Gavin Newsom addresses the nation

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Again, so fucking what?

There isn’t really a way to fight back against Trumpism that wouldn’t qualify as a publicity stunt.
Court cases

Protests

Public Relations campaigns, including media interviews and social media coordination

Rallies

Political speeches in Congress and in public

There are a lot of ways to influence public opinion. Political movements like the Tea Party, Me Too, Black Lives Matter, Anti-Vietnam War, Civil Rights, etc. did not rely on things like Alex Padilla crashing a Kristi Noem press conference to "just ask some questions."

Alex Padilla is not doing anything to weaken Trump. Not. A. Thing. Some of the people on this board are so gullible. You play right into performance politics.
 
You could say, "good point," instead of that passive-aggressive non-response.

The Selma March was in fact a big event, much bigger than Alex Padilla. True. On the other hand, it was much, much more difficult in those days to get peoples' attention with a solo act. You needed huge crowds because there was no such thing as going viral.

But if you prefer a different example, how about the monks who burned themselves alive over Vietnam?

All politics is about getting attention. If that wasn't true throughout history, it sure as hell is true now.
If it were a good point, I would have said good point.

Again, if you think what Alex Padilla did is comparable to self immolation, I can't help you. Now, if Alex wants to set himself on fire to protest, then I'll say he has moved beyond cheap political stunts.
 
Court cases

Protests

Public Relations campaigns, including media interviews and social media coordination

Rallies

Political speeches in Congress and in public

There are a lot of ways to influence public opinion. Political movements like the Tea Party, Me Too, Black Lives Matter, Anti-Vietnam War, Civil Rights, etc. did not rely on things like Alex Padilla crashing a Kristi Noem press conference to "just ask some questions."

Alex Padilla is not doing anything to weaken Trump. Not. A. Thing. Some of the people on this board are so gullible. You play right into performance politics.
Please tell us what Dems should be doing to oppose Trump in an effective way. Telling us what you think won’t work doesn’t count.
 
If it were a good point, I would have said good point.

Again, if you think there is something comparable to self immolation and what Alex Padilla did, I can't help you. Now, if Alex wants to set himself on fire to protest, then I'll say he has moved beyond cheap political stunts.
Ah, so you've moved the goalposts. Before it was a political stunt that you were criticizing. Now your complaint is about the "cheapness" of it all. Not sure what that term is supposed to mean exactly, or how one distinguishes a cheap political stunt from a legit political stunt.

Is Alex Padilla going to be as effective as the March on Washington.? Well, duh. But they are fundamentally doing the same thing on different scales.

As you have said yourself, Trump is spoiling for a fight on the streets, for an excuse to invoke the Insurrection Act. So maybe a March isn't the best idea for the moment. Maybe Senators getting arrested (which can't remotely be described as insurrection) is a better idea.
 
Please tell us what Dems should be doing to oppose Trump in an effective way. Telling us what you think won’t work doesn’t count.
I literally just listed 5-6 things they should be doing and are in fact doing in the post you are responding to.
 
Court cases

Protests

Public Relations campaigns, including media interviews and social media coordination

Rallies

Political speeches in Congress and in public

There are a lot of ways to influence public opinion. Political movements like the Tea Party, Me Too, Black Lives Matter, Anti-Vietnam War, Civil Rights, etc. did not rely on things like Alex Padilla crashing a Kristi Noem press conference to "just ask some questions."

Alex Padilla is not doing anything to weaken Trump. Not. A. Thing. Some of the people on this board are so gullible. You play right into performance politics.

No, but I'd put @EyeballKid and @dukeman92 at the top of the list. I could probably come up with a top 10 pretty quickly from just this thread. So many thirsty people for performance art.
Dude, you continue to misconstrue my position.

Apparently you lost the plot with your one-man crusade against Newsom and haven’t looked back since.
 
I will say, I accidentally sent an earlier version of a reply I typed out to Snoop. My edited reply differs a good bit, but the idea is still the same.

At any rate, I’ll try to respond to your post.

I appreciate that you at least partially agree there’s value in engaging conservative or right-leaning voters, even if it’s not always about flipping them. But I think your post ultimately reveals the limits of the framework you’re working within, especially the way it flattens conservative voters into caricatures and substitutes a moral diagnosis for a political strategy.

You say it’s not “convenient” to reduce MAGA to hate and xenophobia because it’s based on what you see and what the studies say. But you’re not treating these studies as data points to think with, you’re using them as moral proof texts. You’re assuming that correlation is destiny, that because racial resentment correlates with Trump support, it must be the core driver for every voter in that camp, and that it therefore forecloses serious political engagement.

