The Charlie Kirk Thread

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breepf said:
I don't think you're trying to shit on Judaism, but it's so fucking irritating when anyone knocks Christians for religious beliefs that supposedly come from the Jewish Bible: "they're not Christians; they're (still) Jews!"
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I almost wrote, “They’re not Christians; they’re Old Testament Jews.”

Then, I realized they ARE NOT Jewish. Far from it.

Plenty of purported Christians have been Old Testament Believers and they ARE NOT Jewish and they certainly are not Christians.

They’re dogmatic, authoritarian believers in “an eye for an eye.”

They aren’t Jewish. They aren’t Christian. They’re Bibi Netanyahu and Donald Trump and Charlie Kirk and Mike Huckabee………
 
Ramrouser said:
You know the answer is no and that should tell you everything you know about the Dem party of 2025.
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Why doesn't it tell you more about the Republican party of 2025? It's not our fault that your Hitler Youth commandant was a shithead. It's also not our fault that your side of the aisle hasn't produced a single halfway decent policy idea in a generation. Well, none that I can think of, at least. There was probably one or two. I think Trump did something on medical billing that was sorta kinda good, but it was Biden who completed the deal.
 
theel4life said:
Who was he then? What did this great man represent?
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The Kirk Memorial was the first HUGE event on the right during the last decade that did not revolve around Trump. TPUSA is MAGA adjacent but Kirk not Trump is the clear leader. The Memorial would have been just as large without Trump - who was really just a side piece for the event. The crowd was decidedly younger (and likely more educated) than a typical MAGA rally and Kirk/Jesus not Trump was the main focus.

Kirk quietly built over the last decade his organization which focused on a college age (recently HS) audience. He brought to campus the rare opportunity for the students to engage in real dialogue and debate on a wide range of issues. Colleges, decades ago, abandoned true free speech and debate in favor of indoctrination. Conservative voices were not welcome. The students loved it as his events over the years drew larger and larger audiences. Kirk also openly spoke about his faith in an unapologetic way.

All this is to say is that he developed a huge following of educated, under 35, people. He was off or under the radar to a lot of people, even those who follow politics (my Wife had never heard of him until after his death). His message was to live a traditional life: Find a soul mate; marry; have kids early and often; engage in respectful debate; and finally, devote your life to Jesus Christ. The message resonated and was refreshing to many young people as that is NOT the message popular culture pushes in media, entertainment and education.

I think you saw the fruits of his work during the last election and the movement is only going to get stronger.
 
Ramrouser said:
Yeah, ok. Does a random YouTuber draw 200k for a memorial service with a streaming audience of 100M?
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Of what relevance is this?

Are there conditions in our government that define the tipping point to transition from a random youtuber to a special youtuber?

Also, whet did you read that 100 MILLION streamed his convention?

Also, from what i read, there were under 100K at the memorial, nit 200k, this must be fox news numbers.
 
Ramrouser said:
The Kirk Memorial was the first HUGE event on the right during the last decade that did not revolve around Trump. TPUSA is MAGA adjacent but Kirk not Trump is the clear leader. The Memorial would have been just as large without Trump - who was really just a side piece for the event. The crowd was decidedly younger (and likely more educated) than a typical MAGA rally and Kirk/Jesus not Trump was the main focus.

Kirk quietly built over the last decade his organization which focused on a college age (recently HS) audience. He brought to campus the rare opportunity for the students to engage in real dialogue and debate on a wide range of issues. Colleges, decades ago, abandoned true free speech and debate in favor of indoctrination. Conservative voices were not welcome. The students loved it as his events over the years drew larger and larger audiences. Kirk also openly spoke about his faith in an unapologetic way.

All this is to say is that he developed a huge following of educated, under 35, people. He was off or under the radar to a lot of people, even those who follow politics (my Wife had never heard of him until after his death). His message was to live a traditional life: Find a soul mate; marry; have kids early and often; engage in respectful debate; and finally, devote your life to Jesus Christ. The message resonated and was refreshing to many young people as that is NOT the message popular culture pushes in media, entertainment and education.

I think you saw the fruits of his work during the last election and the movement is only going to get stronger.
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The first of these Kirk might not have said in so many words, but he implied it by supporting the contents of Leviticus 18, which includes stoning gays. Kinda like JK implied that Robinson was MAGA.

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Mulberry Heel said:
I'm hardly a theologian, but if you're a Christian isn't the New Testament and its teachings supposed to replace or supersede the Old Testament? After all, what's the point of having the Son of God come to Earth if everything stays the same as it was before, right? Yet so many Evangelicals I know are very much Old Testament Christians in many respects, starting with the "eye for an eye" philosophy of living.
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I'd disagree. Jesus didn't claim his teachings should supersede the law and teachings of the OT, but fulfill and expand upon them. He acknowledged laws could be superfluous and unnecessary, and rejected some (stoning, for example). His view was that the law should not be ritualistic and static. There were 613 commandments (Mitzvot) in the Torah. Quite an expansion from the original ten commandments handed down by Moses.
During his lifetime, his message was directed to the Jewish people, but it was much more inclusive than traditional Jewish teaching. It was after his death and resurrection that his apostles received the commission to go out and spread his message to the gentiles.
I don't believe that evangelicals (in general) tend to think broadly or view scripture in the context of its time. Slavery and bigamy were accepted norms at one time. So was ritual sacrifice. We no longer condone those.
 
Ramrouser said:
The Kirk Memorial was the first HUGE event on the right during the last decade that did not revolve around Trump. TPUSA is MAGA adjacent but Kirk not Trump is the clear leader. The Memorial would have been just as large without Trump - who was really just a side piece for the event. The crowd was decidedly younger (and likely more educated) than a typical MAGA rally and Kirk/Jesus not Trump was the main focus.

Kirk quietly built over the last decade his organization which focused on a college age (recently HS) audience. He brought to campus the rare opportunity for the students to engage in real dialogue and debate on a wide range of issues. Colleges, decades ago, abandoned true free speech and debate in favor of indoctrination. Conservative voices were not welcome. The students loved it as his events over the years drew larger and larger audiences. Kirk also openly spoke about his faith in an unapologetic way.

All this is to say is that he developed a huge following of educated, under 35, people. He was off or under the radar to a lot of people, even those who follow politics (my Wife had never heard of him until after his death). His message was to live a traditional life: Find a soul mate; marry; have kids early and often; engage in respectful debate; and finally, devote your life to Jesus Christ. The message resonated and was refreshing to many young people as that is NOT the message popular culture pushes in media, entertainment and education.

I think you saw the fruits of his work during the last election and the movement is only going to get stronger.
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I know I won't be able to get thought to you, and that makes me sad, but...

Charlie Kirk's poison was not not his message of "Hey here's this other value system that you might not have considered that I think might suit you, you should try it out".

Charlie Kirk's poison was "Hey here's this other value system that you might not have considered that I think might suit you, you should try it out... and if you like it, join me in using every lever of government to force it onto everybody in the USA whether they subscribe to this value system or not".

You conveniently left that second half (the poisonous half) off. I won't fall into the trap of discussing the merits of the particular value system he espoused, because the "Let's use the government to force a single value system universally on an unwilling public" is automatically disqualifying.
 
Mulberry Heel said:
I'm hardly a theologian, but if you're a Christian isn't the New Testament and its teachings supposed to replace or supersede the Old Testament? After all, what's the point of having the Son of God come to Earth if everything stays the same as it was before, right? Yet so many Evangelicals I know are very much Old Testament Christians in many respects, starting with the "eye for an eye" philosophy of living.
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You gotta love Christians quoting Leviticus about … anything.
 
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