Israel Hamas War, West Bank Settler violence

[RaiGuy]

I think you're continuing to wrongly downplay the influence of religion as it relates to Jews and Israel's existence but, until there's a 2 state solution put into place and that reality is brought to light, there's no reason to debate that. Giving Gaza complete freedom would, IMO, only bring the Islamic fundamentalists/terrorists/Jihadists closer to what I believe is their goal of wiping out Israel.

Islamic extremism/fundamentalism is reason for persecution of Christians in Pakistan. Islamic extremism/fundamentalism is why 130 students being slaughtered in Peshawar. I would argue that Islamic extremism/fundamentalism is the reason Pakistan even exists today. Civilized countries around the world are in an ongoing fight against Islamic fundamentalism/Jihadism/terrorism and it's not the moderate muslims who live in Gaza and want to go to school in Canada that are behind it. It's the extremists/Jihadists who are driven almost exclusively by their religious extremism. They're the ones who have no issue intentionally getting citizens, including women and children killed, because they believe they're helping them get to Heaven. Do you think the citizens who cheer and help to attack innocent Jewish civilian hostages aren't motivated by religious views? Do you believe that all the countries/people, including mostly other Muslims, who are victimized by Islamic extremism is due to socio-economic issues? Do you think the guy who called his family to brag about slaughtering 10 Jews and stealing their cell phone is driven by socio-economic concerns? Is he looking to go to college in Canada and then come back to visit his sick grandmother?

Clearly not.

Islamic extremist/fundamentalist/Jihadists are as evil as they are because they truly believe they have nothing to lose. If they die as a martyr, they go to heaven for an eternity of bliss. If they get Muslim civilians killed, they're only expediting their eternity of bliss and the Jewish hostages that are killed or the innocent kids at the concert on October 7th... well, they're just getting what they deserve.

But, yah, it's too bad that a Gaza student can't go to college in Canada. I don't know how he's going to survive.

So, you're saying the root cause of this is "Islamic fundamentalism/Jihadism/terrorism" and yet not once do I see the word occupation or oppression. You don't think kicking people out of their land and oppressing them would cause some conflict? lol
You speak about terrorism, but you don't mention the terrorist attacks by Jewish extremists in the 40s. But I guess those are not "terrorist attacks" because they weren't done by Islamic fundamentalist/Jihadists.
Then you bring up Pakistan. What caused the rifts in that region? Don't you think the British partition separating India into 3 countries by religion had something to do with it? Yet again, you only focus on Muslims.

And to your last sentence, you're basically admitting it's fine for all Palestinians to be collectively punished because of fear of Islamic fundamentalist. If you don't see a problem with that statement, I don't know what to tell you.

All you see believe is that BS that Israel spits out saying that they are the victims because Hamas wants to wipe them out.

 

[ZenMode]

So, you're saying the root cause of this is "Islamic fundamentalism/Jihadism/terrorism" and yet not once do I see the word occupation or oppression.

I'm saying Muslim extremists/Jihadists/terrorists will do the evil things they do, because of their religious beliefs. If Gaza was a completely sovereign state, they would keep doing the evil things they do.

You don't think kicking people out of their land and oppressing them would cause some conflict? lol

I don't know. How many Native American suicide bombers have you seen? How many oppressed Christians in Pakistan have gone on a killing spree? What about the Tibetan Buddhists in China? Are they taking hostages and sex slaves?

You speak about terrorism, but you don't mention the terrorist attacks by Jewish extremists in the 40s. But I guess those are not "terrorist attacks" because they weren't done by Islamic fundamentalist/Jihadists.

Jewish extremists are the exception and aren't a fundamental aspect of their religion.

Then you bring up Pakistan. What caused the rifts in that region? Don't you think the British partition separating India into 3 countries by religion had something to do with it? Yet again, you only focus on Muslims.

I do because, again, if you look around the world, there's a commonality with a lot of the terrorism/violence and it's not Buddhists, Jews, Christians, Catholics, Atheists, etc.

