"Cop City" prepares to open in Atlanta

  • Thread starter Thread starter ZZLPHeels
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ZZLPHeels said:
Part of the reason that SWAT teams were involved was due to the violence exhibited by some of the opponents. An officer was shot by one, contractors who worked on the project had their equipment burned, potentially lethal booby traps were hidden in the woods that could have killed construction workers, etc.
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The SWAT raid I’m talking about was on people who were helping raise bail money and hire attorneys. They weren’t involved in, accused of or charged with any violence. It was blatant intimidation.
 
BlooVooDoo said:
I’m all for police getting more training in deescalation; recognizing likely mental health issues, etc. I’ve seen nothing that makes me think that’s going to be a point of emphasis here. I don’t have a problem with the standard police training that will likely be the bread and butter of this facility. It’s a necessity. I do think those who were against it due to the price tag and how authorities appeared to have subverted legitimate efforts to oppose it have a legitimate beef. Likewise those who were arrested (by SWAT teams no less) for raising money for bail and legal aid for protesters charged with crimes.
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Can I add one more thing to the training list? Dealing with people who have severe cognitive deficiencies.

If my son ever has to deal with a police officer his life will be at risk because he doesn’t have the capacity to know what a police officer is or how to follow the officers instructions.

If my son ever got abused or killed by an officer I would give up my life to end his life.

News reports are filled with such occurrences and the officers usually escape without punishment.
 
ZZLPHeels said:
Multiplied times thousands of journeys each year. Would you rather have cops who never actually get to train?
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Right because rural officers are never trained.

Also it is well known that police in the US are trained to view the public as a mortal threat to their own safety. Most training operates under this assumption. It is counterproductive and creates an unnecessary adversarial relationship between police and the public. There have been ex police officers who have spoken against this.

Also, a compound is not the place to train officers in community policing, how to deescalate and deal with those who have emotional or cognitive issues. You need a compound to train for war. That is what policing in America has become.
 
ChapelHillSooner said:
Right because rural officers are never trained.

Also it is well known that police in the US are trained to view the public as a mortal threat to their own safety. Most training operates under this assumption. It is counterproductive and creates an unnecessary adversarial relationship between police and the public. There have been ex police officers who have spoken against this.

Also, a compound is not the place to train officers in community policing, how to deescalate and deal with those who have emotional or cognitive issues. You need a compound to train for war. That is what policing in America has become.
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Is Atlanta rural? When did that happen?

The Atlanta Fire Department and the Atlanta Police Department currently do not have functioning training facilities. This is a major problem for a city that size. Sending thousands of people hours away for required training is horrifically expensive and places an undue burden on them.

The training facility includes classrooms for Paramedics, Firefighters and Police Officers. It contains state of the art sim labs. It contains a driving course. A burn building. Stables for the horses. A 911 dispatch training center. And a mock city for fire and police to use. This may be hard to believe, but responders in urban areas benefit from training in facilities meant to mimic urban areas. And this may be even harder to believe, but bad things have happened in Atlanta and could happen there again, and it would be better for the residents and visitors in Atlanta if the people who respond when those bad things happen are adequately trained.
 
ZZLPHeels said:
Is Atlanta rural? When did that happen?

The Atlanta Fire Department and the Atlanta Police Department currently do not have functioning training facilities. This is a major problem for a city that size. Sending thousands of people hours away for required training is horrifically expensive and places an undue burden on them.

The training facility includes classrooms for Paramedics, Firefighters and Police Officers. It contains state of the art sim labs. It contains a driving course. A burn building. Stables for the horses. A 911 dispatch training center. And a mock city for fire and police to use. This may be hard to believe, but responders in urban areas benefit from training in facilities meant to mimic urban areas. And this may be even harder to believe, but bad things have happened in Atlanta and could happen there again, and it would be better for the residents and visitors in Atlanta if the people who respond when those bad things happen are adequately trained.
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I never said Atlanta was rural. I am saying that sending officers two hours for training is normal. Rural areas do that by necessity.

Considering that most police academies are residential programs the travel costs are minimal.

But that all is beside the point. Police training in the US is broken as it trains officers to view the public as adversaries. The primary focus is often on all the ways the public can be a threat to the officer’s well being. That doesn’t produce quality police officers. It produces people who look at the job as if they are going to war. These aren’t my words. They are the words of people in the police force.

So you can understand the public’s reaction to a new training compound that most likely will just perpetuate the broken training system.
 
ChapelHillSooner said:
Can I add one more thing to the training list? Dealing with people who have severe cognitive deficiencies.

If my son ever has to deal with a police officer his life will be at risk because he doesn’t have the capacity to know what a police officer is or how to follow the officers instructions.

If my son ever got abused or killed by an officer I would give up my life to end his life.

News reports are filled with such occurrences and the officers usually escape without punishment.
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I want to take back what I said in the second to last paragraph.

I don’t know what I would do if a policeman shot and killed my son while he sat playing with a toy car like they did to the guy in Florida or if they tackled him like they did with the kid in the park stemming with a blade of grass (because clearly he was on drugs) which is a behavior my son exhibits.

