FBI moves to criminalize Habitat for Humanity, other groups

rodoheel said:
What he means is that the only HFH money targeted is money that came from the EPA.
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Oh. Got it. I don't think you and I are disagreeing. I think I'm disagreeing with the people that think Trump went after habitat for humanity because Trump doesn't want poor people to have houses for free or doesn't want Jimmy Carter to have a legacy or whatever other theories that they came up with.
 
gtyellowjacket said:
Certainly not. I can guess what happened. There were certain grants through the EPA that someone at Habitat's administrative offices applied for. Let's say it was solar panels on roofs or some sort of sustainable wood or whatever. The organization met some of the criteria but not all and whoever was filling out the form said close enough, no one will ever check. And then they signed it right below the section that said it's a federal crime to lie on this application.

And they were probably right for however many years they had been in that office but at some point there were some marching orders from Trump or Bondi or Patel or whoever to say make sure all these organizations cross the t's and dot the i's specifically on these green energy grants.

If that is what happened, is charging them right? I don't know. If it is what happened, they broke the law. They misappropriated taxpayer funds. But habitat for humanity does a heck of a lot of good. Some of these other organizations may or may not be grift shops but I hate to see habitat get caught up in it.
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Are you really fucking trying to sanesplane this bullshit.

I don't give a fuck if you are even remotely right, habitat for humanity is a great organization. There is no justification for this stupidity.

Do you ever get tired of having no convictions and riding that fence so hard? My only guess is you're trying to justify your trump vote.

Just own it and stand proud on the bow of this sinking ship.
 
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gtyellowjacket said:
Okay. You've been pretty clear that there is no possible way that the FBI would be able to uncover substantial evidence in 2 months to file to freeze a bank account. What's your expertise in this area?
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I have a law degree, I am familiar with the requirements of due process, I have clients who have been involved in audits, I have clients with governmental contracts, I have served on the board of trustees for a governmental organization that receives grant money from various sources.

Also, apparently unlike you, I have actually been paying attention to everything the Trump admin has been saying and doing over the past two weeks, and have the mental capacity to, as the kids say, "put two and two together."
 
Here's a fun game to play. Go find a white-collar criminal defense attorney, tell them that you think the current DOJ, in the middle of a weekslong purge of "disloyal" employees and public legal fights about the same, managed to assign, conduct, oversee, decide about action for, get legal approval for, and execute a freeze of bank assets with respect to a fraud investigation spanning a couple dozen different government grant recipients, all in the space of a few weeks. Tell me how long it takes them to stop laughing.
 
gtyellowjacket said:
I definitely agree that there is a political motive to going after the green energy grants. I don't think there's a political motive for going after habitat for humanity.
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Hell as petty as trump is he could be mad that President Carter loved and worked for Habitat.

You're crazy if you don't believe there could be a political motive.
 
rodoheel said:
Have you ever been part of any form of audit or investigation in your life? Whether through accounting firm, consultant, government, etc? There is absolutely no way to do this, in any sort of rational way, in this timeframe. None. At least not with giving any sort of due process to the recipient - like asking it to address some purported inconsistency. Without even getting into the fact that the Trump admin is clearly so busy firing and reassigning a ton of people that the idea that this work could have been assigned, completed, reviewed, etc within a few weeks is absurd.

Do you have even the remotest desire to understand how any of this works? And do you even care that there is a much more obvious and simple explanation, that is entirely consistent with everything else the admin is doing, staring you in the face?
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Exactly. I've participated in multiple audits a year for the past two decades, they are brutally slow and detailed. And the ones I participate in are FDA and those types of regulatory bodies, I imagine that financial audits are harder.
 
rodoheel said:
Have you ever been part of any form of audit or investigation in your life? Whether through accounting firm, consultant, government, etc? There is absolutely no way to do this, in any sort of rational way, in this timeframe. None. At least not with giving any sort of due process to the recipient - like asking it to address some purported inconsistency. Without even getting into the fact that the Trump admin is clearly so busy firing and reassigning a ton of people that the idea that this work could have been assigned, completed, reviewed, etc within a few weeks is absurd.