And to your last sentence, you're basically admitting it's fine for all Palestinians to be collectively punished because of fear of Islamic fundamentalist. If you don't see a problem with that statement, I don't know what to tell you.

I think Israel would love to live next door to a sane and rational sovereign country, but they can't afford to leave Gaza to its own devices for reasons that are obvious.

All you see believe is that BS that Israel spits out saying that they are the victims because Hamas wants to wipe them out.

I'm almost exclusively talking about the evil of Muslim extremism. My only belief is that, compared to Jihadists, Israel/Israelis/IDF are undoubtedly the "good" guys.

 

[RaiGuy]

I'm saying Muslim extremists/Jihadists/terrorists will do the evil things they do, because of their religious beliefs. If Gaza was a completely sovereign state, they would keep doing the evil things they do.


I don't know. How many Native American suicide bombers have you seen? How many oppressed Christians in Pakistan have gone on a killing spree? What about the Tibetan Buddhists in China? Are they taking hostages and sex slaves?

Jewish extremists are the exception and aren't a fundamental aspect of their religion.

I do because, again, if you look around the world, there's a commonality with a lot of the terrorism/violence and it's not Buddhists, Jews, Christians, Catholics, Atheists, etc.


I think Israel would love to live next door to a sane and rational sovereign country, but they can't afford to leave Gaza to its own devices for reasons that are obvious.

I'm almost exclusively talking about the evil of Muslim extremism. My only belief is that, compared to Jihadists, Israel/Israelis/IDF are undoubtedly the "good" guys.

Basically, what you're saying are Muslims are bad and Israel is "good", right? You are saying that the siege on Gaza is justified because there are "Islamic fundamentalists" there, so you can't trust anyone that lives there. They are all grouped together and they can't have sovereignty because Hamas.

Tell me now how many has Israel killed vs how many Hamas has killed? Who has done more damage? Then tell me how one is a good guy while only one of them is the bad guy. I don't see the logic in that. You either don't know the facts or you choose to ignore the facts because of your fear of Muslims.

 

[FreeGuy]

Basically, what you're saying are Muslims are bad and Israel is "good", right? You are saying that the siege on Gaza is justified because there are "Islamic fundamentalists" there, so you can't trust anyone that lives there. They are all grouped together and they can't have sovereignty because Hamas.

Tell me now how many has Israel killed vs how many Hamas has killed? Who has done more damage? Then tell me how one is a good guy while only one of them is the bad guy. I don't see the logic in that. You either don't know the facts or you choose to ignore the facts because of your fear of Muslims.

You completely ignored the factual statistics on the number of Muslims that want Western Civilization to be dismantled.

Do you?

Do you think we should be under Sharia Law?

Do you think Israel has the right to exist?

And by the way… when was Palestine a country and what was its’ boundaries?

 

[RaiGuy]

You completely ignored the factual statistics on the number of Muslims that want Western Civilization to be dismantled.

Do you?

Do you think we should be under Sharia Law?

Do you think Israel has the right to exist?

And by the way… when was Palestine a country and what was its’ boundaries?

Ah yes, factual statistics. Yes, please tell me the factual statistics on the number of Muslims that want to dismantle western civilization. My guess is that the percent of Muslims that want to destroy the west is equivalent to the number of people like you that want to destroy the Muslim civilization.

Can you also tell me who is trying to force Sharia Law on you? Stop watching Fox News. The only people trying to impose ultra religious laws in this country are Trump and his cronies.

I am not going to waste my time and answer your other questions as I have talked about it countless times before in the past few years. Go read a book.

 

[ZenMode]

Basically, what you're saying are Muslims are bad and Israel is "good", right?

Definitely not. Nobody is inherently bad because they're Muslim, Christian, Jewish, etc. I'm saying the Muslims who do terrible things are bad and it's not a coincidence that Muslim extremists/Jihadists behave badly all around the world.

You are saying that the siege on Gaza is justified because there are "Islamic fundamentalists" there, so you can't trust anyone that lives there.