I would work within the law to make sure the officer paid as much of a price as possible. I would not take matters into my own hands.

My comment there is as a combination of being utterly pissed about today’s game while remembering the abuses perpetuated by officers who clearly lacked the common sense or intelligence to do their jobs.

My wife has help train Orange and Chatham county officers on recognizing and dealing with people with special needs. But that shit should be a part of the normal police training protocols not something the local Autism society has to provide.

But again, the two incidents I mentioned point to the systemic problems in policing. They see a black man sitting on stairs with an object and assume he has a gun because they are trained to view the public as a mortal threat. They see a kid laying on the park shaking a leaf of grass in front of his face and they see a person high on some drug. These guys may be terrible policemen but they are doing exactly what we train them to do - look at the public with suspicion so anyone acting out of the ordinary is clearly a threat to the public.

I remember talking to people in the Netherlands and their officers have to have a full year of training before they can actually do police work. And since their society isn’t awash with guns they are not trained to always view the public as a threat.
 
ChapelHillSooner said:
I never said Atlanta was rural. I am saying that sending officers two hours for training is normal. Rural areas do that by necessity.

Considering that most police academies are residential programs the travel costs are minimal.

But that all is beside the point. Police training in the US is broken as it trains officers to view the public as adversaries. The primary focus is often on all the ways the public can be a threat to the officer’s well being. That doesn’t produce quality police officers. It produces people who look at the job as if they are going to war. These aren’t my words. They are the words of people in the police force.

So you can understand the public’s reaction to a new training compound that most likely will just perpetuate the broken training system.
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Sending officers two hours for training is not normal. It may be normal for specialized classes, but it is not normal for routine training. Some rural areas may do that by necessity, but Atlanta is not a rural area.

Most police academies are not residential. Only a few are. The only residential academy in North Carolina belongs to the NCSHP. Atlanta does not have a residential academy and couldn't even if they wanted to because their training center was condemned.

With regard to your statement about the police viewing the public as adversaries, unfortunately that can be true at times and unfortunately that training can be accurate at times (see: Greensboro this week). Over the past several years there has been a major shift at increased deescalation training, but you need an actual building to be able to put on these classes. And your officers still need to be trained in hand to hand combat, weapons, etc. for when things go wrong, because things do go wrong. Officers don't need to be trained in civil unrest or combat? Look at what happened in Atlanta in 2020 when armed gangs took over much of the city and murdered a little girl. Remember the bombing at the Olympics? Familiar with the concept of active shooters? They don't have the luxury of saying, "this won't happen here again, we don't need to train on it."

Atlanta is a major city, and major cities tend to have major hazards. The fact that a city the size of Atlanta did not have a suitable, non-condemnted training facility for its firefighters, paramedics, or police officers was unacceptable. Thankfully, this facility fixes all of that and Atlanta will be safer as a result.
 
ChapelHillSooner said:
I want to take back what I said in the second to last paragraph.

I don’t know what I would do if a policeman shot and killed my son while he sat playing with a toy car like they did to the guy in Florida or if they tackled him like they did with the kid in the park stemming with a blade of grass (because clearly he was on drugs) which is a behavior my son exhibits.

I would work within the law to make sure the officer paid as much of a price as possible. I would not take matters into my own hands.

My comment there is as a combination of being utterly pissed about today’s game while remembering the abuses perpetuated by officers who clearly lacked the common sense or intelligence to do their jobs.

My wife has help train Orange and Chatham county officers on recognizing and dealing with people with special needs. But that shit should be a part of the normal police training protocols not something the local Autism society has to provide.

But again, the two incidents I mentioned point to the systemic problems in policing. They see a black man sitting on stairs with an object and assume he has a gun because they are trained to view the public as a mortal threat. They see a kid laying on the park shaking a leaf of grass in front of his face and they see a person high on some drug. These guys may be terrible policemen but they are doing exactly what we train them to do - look at the public with suspicion so anyone acting out of the ordinary is clearly a threat to the public.

I remember talking to people in the Netherlands and their officers have to have a full year of training before they can actually do police work. And since their society isn’t awash with guns they are not trained to always view the public as a threat.
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Reading this reminds me of the Elijah McClain tragedy.
 
farce© said:
Th

The avatar makes it suspicious
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the post count suggests that this account has to have been active a while. since i do not recognize the name, and i think i would have after 1800 posts, it has to be an established poster under a new name.
 
ZenMode said:
Link?
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Police staged a Swat-style raid on Wednesday on the Atlanta Solidarity Fund (ASF), arresting three of its members. The fund, operating in Atlanta since 2017, has helped some of the 42 protesters so far facing charges linked to protests against Cop City, nearly all of whom have been bailed out.

www.theguardian.com

‘Cop City’ protest lawyers challenge use of domestic terrorism statute

Attorneys for protester argue law is unconstitutional restraint on free speech as legal defense fund organizers also arrested
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
 
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