Ukraine War

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Callatoroy said:
You sound really paranoid and cringy with your "following me" schtick. I guess that's a deflection tactic. My interactions with you are due to your blatant hypocrisy that seemingly has skyrocketed in frequency, and the over the top hyperbole (I mean its approaching CF levels). Are you politicking for some hidden board award that goes to the most hysterical and hyperbolic poster? You engage me in a civil and serious manner and I will always reciprocate. There are those on here who are always civil and serious and I always treat them in like kind. You were no different until after the election and thats when you became more Shannon and less NYC. As for your respect, meh, I'm a conservative engaging on a liberal board. Respect for any conservative is fleeting around here but conservatives on here know that so its all good.
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My guy, almost 100% of the interactions between you and I are because you quote respond to posts of mine. Almost 0% of our interactions are because I interact with you first. Yes, you are following me around, begging for conflict. I'm flattered. I literally could not possibly care any less about you if I had a gun to my head.

Go back and read whatever insane fuckery you spewed at me around midnight last night and tell me with a straight face that you were engaging in a civil and serious manner. Go read that and tell me how in the world I am supposed to respond to someone who sounds like they doused themselves in gasoline and lit the match like some Buddhist monk in Vietnam. You're a liar, and not very good at it either. You are angry, and becoming increasingly unhinged. You engage with exactly zero people on this board with any civility and seriousness. Not one single person.

You have a very bizarre obsession with me that I don't understand. You literally have no idea what my mindset has been since the election. I've got a million things I am involved in and care about right now that are occupying real estate in my brain, but the outcome of an election ain't one of them. Do I hate Trump? Hell yeah. Is Trump negatively impacting me personally on a day-to-day basis? Not even close. I like to come to this board because I like to talk politics as a hobby. But you keep referencing it like you are desperate to hope that I am mad or pissed off or melting down or whatever, because that's what you want me to do, and it seems to eat at you that I'm....just not mad. I haven't changed the way I've posted on this board for years. You are the one who everyone can see is becoming a raging maniacal asshole. Literally everything with you is pure projection.

Grow the fuck up. You are about as immature as you are unintelligent and dishonest. It's a really nasty combination. If you want me to engage with you in a civil manner, the onus is on you, not on me. I don't ever go out of my way to engage with you, and I'm not ever going to go out of my way to engage you. If you crave my attention or want some sort of response from me of any substance, you better figure out a different way to talk to me. Otherwise, fuck off. Sound good?
 
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Callatoroy said:
I don't necessarily disagree with you and you make a good point about the price of battlefield information we have obtained. I don't support his public position on the beginning point of a brokered deal and his treating ukraine as irrelevant to the discussions. However, I do have some major heartburn about not forcing Europe to shoulder more of the financial burden. I have a great deal of criticism of biden in the months leading up to the invasion, but not so much in the support other than as you said him not being more aggressive. I don't think biden was mentally capable of doing much beyond providing weapons. I do think Putin, if pushed to where he was going to be defeated or publicly humiliated, would have used battlefield nukes so I'm aware that being to aggressive could have led to a bad outcome and then what is the response? I would like to see trump continue or even increase the support for ukraine while having a sense of urgency to broker a deal. At what point does the support stop? Another year? Two? Five? There has to be an ending to it.
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Just to put some numbers to this, EU support for Ukraine totals about $125 billion to date with another $115 billion pledged. US has given about $90 billion with another $30 billion pledged. So the EU is shouldering more aid and when you consider the EU's gdp is about $19T compared to the US at roughly $27T, the discrepancy is even larger as a share of resources. I'm all for pushing Europe to contribute more as the threat is more relevant to them and they have been stepping up more recently. But it's imperative that the US continues our support as well. As for how long I would say however long it takes and Ukraine is willing to fight. If Ukraine decides they want to settle then that's their prerogative, but the longer Russia is engaged in Ukraine the worse things get for them economically and militarily and the longer it will take them to rebuild. If our defense budget is about protecting us and our interests abroad, then you'll hardly find an investment with a better return than what we are getting in Ukraine. It sucks for the people of Ukraine, but it is their decision and right to decide what they want to do.
 
CFordUNC said:
My guy, almost 100% of the interactions between you and I are because you quote respond to posts of mine. Almost 0% of our interactions are because I interact with you first. Yes, you are following me around, begging for conflict. I'm flattered. I literally could not possibly care any less about you if I had a gun to my head.

Go back and read whatever insane fuckery you spewed at me around midnight last night and tell me with a straight face that you were engaging in a civil and serious manner. Go read that and tell me how in the world I am supposed to respond to someone who sounds like they doused themselves in gasoline and lit the match like some Buddhist monk in Vietnam. You're a liar, and not very good at it either. You are angry, and becoming increasingly unhinged. You engage with exactly zero people on this board with any civility and seriousness. Not one single person.