If you're talking about the current siege, that is intended to drive Hamas completely out of Gaza and get aid to Palestinians, I would say it's justified.

I'm sure you can trust lots of people there. The problem is knowing which people.

They are all grouped together and they can't have sovereignty because Hamas.

Like I said, if Gaza, under Hamas, was left to its own devices, the attacks on Israel would be more frequent and more violent. Even with the blockade, Hamas still managed to assemble what is needed for October 7th. Imagine what it would be without the blockade.

Tell me now how many has Israel killed vs how many Hamas has killed? Who has done more damage? Then tell me how one is a good guy while only one of them is the bad guy. I don't see the logic in that. You either don't know the facts or you choose to ignore the facts because of your fear of Muslims.

Total deaths isn't an accurate measure of good and bad. What do you think caused more deaths: 9/11 or the subsequent war in Afghanistan? Does that diffence in body count make the US bad and the terrorists good?

What's important is intent.

Hamas' intent is to maximize civilian death. It's Israel's intent to minimize civilian deaths. If Israel had their weapons AND Hamas' intent, Gaza would be leveled and the civilian death count would be in the millions.

 

[RaiGuy]

What's important is intent.

Hamas' intent is to maximize civilian death. It's Israel's intent to minimize civilian deaths. If Israel had their weapons AND Hamas' intent, Gaza would be leveled and the civilian death count would be in the millions.

wouldn’t you say an intent to demolish and empty out Gaza and starve the population is not really looking to minimize civilian death? They aren’t protecting civilians out of the goodness of their hearts. They just want to do it slowly to avoid the backlash, which is working.

 

[FreeGuy]

Ah yes, factual statistics. Yes, please tell me the factual statistics on the number of Muslims that want to dismantle western civilization. My guess is that the percent of Muslims that want to destroy the west is equivalent to the number of people like you that want to destroy the Muslim civilization.

Can you also tell me who is trying to force Sharia Law on you? Stop watching Fox News. The only people trying to impose ultra religious laws in this country are Trump and his cronies.

I am not going to waste my time and answer your other questions as I have talked about it countless times before in the past few years. Go read a book.

Yep…. You would love to see Western Civilization crumble.

Funny how all of the peaceful protesters screaming to “Free Palestine” always cover their faces.

Why is that?

And if it’s such a noble cause and peaceful people then why doesn’t any of their Arab neighbors offer them refuge?

You know why and so does the rest of the world.

Add this to the list as to just how far off the rails the Democrats have gone.

Please continue!

 

[RaiGuy]

Yep…. You would love to see Western Civilization crumble.

Funny how all of the peaceful protesters screaming to “Free Palestine” always cover their faces.

Why is that?

And if it’s such a noble cause and peaceful people then why doesn’t any of their Arab neighbors offer them refuge?

You know why and so does the rest of the world.

Add this to the list as to just how far off the rails the Democrats have gone.

Please continue!

Dammit! You uncovered my plans! I was secretly trying to plan how to make the west crumble by making sure I was born here and integrated myself in society. It’s only a matter a time before you’ll be worshipping Allah and riding camels. Just you wait, infidel!

 

[FreeGuy]

Dammit! You uncovered my plans! I was secretly trying to plan how to make the west crumble by making sure I was born here and integrated myself in society. It’s only a matter a time before you’ll be worshipping Allah and riding camels. Just you wait, infidel!

Again…. Your religion hates homosexuals, women’s rights and anything that doesn’t follow Islam.

Can’t have a serious conversation with you because when you are presented with facts you make jokes and resort to childish jargon.

Wonder why?

 

[RaiGuy]

Again…. Your religion hates homosexuals, women’s rights and anything that doesn’t follow Islam.

Can’t have a serious conversation with you because when you are presented with facts you make jokes and resort to childish jargon.

Wonder why?

Funny how there’s been Muslim women presidents than female presidents in the US. But I guess facts aren’t important. Gtfoh you xenophobic prick.

