CURRENT EVENTS July 31-Sept 27

  • Thread starter Thread starter nycfan
  • Start date Start date
  • Replies: 3K
  • Views: 61K
  • Politics 
Status
Not open for further replies.
“We put the Bible back in our history standards," Walters said ...

Oh No Lol GIF by Lifetime
Myth and superstition is so much more important than truth and knowledge.

Maybe this will be sufficient reason to treat the Bible and other so called holy texts like the Greek and Roman myths like they belong to be. All are antithetical for the most part to a civilized and educated democracy.
 
Myth and superstition is so much more important than truth and knowledge.

Maybe this will be sufficient reason to treat the Bible and other so called holy texts like the Greek and Roman myths like they belong to be. All are antithetical for the most part to a civilized and educated democracy.
Unfortunately, I suspect that's the exact opposite of what Walter's intended with that comment.

I would disagree the Bible (or any other ancient texts) are "antithetical" to an educated democracy. I think they have an important role in our understanding of historical anthropology and, to some extent, ancient history. But they OBVIOUSLY cannot be used as verbatim historical texts. That's never what they were intended to be, even when they were written/edited over time. And yet, I'm sure that's exactly how Walter intends to teach the Bible to Oklahoma children, whether they want it or not.
 

Cool story. And Obama WAS relieved to get a 2.0% third quarter GDP estimate in October. He would have been more relieved had he known the second and third estimates for the third quarter in 2012 would increase it to 2.7% and then 3.1% …



 

Trump and Schumer couldn’t clinch a deal. Now a shutdown hangs in the balance.​

Ahead of a critical spending showdown, the two leaders' relationship is almost nonexistent.


“… The president pulled the plug on a possible deal to confirm some administration nominees, while the Senate’s top Democrat — under pressure from his party to take a tougher stand — boasted afterward that Trump came away with nothing.

Now, the two men are headed toward a fall rematch with much higher stakes: whether to keep the federal government open past a Sept. 30 funding deadline.

… Schumer and Democrats demanded that Trump unfreeze congressionally approved spending in return for consenting to the swift approval of some nominees. Trump would not pay the price.

… He [Schumer] kept the heat on Monday, joining with House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries to demand a so-called four corners meeting with Thune and Johnson to discuss a government funding strategy lest a government shutdown hit Oct. 1. (Republicans, who accuse Schumer of “breaking” the funding process, haven’t responded.)…”
 
Unfortunately, I suspect that's the exact opposite of what Walter's intended with that comment.

I would disagree the Bible (or any other ancient texts) are "antithetical" to an educated democracy. I think they have an important role in our understanding of historical anthropology and, to some extent, ancient history. But they OBVIOUSLY cannot be used as verbatim historical texts. That's never what they were intended to be, even when they were written/edited over time. And yet, I'm sure that's exactly how Walter intends to teach the Bible to Oklahoma children, whether they want it or not.
What insight into either anthropology or history does it give? It's a collection of myths and exaggerations that have almost no substantiating evidence. There's no evidence supporting a captivity in Egypt or an Exodus or a covenant concerning a Promised Land. There's no evidence of Moses , we know the Creation story is bunkum and that the whole Christian story was corrupted by Paul and coopted by white people. And, fwiw, if the stories in the Gospels are to be believed ( a dubious idea at best) while Jesus might have attested to the validity of the OT, no one of any comparable standing has or can attest to the validity of either the NT or of the process by which it was compiled.
 
What insight into either anthropology or history does it give? It's a collection of myths and exaggerations that have almost no substantiating evidence. There's no evidence supporting a captivity in Egypt or an Exodus or a covenant concerning a Promised Land. There's no evidence of Moses , we know the Creation story is bunkum and that the whole Christian story was corrupted by Paul and coopted by white people. And, fwiw, if the stories in the Gospels are to be believed ( a dubious idea at best) while Jesus might have attested to the validity of the OT, no one of any comparable standing has or can attest to the validity of either the NT or of the process by which it was compiled.
Don't really want to get into a deep discussion of this but, like most ancient texts, the Bible tells us a great deal about the people who were responsible for creating it and their attempts to understand the world around them. Those questions are pretty much at the core of historical anthropology. Legitimate anthropologists and historians know not to read the Bible (or any other ancient texts) as literal historical accounts, and even the elements that do give us some insight into history (such as the Babylonian conquest of the Levant, which indisputably did happen) must be read through the lens of what the writers were trying to achieve. But it seems to me to be a pretty extreme view to say that ancient texts should not inform our civic and democratic education just because they're not historically reliable. They tell us a lot about the history of humankind, and that's important for us to understand.
 
Those "ancient" texts were not compiled until the Babylonian captivity which is pretty much where they stumbled on the whole lawgiver element. The Code of Hammurabi is just the most famous of many legal codes from there and the OT borrowed very heavily from many of the concepts in putting the stories together. I doubt if there is much that rises above the level of folktales. Anthropological evidence doesn't provide much support for anything that the Bible say and if any time period and place has ever been more thoroughly searched and studied, I'd love to know when and where. The damned science was virtually invented for that purpose.
 
Those "ancient" texts were not compiled until the Babylonian captivity which is pretty much where they stumbled on the whole lawgiver element. The Code of Hammurabi is just the most famous of many legal codes from there and the OT borrowed very heavily from many of the concepts in putting the stories together. I doubt if there is much that rises above the level of folktales. Anthropological evidence doesn't provide much support for anything that the Bible say and if any time period and place has ever been more thoroughly searched and studied, I'd love to know when and where. The damned science was virtually invented for that purpose.
You and I probably end up at the same conclusion...that the Bible has little to no place in primary or secondary public education...but we take different routes. I disagree that there is not significant importance to be found in the Bible, but I also believe that of other religious texts such as the Qur'an. I think this is true because so much of civilization as we know it today has been shaped by these books in one way or another. However, I think that a reasonable discussion of these topics with comparisons and discourse is not possible in any elementary/primary settings and exceptionally unlikely in most secondary/high school settings. Therefore, I think such topics should be left to higher education at least for now. Honestly, too many people would be too dug in to having the texts taught as dogma rather than as historical documents for me to believe they have a place in public education right now.

Even fiction serves to shape civilization and we teach historical fiction for that very reason. The issue, to me, with religious texts is not that they are factual nor that they are fiction. The issue with them in most classrooms is the visceral and unavoidable disagreement as to which category they fall.
 
Who else is in the running this year for the Peace prize? Should be a no brainer.
If they nominate him it will not be because he deserves it, it will be in the same transactional light as Paramount caving to the trump extortion to save their merger.
 
You and I probably end up at the same conclusion...that the Bible has little to no place in primary or secondary public education...but we take different routes. I disagree that there is not significant importance to be found in the Bible, but I also believe that of other religious texts such as the Qur'an. I think this is true because so much of civilization as we know it today has been shaped by these books in one way or another. However, I think that a reasonable discussion of these topics with comparisons and discourse is not possible in any elementary/primary settings and exceptionally unlikely in most secondary/high school settings. Therefore, I think such topics should be left to higher education at least for now. Honestly, too many people would be too dug in to having the texts taught as dogma rather than as historical documents for me to believe they have a place in public education right now.

Even fiction serves to shape civilization and we teach historical fiction for that very reason. The issue, to me, with religious texts is not that they are factual nor that they are fiction. The issue with them in most classrooms is the visceral and unavoidable disagreement as to which category they fall.
Maybe we should discuss the problems created by how these shaped civilization?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top