How long

BillOfRights

BillOfRights

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How long will it take to rebuild America into the country it once was? My children will live their lives in a diminished version of what we once were. Will America get back to the imperfect but still great country we once were in time for them to enjoy it?

It took years to recover economically from COVID, and we are probably not there yet. How long will it take to recover from the economic damage of the trump years? The tax policy, the debt, the job losses, the lack of business vitality, the diminished economic growth caused by tariffs?

How long until the bottom 50% can get back to level?

How long until we regain our soft power and influence around the world?

How long until other countries trust our intelligence services again?

How long until we can trust SCOTUS?

How long until we can trust the federal government's data?

How long will it take to reverse the loss of intitutional knowledge, expertise, and the brain drain caused by DOGE, destroying our scientific and medical agencies, and the war against our great universities?

How long until we can trust ICE?

How long until we can trust our friends and neighbors again?

How long until empathy and compassion are looked upon favorably?

The damage of trump may be irreparable.
 
donbosco said:
No one here will live that long.
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I'm inclined to agree with Professor DB's assessment, disheartening as it may be.

MAGA enjoys the privilege of holding non-MAGA folks to their standards while at the same time not having to be accountable to any of their own (not that they currently have any). In fact, MAGA people get off on non-MAGA people being frustrated by pointing this out (aka, "pwning the libs"). No quantity of fact or evidence will make any difference. It's more or less, "fuck you - I just don't care" across the board.

So what does one do with that? How do you reason with a significantly large enough group of folks who not only don't care about facts, evidence, or objective reality, but they also don't want to be reasoned with?

Trumpism is a virus - for which there is no treatment, and it has to run its course before it ultimately dies out. Power breeds arrogance though, and our best hope right now may be that one of the Trump brownshirts or brownshirt leaders makes some kind of mistake that the base doesn't expect to change minds in some critical mass, though I admit that I can't quite describe what that might look like. I never expected them to, but if they don't turn on him for one of the very conspiracies which helped elect him (Epstein/QANON), then they never will. They have been indoctrinated by right-wing (and social) media to hate "the libs" more than anything Trump could do to offend their sensibilities.

I'm not saying to give up, but on a large scale it's not looking hopeful right now. On the small scale, I feel like the best thing to do is to have conversations with people one on one when the opportunity presents itself. That is the most likely scenario where someone might let his/her guard down and although you may not deprogram them there on the spot, if the conversation at least gets them thinking about things to the best of your judgment, then that's a win to me.
 
It's AI that's going to reconfigure the nature of things, not Trump or MAGA.

Given that there are multiple competing nation-states, and that it's impossible - at least for me - to envision one of them taking over the others, we're bound I think to continue with a world that where governments and social contracts on the surface looks more or less like ours. Maybe more authoritarian overall, but not I think dystopian.

I know a lot of people who want to just throw up their hands...like, a lot. But I can't afford to do that, I'm 1000% committed to making this world a better place...my kid's life experience depends on it.
 
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TarSpiel said:
It's AI that's going to reconfigure the nature of things, not Trump or MAGA.

Given that there are multiple competing nation-states, and that it's impossible - at least for me - to envision one of them taking over the others, we're bound I think to continue with a world that where governments and social contracts on the surface looks more or less like ours. Maybe more authoritarian overall, but not I think dystopian.

I know a lot of people who want to just throw up their hands...like, a lot. But I can't afford to do that, I'm 1000% committed to making this world a better place...my kid's life experience depends on it.
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AI is definitely going to present challenges. How we deal with those challenges will depend a lot on what kind of country we have.
 
BillOfRights said:
How long will it take to rebuild America into the country it once was? My children will live their lives in a diminished version of what we once were. Will America get back to the imperfect but still great country we once were in time for them to enjoy it?

It took years to recover economically from COVID, and we are probably not there yet. How long will it take to recover from the economic damage of the trump years? The tax policy, the debt, the job losses, the lack of business vitality, the diminished economic growth caused by tariffs?

How long until the bottom 50% can get back to level?

How long until we regain our soft power and influence around the world?

How long until other countries trust our intelligence services again?

How long until we can trust SCOTUS?

How long until we can trust the federal government's data?

How long will it take to reverse the loss of intitutional knowledge, expertise, and the brain drain caused by DOGE, destroying our scientific and medical agencies, and the war against our great universities?