What makes that even more contradictory is that you then turn around and say we should be appearing on Fox News to “plant seeds.” Why would we plant seeds among a population that, by your own account, is incapable of recognizing human decency or responding to anything but grievance? Either these voters are emotionally reachable or they’re not. You can’t write them off as morally depraved and politically unreachable in paragraph two and then tell us it’s “low cost” and “worth a shot” to try to reach them in paragraph one.

What’s going on here isn’t really a political strategy so much as it’s branding. You want Democrats to appear open-minded and decent to people who, in your telling, are beyond reason. That’s not a political plan. That’s reputational damage control for professional-class liberals who are uncomfortable being seen as aloof. You’re not trying to win anyone over, you’re trying to feel better about not winning them over.

And that ties into the larger problem: liberalism still doesn’t know how to process the emotional power of populism. You treat MAGA as a mass psychosis rather than as a political formation that has emotional, cultural, and economic resonance, much of which has grown in the vacuum created by decades of bipartisan neglect. You mention jobs as an “empty promise” and then act like grievance politics came out of nowhere. But maybe the promise of jobs isn’t empty to people who watched their towns collapse while both parties gave them NAFTA and Walmart.

You say, “What positive thing does MAGA offer?” The answer is belonging. Narrative. Identity. A sense of being seen. It’s not just “hate” any more than the appeal of Obama was just “hope.” The left will never understand how to defeat that until it understands how it works. And that begins with refusing to treat half the country like they’re too poisoned to ever matter politically.

People’s political identity isn’t genetically hardwired. If we cede that emotional ground to the right, they will keep winning it.
1. That's not my assumption. That's your assumption about my assumptions. I do not believe that every single person in that camp shares the same views. but the vast majority do. That's why I simultaneously say, "let's talk to them" (which would be pointless if I believed they were all haters through and through) and "plant seeds."

2. The KKK also offered a great sense of belonging. You want to give them a way of belonging to a multiracial, diverse group, presumably aligned along class lines.

That's great and all, but Tom Hayden had the same ideas and laid them out at Port Huron. That was like 60 years ago.
 
Ah, so you've moved the goalposts. Before it was a political stunt that you were criticizing. Now your complaint is about the "cheapness" of it all. Not sure what that term is supposed to mean exactly, or how one distinguishes a cheap political stunt from a legit political stunt.

Is Alex Padilla going to be as effective as the March on Washington.? Well, duh. But they are fundamentally doing the same thing on different scales.

As you have said yourself, Trump is spoiling for a fight on the streets, for an excuse to invoke the Insurrection Act. So maybe a March isn't the best idea for the moment. Maybe Senators getting arrested (which can't remotely be described as insurrection) is a better idea.
Exposing yourself to police canines, batons and water canons as you cross the Edmund Pettus bridge to shame racist cops is not just a difference of scale from Alex Padilla crashing a Kristy Noem press conference.

Honestly, it is offensive to even juxtapose the bravery of those marchers with the self-promotion of Padilla.
 
Exposing yourself to police canines, batons and water canons as you cross the Edmund Pettus bridge to shame racist cops is not just a difference of scale from Alex Padilla crashing a Kristy Noem press conference.

Honestly, it is offensive to even juxtapose the bravery of those marchers with the self-promotion of Padilla.
That would be a good point if we were comparing their bravery. We are talking about whether publicity-gathering is intrinsic to politics. I contend that it is, and you dissemble with nonsense deflections.
 
Dude, you continue to misconstrue my position.

Apparently you lost the plot with your one-man crusade against Newsom and haven’t looked back since.
My plot has been consistent throughout.

I don't think phony politicians who opportunistically try to grab the spotlight are doing anything to help the cause. In fact, I think they do nothing but strengthen Trump's hold on the middle of America.

Do you honestly think Padilla is scoring points with Middle America by storming a Kristy Noem press conference? Do you think that is hurting Trump in even the slightest?
 
That would be a good point if we were comparing their bravery. We are talking about whether publicity-gathering is intrinsic to politics. I contend that it is, and you dissemble with nonsense deflections.
So who is moving the goalposts now?

Kingpin asked if Padilla was engaging in a publicity stunt. I answered.

Now you are talking about "publicity gathering."

You typically don't engage in bad faith arguing so I'll cut you a little slack. But again, for you to compare the Selma marches with Alex Padilla is absurd. And you obviously know the difference between a cheap political stunt and a publicity "gathering" .
 
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