Mass Shooting & Gun Violence | War related attacks in MI Temple & at ODU

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nrsair said:
Ridiculous way of saying it, reminiscent of the stupid “unalive” that’s all over social media since kill/murder/suicide are censored by the platforms. I’d wager that she spends a fair amount of time on tiktok.
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I'd guess it's less that she spends time on social media and more she hadn't thought through how to say that the students killed him without giving away details she's not cleared to give out and then found herself halfway into a sentence she had no clue how to finish.

Yeah, it's poor public speaking, but I wouldn't take it as much more than that.

It's also legitimately funny and I plan to use it in the future.
 
BlooVooDoo said:
This won’t get the attention it deserves because it requires accepting some very uncomfortable truths.
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I struggle with this. We all know violence begets violence. But at a certain point, you are solely responsible for the violence you create, despite triggers you may have. A rapist may have been molested as a child but that doesn’t make their crimes less heinous. Not really sure what the answer is. Probably one of the more complex problems a society faces.
 
BlooVooDoo said:
This won’t get the attention it deserves because it requires accepting some very uncomfortable truths.
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So this guy hates Israel
To get back at Israel's leadership he tries to kill some Jewish kids in Michigan
 
Willy said:
I struggle with this. We all know violence begets violence. But at a certain point, you are solely responsible for the violence you create, despite triggers you may have. A rapist may have been molested as a child but that doesn’t make their crimes less heinous. Not really sure what the answer is. Probably one of the more complex problems a society faces.
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Of course. I think everyone can relate to the family photos and the sense of anger he justifiably felt. Where he directed that anger and desire for vengeance was clearly wrong, but having multiple family members killed in an act of violence is the kind of thing that could push a lot of people to the brink.
 
When any of you, immediately after unexpectedly losing a child, are faced with dealing with just the grief and not the ,imo, justified rage, make logical and rational decisions, tell me how you did it. Yeah, what he did was wrong but temporary insanity is real. Sometimes, you just want someone else to feel the pain you're feeling. In the case, he had excuses for his targeting.

Fwiw, when my three month old son died in my arms from SIDS some forty years ago after ten days in a coma, it almost cost us our marriage, our family and damned near all our earthly goods and my losses weren't as bad as his. It's the same reason I had so much sympathy for Biden and his family pain. This guy had his heart torn out and he might have felt he had nothing left in the world or inside. I hate what he did but I sure can feel his pain.
 
Willy said:
I struggle with this. We all know violence begets violence. But at a certain point, you are solely responsible for the violence you create, despite triggers you may have. A rapist may have been molested as a child but that doesn’t make their crimes less heinous. Not really sure what the answer is. Probably one of the more complex problems a society faces.
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I think you're talking about two different things.

At the level of personal accountability, yes a person is responsible for the violence they create. It is a choice, and it is not compelled by past injustices.

At a policy level, though, it is very important to have a broader understanding of causes and take steps to minimize the harm. For instance, suppose a president at some point in the future gets elected on a Satanist platform. First day in office he wants to fly a flag depicting Satan fucking the Ayatollah while both rule over the United States. Advisers tell him, if you fly that flag, a lot of Christian nationalists are going to lose their minds and go on mass shooting sprees.

Obviously, the personal responsibility for flying the mass shooting would lie with the shooters. But also, maybe don't fly that flag?

Also obviously, we can't have lunatic would-be shooters holding a veto over American policies. Their reaction is one of many variables. I used the flag example because the cost benefit works out so cleanly there: nothing good will come from flying that flag, so it's easy. On other issues, the cost benefit analysis goes the other way, cleanly (this is the vast majority of circumstances). For instance, bombers should not have been (and were not able to) derail civil rights just because they were pissed.

