Israel Hamas War, West Bank, Etc.
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-> Israel’s Exhausted Soldiers Complicate Plans for Gaza AssaultAw, pobrecitos! Shooting Palestinian women and children is hard work.
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It would be great for rape victims if they weren't drinking and so easily taken advantage of.
ZenMode
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Right. Taken advantage of....by a rapist.
It sounds like we are in disagreement on who's at fault between the two sides of your scenario.
ZenMode
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I know you're being facetious, but it probably is mentally draining knowing that every person around you, male/female, young/old, could be looking to kill you.
Aw, pobrecitos! Shooting Palestinian women and children is hard work.
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There is some conflicting reports as to whether there is evidence that Hamas is stealing aid on a meaningful scale.
There is ample evidence that Israel is bombing hospitals and shopping malls killing innocent Gaza citizens.
But yes, it would be great if Hamas would not steal aid, and yes, it would be great if Israel would stop killing innocent Gazans.
Exclusive: USAID analysis found no evidence of massive Hamas theft of Gaza aid
An internal U.S. government analysis found no evidence of systematic theft by the Palestinian militant group Hamas of U.S.-funded humanitarian supplies, challenging the main rationale that Israel and the U.S. give for backing a new armed private aid operation.
ZenMode
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Of course. .
They have damaged portions of hospitals, churches and probably a mall. Unfortunately, Hamas fighters/leaders likes to use civilian locations to hide in.
I wonder why they would do that?
Yes, some civilians have died. That's how war works. In nearly 2 years, about 55k civilians have been killed. An average of 76/day with military weapons capable of much, much worse.
Hamas killed over 1,100 civilians in about 8 hours with handheld guns and knives.
Agree. I bet Israel would love to live next to non-crazy people who constantly attack them.
Exclusive: USAID analysis found no evidence of massive Hamas theft of Gaza aid
An internal U.S. government analysis found no evidence of systematic theft by the Palestinian militant group Hamas of U.S.-funded humanitarian supplies, challenging the main rationale that Israel and the U.S. give for backing a new armed private aid operation.www.reuters.com
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What we are in disagreement on is the responsibility of civilized people to do the right thing in the face of others being victimized. Palestinians are the unquestioned victims of this war. Period. Hamas is rhe largest cause of that, no doubt. Israel is a close second. That Hamas does not care about Palestinians does not excuse the callous actions of Israel toward them.
Hamas killed 1,195 people on October 7th, 815 of which were civilians. That’s if you believe Israel’s own estimates and believe theire were no friendly fire/Hannibal directive casualties.
Israel’s own intelligence believes that 83% of the casualties in Gaza so far have been civilians.
Revealed: Israeli military’s own data indicates civilian death rate of 83% in Gaza war
Figures from classified IDF database listed 8,900 named fighters as dead or probably dead in May, as overall death toll reached 53,000
So essentially a ragtag group of terrorists who flew homemade paragliders into Israel did a better job of avoiding civilian casualties than the most moral army in the world.
ZenMode
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I don't think we disagree, at least not as much as you may believe.
Agree.
Agree
A "close" second?
What callous actions are you referring to?
What I see is Israel being incredibly cautious with Palestinian civilian lives. This is clear not only with their actions: the fact that Israel is literally texting civilians, dropping pamphlets, calling civilians/hospitals and generally going above and beyond the actions of ANY military I've ever heard of and is also reflected the raw civilian death data after two years, which, given the environment in which the fighting is happening, seems very low.
ZenMode
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Ok, so pick a number that you "believe" to be Israelis killed by Hamas on October 7. Now, take that number and figure out how many civilians Israel would have to have killed by now if they matched the death rate of Hamas on 10/7.Hamas killed 1,195 people on October 7th, 815 of which were civilians. That’s if you believe Israel’s own estimates and believe theire were no friendly fire/Hannibal directive casualties.
Israel’s own intelligence believes that 83% of the casualties in Gaza so far have been civilians.
Revealed: Israeli military’s own data indicates civilian death rate of 83% in Gaza war
Figures from classified IDF database listed 8,900 named fighters as dead or probably dead in May, as overall death toll reached 53,000www.theguardian.com
So essentially a ragtag group of terrorists who flew homemade paragliders into Israel did a better job of avoiding civilian casualties than the most moral army in the world.
Let me know what you come up with.
I understand number are hard.
By Israel’s own numbers: 815/1195 =0.682. 68% civilian casualties.
Again by Israel’s own numbers as reported in the Guardian: 8900 Hamas fighters listed as dead or probably dead, 53,000 total Palestinians dead. That means 8900/53000 =0.168. So 16.8% of the dead are Hamas, meaning 83.2% are civilians.
ZenMode
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Numbers are very easy, but that not what I asked for.
Let's say that Israel's civilian death count is accurate for 10/7 - we'll say it was 800 civilians total. I like to use round numbers because I'm not very smart, ya know.
That happened in approximately 8 hours. So, in one day, if they were allowed to continue, unabated, for a full day (24 hours) Hamas would have killed about 2400 people. Keep in mind, that was using nothing more than handheld guns and knives and moving mostly on foot once they landed their "airplanes".
There have been approximately 692 days of fighting since 10/7/2023.
So, if Israel only matched Hamas rate of civilians deaths, despite having legit military weapons/bombs/tanks, etc, Israel would have to kill about 1,660,800 civilians by now.
They've killed about 55k.