 

[FreeGuy]

Funny how there’s been Muslim women presidents than female presidents in the US. But I guess facts aren’t important. Gtfoh you xenophobic prick.

Really? Where?

It’s not xenophobic to post facts. You may not like them but they are facts.

I didn’t even bring up child brides.

If you are going to discuss anti-Semitic tropes about “Zionism” the coin has two sides.

 

[superrific]

Really? Where?

It’s not xenophobic to post facts. You may not like them but they are facts.

I didn’t even bring up child brides.

If you are going to discuss anti-Semitic tropes about “Zionism” the coin has two sides.

Most coins have two sides even if RaiGuy doesn't discuss anti-Semitic tropes. What do the coins look like in your world? Mobius strips?

And the coin having two sides is his point and mine and many others here. Try to keep up.

 

[ZenMode]

wouldn’t you say an intent to demolish and empty out Gaza and starve the population is not really looking to minimize civilian death? They aren’t protecting civilians out of the goodness of their hearts. They just want to do it slowly to avoid the backlash, which is working.

I haven't seen anything that makes me believe Israel wants to "demolish and empty out" Gaza.

Leveraging aid to get hostages released is questionable. Israel puts significant priority of getting ALL hostages released. They once released over 1,000 terrorist, including Sinwar, to get one hostage back.

However, it appears that Israel has now changed their approach and Israel will temporarily take over all of Gaza in order to resume aid and remove Hamas. Again, if the roles were reversed, would Hamas take steps to help Israeli civilians?

BTW, before Israel's announced intent to take over Gaza and resume aid, I said here there was a 99% chance Israel caves first regarding withholding aid. I accurately predicted that because Hamas/Jihadists aren't scared to die as a martyr.... because of their religious, not socio-economic/political, beliefs.

I mentioned the Taliban attack on a Peshawar school in 2014. They killed 130 children while reportedly yelling Allahu Akbar. I can't find the link, but I have a partial quote from a Taliban supporter about the attack:

“Human life only has value among you worldly materialist thinkers. For us, this human life is only a tiny meaningless fragment of our existence. Our real destination is the Hereafter. We don’t just believe it exists, we know it does. Death is not the end of life. It is the beginning of existence, in a world much more beautiful than this. As you know, the (Urdu) word for death is ‘intiqaal.’ It means ‘transfer,’ not 'end'.

"Paradise is for those of pure hearts. All children have pure hearts. They have not yet sinned. … They have not yet been corrupted [by their apostate parents]. We did not end their lives. We gave them new ones, in Paradise, where they will be loved more than you can imagine …”

That is pure, religion-fueled evil and those are the types of people running Gaza (Hamas) and fighting Israel.

 

[Batt Boy]

Lots to digest the past several weeks



1. Hezbollah's disarmament is going better than expected. Lebanon's government is clearing some areas faster than expected, and there were even instances of Hamas and other Palestinian terrorist groups surrendering arms and being arrested.

2. Israeli airstrikes continue in Lebanon (as per ceasefire agreement) with 0 response from Hezbollah so far, indicating Hezbollah is thoroughly deterred, demoralized, and broken.

3. In Gaza, the IDF seems (according to satellite footage) to prepare the ground in several ways.
A. Rafah buffer zone is being expanded massively.
B. Rafah is being flattened and rubble is cleared. Ground is paved in a way that indicates a future tent city.
C. Netzarim and Morag corridors are being expanded.
D. Buffer zone into Gaza is being expanded.

4. It's indicated that the plan is to evacuate the entire population of Gaza to Rafah into the large camp being prepared. Aid will be distributed from just 1 location in Gaza, directly from IDF-controlled territory, in order to reduce thefts that allow Hamas to stay politically relevant.

5. New poll reveals 47% of Gazans are willing to leave Gaza if given the option. Small numbers of Gazans with foreign citizenship have already left via Israel.