This points to the importance of public explanation. If the administration can't explain the war in Iran, then it starts looking like the flag example.
 
mpaer said:
So this guy hates Israel
To get back at Israel's leadership he tries to kill some Jewish kids in Michigan
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This Iran war has been manna from Heaven for Elders of Zion people. If you live in an environment in which people take seriously the idea that Jews secretly control the world -- well, what's going to be the reaction when the president of the United States says, "we started this war because Israel told us to"?

Again, that's why messaging should be careful and constructed in these circumstances. Telling the world that the Zionists made America do it is basically just inviting attacks against Jews.
 
Ramrouser said:
Austin shooter: naturalized citizen

ODU: Naturalized citizen

NYC teen bombers: children of naturalized citizens

Michigan synagogue attack: naturalized citizen.

We may need to revisit and reconsider our immigration screening process.
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Either that, or don't rain death and destruction on populations for no good reason.

LOL that you are trying to include children of naturalized citizens in this list. That, of course, has nothing to do with screening the parents and makes it obvious that you are really talking about race. You undermine your own positions so effortlessly that I can only imagine the glee I would feel taking a case with you as opposing counsel.
 
superrific said:
This Iran war has been manna from Heaven for Elders of Zion people. If you live in an environment in which people take seriously the idea that Jews secretly control the world -- well, what's going to be the reaction when the president of the United States says, "we started this war because Israel told us to"?

Again, that's why messaging should be careful and constructed in these circumstances. Telling the world that the Zionists made America do it is basically just inviting attacks against Jews.
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This president of the US would never say that. That is Rubio’s line. Trump got his feathers ruffled when that explanation was repeated to him and he insisted that he tells Bibi what to do.
 
superrific said:
This Iran war has been manna from Heaven for Elders of Zion people. If you live in an environment in which people take seriously the idea that Jews secretly control the world -- well, what's going to be the reaction when the president of the United States says, "we started this war because Israel told us to"?

Again, that's why messaging should be careful and constructed in these circumstances. Telling the world that the Zionists made America do it is basically just inviting attacks against Jews.
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I've got some extremely online acquaintances and judging from their feeds, that is exactly what's going on.
 
finesse said:
When any of you, immediately after unexpectedly losing a child, are faced with dealing with just the grief and not the ,imo, justified rage, make logical and rational decisions, tell me how you did it. Yeah, what he did was wrong but temporary insanity is real. Sometimes, you just want someone else to feel the pain you're feeling. In the case, he had excuses for his targeting.

Fwiw, when my three month old son died in my arms from SIDS some forty years ago after ten days in a coma, it almost cost us our marriage, our family and damned near all our earthly goods and my losses weren't as bad as his. It's the same reason I had so much sympathy for Biden and his family pain. This guy had his heart torn out and he might have felt he had nothing left in the world or inside. I hate what he did but I sure can feel his pain.
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I’m sorry for your loss.
 
Simple piece of legislation: Stop importing the Third World into our country so we don’t turn into a Third World country.
superrific said:
Either that, or don't rain death and destruction on populations for no good reason.

LOL that you are trying to include children of naturalized citizens in this list. That, of course, has nothing to do with screening the parents and makes it obvious that you are really talking about race. You undermine your own positions so effortlessly that I can only imagine the glee I would feel taking a case with you as opposing counsel.
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We don’t know what the parents taught or passed on to the children. They could be jihadist sympathizers as well. It’s not an unreasonable assumption.
 
Ramrouser said:
Simple piece of legislation: Stop importing the Third World into our country so we don’t turn into a Third World country.

We don’t know what the parents taught or passed on to the children. They could be jihadist sympathizers as well. It’s not an unreasonable assumption.
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Do it. You guys control all three branches of government and both houses of Congress. What’s stopping you?
 
Ramrouser said:
Simple piece of legislation: Stop importing the Third World into our country so we don’t turn into a Third World country.
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That's weak. We should just deport, permanently, anyone suspected of harboring extremist or pro-terrorist ideology. Of course, that would include a lot of people that Trump pardoned.....
 
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