant aspect of that tribalism, but it is true that religion is often used as a justification in situations that are largely unjustifiable otherwise.