6. The US initiated a massive strike campaign on the Houthis and recently stopped following a ceasefire announcement.

7. Israel and Houthis engaged more directly recently after a Houthi missile landed very close to Israel's Ben Gurion international airport, and Israel retaliated by destroying the Houthis' only international airport in Sanaa, and their sea port in Hodeidah. The airport is done for years.

8. Various mysterious explosions are occurring in Iran including in its largest sea port, during talks with the US regarding its nuclear program.

 

[ZenMode]

Lots to digest the past several weeks



1. Hezbollah's disarmament is going better than expected. Lebanon's government is clearing some areas faster than expected, and there were even instances of Hamas and other Palestinian terrorist groups surrendering arms and being arrested.

2. Israeli airstrikes continue in Lebanon (as per ceasefire agreement) with 0 response from Hezbollah so far, indicating Hezbollah is thoroughly deterred, demoralized, and broken.

3. In Gaza, the IDF seems (according to satellite footage) to prepare the ground in several ways.
A. Rafah buffer zone is being expanded massively.
B. Rafah is being flattened and rubble is cleared. Ground is paved in a way that indicates a future tent city.
C. Netzarim and Morag corridors are being expanded.
D. Buffer zone into Gaza is being expanded.

4. It's indicated that the plan is to evacuate the entire population of Gaza to Rafah into the large camp being prepared. Aid will be distributed from just 1 location in Gaza, directly from IDF-controlled territory, in order to reduce thefts that allow Hamas to stay politically relevant.

5. New poll reveals 47% of Gazans are willing to leave Gaza if given the option. Small numbers of Gazans with foreign citizenship have already left via Israel.

6. The US initiated a massive strike campaign on the Houthis and recently stopped following a ceasefire announcement.

7. Israel and Houthis engaged more directly recently after a Houthi missile landed very close to Israel's Ben Gurion international airport, and Israel retaliated by destroying the Houthis' only international airport in Sanaa, and their sea port in Hodeidah. The airport is done for years.

8. Various mysterious explosions are occurring in Iran including in its largest sea port, during talks with the US regarding its nuclear program.

I think #2 is also true of Iran. They aren't coming to the defense of Hamas or Hezbollah because they don't have Russia to prop them up.

 

[RaiGuy]

I haven't seen anything that makes me believe Israel wants to "demolish and empty out" Gaza.

you may have missed this with all the other news. This was 2 days ago by a government official.

Israeli official says Gaza will be "entirely destroyed," Palestinians "will start to leave in great numbers"

Israeli Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich says victory in Gaza will mean the enclave being "entirely destroyed," Palestinians leaving for other countries.

www.cbsnews.com

 

[RaiGuy]

Really? Where?

It’s not xenophobic to post facts. You may not like them but they are facts.

I didn’t even bring up child brides.

If you are going to discuss anti-Semitic tropes about “Zionism” the coin has two sides.

Google is your friend

List of Muslim women heads of state and government - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

It is xenophobic when you post lies about Islam.

Tell me an anti-Semitic trope that I said? Also, if you weren’t an idiot, you would know that Judaism and Zionism are not the same. You can criticize Israel and not be anti-Semitic. Also, Palestinians are semites as well, so there’s that.
Now try doing some research next time before you come talking about facts.

 

[farce©]

Funny how all of the peaceful protesters screaming to “Free Palestine” always cover their faces.

Why is that?

Why do ICE agents always cover their faces?

 

[ZenMode]

you may have missed this with all the other news. This was 2 days ago by a government official.

Israeli official says Gaza will be "entirely destroyed," Palestinians "will start to leave in great numbers"

Israeli Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich says victory in Gaza will mean the enclave being "entirely destroyed," Palestinians leaving for other countries.

www.cbsnews.com

I don't know much of anything about the role of the Minister of Finance in military decisions in Israel, but I don't suspect his opinion means much. It also sounds like he's a far-right big mouth.

From what I've read, the official position of Israel seems to be a plan to drive out Hamas and get aid to the citizens of Gaza, not drive citizens from Gaza.