How long until we can trust ICE?

How long until we can trust our friends and neighbors again?

How long until empathy and compassion are looked upon favorably?

The damage of trump may be irreparable.
Click to expand...
How long?

 
Purple Nurple said:
Perhaps it’s time for some sort of intelligence test, or minimum IQ, to be able to vote. Why should stupid people get an equal say so in matters they don’t understand?
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Then we could extend that line of thinking to require a minimum IQ and a working knowledge of parenting skills before people are allowed to procreate. Why should stupid or irresponsible people be allowed to litter our world with their progeny?
 
BillOfRights said:
How long will it take to rebuild America into the country it once was? My children will live their lives in a diminished version of what we once were. Will America get back to the imperfect but still great country we once were in time for them to enjoy it?

It took years to recover economically from COVID, and we are probably not there yet. How long will it take to recover from the economic damage of the trump years? The tax policy, the debt, the job losses, the lack of business vitality, the diminished economic growth caused by tariffs?

How long until the bottom 50% can get back to level?

How long until we regain our soft power and influence around the world?

How long until other countries trust our intelligence services again?

How long until we can trust SCOTUS?

How long until we can trust the federal government's data?

How long will it take to reverse the loss of intitutional knowledge, expertise, and the brain drain caused by DOGE, destroying our scientific and medical agencies, and the war against our great universities?

How long until we can trust ICE?

How long until we can trust our friends and neighbors again?

How long until empathy and compassion are looked upon favorably?

The damage of trump may be irreparable.
Click to expand...
After Trump gets done we truly will need to MAGA.
 
farce© said:
Then we could extend that line of thinking to require a minimum IQ and a working knowledge of parenting skills before people are allowed to procreate. Why should stupid or irresponsible people be allowed to litter our world with their progeny?
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I think I've recounted this story before, but old age comes with the benefit of repeating oneself.

I have a very dear law school buddy who worked in a probation department. All of the professionals in the office (lawyers, social workers, and other college and graduate school graduates) would routinely say, "I never want to bring a child into this world". On the other hand, the probationees, who frequently were on drugs and engaged in serial criminal activity, had child after child after child.

My friend's observational comment regarding the contrast between the two groups was, "Who's populating this country?"
 
America will not ever be rebuilt. The American Century is over - we are a country in decline just as all empires across history have eventually been. We have been mostly lucky to live in the most powerful country on earth but now we get to watch it unravel for the rest of our lives. Hopefully slowly, but the more people like the current guy we put in power, it will supercharge the deterioration.
 
Purple Nurple said:
Perhaps it’s time for some sort of intelligence test, or minimum IQ, to be able to vote. Why should stupid people get an equal say so in matters they don’t understand?
Click to expand...
I have a sinking feeling we'd end up with throwback tests from "Before DEI so no sexual or racial bias is involved."
 
HeelInTheOzarks said:
America will not ever be rebuilt. The American Century is over - we are a country in decline just as all empires across history have eventually been. We have been mostly lucky to live in the most powerful country on earth but now we get to watch it unravel for the rest of our lives. Hopefully slowly, but the more people like the current guy we put in power, it will supercharge the deterioration.
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I disagree. If this shit lingers for a long time, then sure. But if we get control in 2028 -- which looks increasingly likely given how much MAGA is shitting the bed -- then a lot of it can get fixed with a few changes. They will be need to be big and bold changes, but if there's a will, there's a way.

Some of the more important things, in my opinion, are:

1. Neutering the Supreme Court'
2. Amending the constitution to get rid of the unitary executive theory -- a possibility if the dem president starts doing unitary executive things.
3. 14th Amendment as fully enforceable
4. No more gerrymandering
5. Replace the Second Amendment with something considerably narrower in scope
6. Judicial reform -- a lot of it. No more life tenure. Non-partisan appointment and retention process.
7. Explicitly outlaw originalism.

But most of this can get done in one big beautiful amendment. And the Dem president can force the GOP's hand by giving them an offer they can't refuse: either they play ball and help fix these problems, or the president will use the unitary executive power to reconstruct the South on his own terms. Start arbitrarily deporting white Southerners to African countries and I'll bet they'd play ball in a hurry.
 
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