You have a very bizarre obsession with me that I don't understand. You literally have no idea what my mindset has been since the election. I've got a million things I am involved in and care about right now that are occupying real estate in my brain, but the outcome of an election ain't one of them. Do I hate Trump? Hell yeah. Is Trump negatively impacting me personally on a day-to-day basis? Not even close. I like to come to this board because I like to talk politics as a hobby. But you keep referencing it like you are desperate to hope that I am mad or pissed off or melting down or whatever, because that's what you want me to do, and it seems to eat at you that I'm....just not mad. I haven't changed the way I've posted on this board for years. You are the one who everyone can see is becoming a raging maniacal asshole. Literally everything with you is pure projection.

Grow the fuck up. You are about as immature as you are unintelligent and dishonest. It's a really nasty combination. If you want me to engage with you in a civil manner, the onus is on you, not on me. I don't ever go out of my way to engage with you, and I'm not ever going to go out of my way to engage you. If you crave my attention or want some sort of response from me of any substance, you better figure out a different way to talk to me. Otherwise, fuck off. Sound good?
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How can you act in a civil manner with a guy who wished "holy hell" upon HRC, Schiff, Tish, etc. because they did their jobs?
 
superrific said:
How can you act in a civil manner with a guy who wished "holy hell" upon HRC, Schiff, Tish, etc. because they did their jobs?
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Oh I agree with you 100%, but I'm mainly just letting him know that he's an unimaginable imbecile if he thinks that 1. he interacts with anyone civilly on this board, and 2. if he thinks that I'm ever going to respond thoughtfully or with civility to posts like the one he made toward me last night at midnight on this thread.

I've been on this board for more than a decade and I have had positive, respectful interactions with 99.99% of everyone who has ever posted here. When I've been out of line in my responses to folks on occasion, I've publicly apologized. I've got zero problem admitting fault. I have never, ever had as many consistently negative interactions with anyone on any message board ever as I've had with that dude.

I've got no background in medicine or psychology, but if that dude ain't a bright red flashing warning sign for needing some sort of psychiatric intervention in his life, I don't know who is. He has become completely and utterly unhinged over the last 3 weeks. Not sure what happened in his life, but I don't really care, either. All I know is he's not going to lob grenades at me and then curl into the fetal position and whine and cry about how nobody is civil or respectful to him. I've got no problems dropping the gloves.
 
Mundial said:
I disagree in that (i) Putin will have been rewarded by Trump for this invasion, (ii) there is a significant chance that he will feel emboldened by Trump's public declaration that the US will do nothing if Europe is attacked, (iii) such aggression directly threatens Europe and in my view the UK and (iv) the combined armies of Germany, France, the UK, and Poland (not to mention the rest of NATO other than the US) would be able to crush and drive out Russia from Ukranian territory in a matter of weeks.

So I think that there is a chance that you are wrong in that Europe may determine that it faces an existential crisis and act accordingly just like Israel does in the middle east when facing such threats except that the combined European armies are much more powerful.

So something along the lines of such European alliance forcing Russia out and restoring Ukraine's borders and establishing a DMZ along the border akin to North/South Korea. In my view they possibly seize/blockage Kaliningrad as an unacceptable security risk behind the line. Russia would then have to decide if nuclear escalation is worth it. I think it is improbable given how much Putin and his oligarchs love money and the good life.
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Following up on above, I think there may be more of this view that this is an existential crisis for Europe that transcends almost every other consideration (e.g., energy, demographics, etc.):


"This year's foreign policy declaration is presented at a difficult time in terms of security policy. We - Sweden, the EU, and NATO - are in a long-term and far-reaching confrontation with Russia. Russia will continue to pose a serious threat to security in Europe, regardless of the outcome of the war in Ukraine. Our task is unavoidable: we must confront Russia's ability to harm us, not least by supporting Ukraine,” Stenergard said.
 
mynameisbond said:
Thanks for adding detail to the scope of the discussion. Change "a" to "another" for greater clarity.
I don't see Putin withdrawing Russia's threats against NATO membership for Ukraine as part of a deal.
I'd LOVE to be wrong. Zelensky wants in.
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Why does putin get to decide if Ukraine joins NATO? Has Ukraine or NATO threatened to invade Russia or anyone?
 
uncmba said:
If Trump is able to get a deal and end this war then the world is in a better place. However, can he do it without selling out the Ukrainians? So far it’s not looking good.
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BillOfRights said:
Why does putin get to decide if Ukraine joins NATO? Has Ukraine or NATO threatened to invade Russia or anyone?
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Whatever Putin wants the opposite should be done. But our President has been Putin’s bitch for years so…
 
These fucking idiots and their "Golden Calf" Drumph (a recently immigrant family from Germany along with his overlord tender from Apartheid Escapees from South Africa) fElon are hoping that nobody pays attention to their fuckery! Anyone here with a degree from UNC or the 16 campuses and community colleges need to use their own intelligence to stop this fucking Idiocracy like president. For God's sake you do have a brain and hopefully some ability to be rational.
Just saying.....
 


IMG_5018.jpeg


The message Putin has pretty clearly heard is that Russia will be held accountable for nothing.
 
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