Do you have even the remotest desire to understand how any of this works? And do you even care that there is a much more obvious and simple explanation, that is entirely consistent with everything else the admin is doing, staring you in the face?
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Occam's razor.
 
rodoheel said:
I have a law degree, I am familiar with the requirements of due process, I have clients who have been involved in audits, I have clients with governmental contracts, I have served on the board of trustees for a governmental organization that receives grant money from various sources.

Also, apparently unlike you, I have actually been paying attention to everything the Trump admin has been saying and doing over the past two weeks, and have the mental capacity to, as the kids say, "put two and two together."
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I'm sure you know quite a bit more me than me but if only experts are allowed to speculate on the length of the investigation, I would have expected a background in investigation of financial fraud. Did you forget to mention that you were an FBI agent or a treasury agent or anything that would definitively qualify you to speculate? You set a pretty high standard so I want to make sure that you meet it before you're allowed to comment.
 
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rodoheel said:
I have a law degree, I am familiar with the requirements of due process, I have clients who have been involved in audits, I have clients with governmental contracts, I have served on the board of trustees for a governmental organization that receives grant money from various sources.

Also, apparently unlike you, I have actually been paying attention to everything the Trump admin has been saying and doing over the past two weeks, and have the mental capacity to, as the kids say, "put two and two together."
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Case closed.

Bailiff take GT into custody. :cool:
 
gtyellowjacket said:
I'm sure you know quite a bit more me than me but if only experts are allowed to speculate on the length of the investigation, I would have expected a background in investigation of financial fraud. Did you forget to mention that you were an FBI agent or a treasury agent or anything that would definitively qualify you to speculate? You set pretty high standard so I want to make sure that you meet it before you're allowed to comment.
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Hey if you could point to anywhere I said "only experts are allowed to speculate" that would be great. All I said was that you should have some modicum of knowledge about the subject before you make up a convoluted hypothetical out of thin air to explain something that is clearly very simple.
 
gtyellowjacket said:
I'm sure you know quite a bit more me than me but if only experts are allowed to speculate on the length of the investigation, I would have expected a background in investigation of financial fraud. Did you forget to mention that you were an FBI agent or a treasury agent or anything that would definitively qualify you to speculate? You set pretty high standard so I want to make sure that you meet it before you're allowed to comment.
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rodoheel said:
Here's a fun game to play. Go find a white-collar criminal defense attorney, tell them that you think the current DOJ, in the middle of a weekslong purge of "disloyal" employees and public legal fights about the same, managed to assign, conduct, oversee, decide about action for, get legal approval for, and execute a freeze of bank assets with respect to a fraud investigation spanning a couple dozen different government grant recipients, all in the space of a few weeks. Tell me how long it takes them to stop laughing.
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And yet it happened or possibly they started the investigation before the few weeks. I suppose either is possible.

If the instigation was not sufficient, I'm sure the courts will provide the charities a remedy. But at least some investigation occurred to even figure out who the charities were.
 
rodoheel said:
Hey if you could point to anywhere I said "only experts are allowed to speculate" that would be great. All I said was that you should have some modicum of knowledge about the subject before you make up a convoluted hypothetical out of thin air to explain something that is clearly very simple.
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I have a modicum of knowledge about the subject. That's a pretty low bar. I assume everyone else who has made a comment does too.
 
UNCatTech said:
Are you really fucking trying to sanesplane th8s bullshit.

I don't give a fuck if you are even remotely right, habitat for humanity is a great organization. There is no justification for this stupidity.

Do you ever get tired of having no convictions and riding that fence so hard? My only guess is you're trying to justify your trump vote.

Just own it and stand proud on the bow of this sinking ship.
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I didn't vote for Trump. I voted for a Democrat for president in every election since I was 18 with the exception of one vote for the green party. I don't need to justify a trump vote because I have never dreamed of voting for Trump.

My intention was to explain a possible scenario of why the FBI wanted to freeze the assets of charities that didn't include Trump hating habitat for humanity.
 
gtyellowjacket said:
I didn't vote for Trump. I voted for a Democrat for president in every election since I was 18 with the exception of one vote for the green party. I don't need to justify a trump vote because I have never dreamed of voting for Trump.

My intention was to explain a possible scenario of why the FBI wanted to freeze the assets of charities that didn't include Trump hating habitat for humanity.
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Ok, sorry for accusing you of voting for trump.

But, why? Why try to justify any of the crazy from this administration?
 
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