Was Joan of Arc Trans?

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Are you suggesting that Joan of Arc, perhaps the most famous woman from the middle ages that wasn't a ruling monarch was just another man? Do you have an axe to grind against women? She's literally been a hero to millions of lesbians and tomboys. Don't take that away from them.
 
ronjon said:
Are you suggesting that Joan of Arc, perhaps the most famous woman from the middle ages that wasn't a ruling monarch was just another man? Do you have an axe to grind against women? She's literally been a hero to millions of lesbians and tomboys. Don't take that away from them.
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I could be wrong. And it’s super, so who the fuck knows where he is going with this, but I think he is implying that Joan d’Arc viewed herself as a man, not the other way around.
 
I'm suggesting that she wore men's clothes and acted like a man because her gender didn't match her sex. I have no idea where this "axe to grind" idea came from. I also don't know who Hershel is.
 
not completely insane by any means. google AI sez:

While some modern interpretations suggest Joan of Arc could be considered transgender or non-binary, historical evidence indicates she primarily identified as a woman. She adopted male clothing and a short haircut for practical reasons related to her role as a military leader and her belief in a divine mission, not necessarily as a statement of gender identity.

Historical Context:
  • Gender Roles in the 15th Century:
    Joan lived in a time where strict gender roles were enforced. Cross-dressing was seen as a transgression, and her actions were viewed through that lens.
    • Political and Religious Motives:
      Her trial and execution were primarily political, with cross-dressing used as a justification. The English crown used it as a way to discredit her and undermine French claims of divine support.
    • Divine Mandate:
      Joan believed God instructed her to wear men's clothing to fulfill her military and religious duties. She saw this as a way to serve God and France.
Modern Interpretations:
    • Transgender/Non-binary Identity:
      Some modern scholars and activists interpret Joan's actions as evidence of a transgender or non-binary identity, arguing that her actions defied traditional gender roles and she was willing to die for her chosen expression.
    • Pragmatic Cross-dressing:
      Others argue that Joan's cross-dressing was a practical, strategic decision, not a reflection of her gender identity. They point to her explanations during her trial about the need for male clothing on the battlefield.
    • Queer Icon:
      Joan is widely celebrated as a queer icon, regardless of whether she is definitively labeled as transgender or non-binary, due to her gender nonconformity and her challenges to societal norms.

      Conclusion: While Joan of Arc's story resonates with modern discussions about gender identity, it's crucial to acknowledge the historical context and the motivations behind her actions. Whether she was a transgender or non-binary individual in the modern sense is a matter of ongoing debate and interpretation, but her story continues to inspire conversations about gender, identity, and faith.
 
superrific said:
Oh, man. That was one hell of an inscrutable typo. Usually typos are sort of self-explanatory but I was like, Hershel? I asked Google AI and it went off on some comparison between Joan and The Walking Dead.
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Yeah. I’m not even sure how it happened.
 
4thgenheel said:
not completely insane by any means. google AI sez:

While some modern interpretations suggest Joan of Arc could be considered transgender or non-binary, historical evidence indicates she primarily identified as a woman. She adopted male clothing and a short haircut for practical reasons related to her role as a military leader and her belief in a divine mission, not necessarily as a statement of gender identity.

Historical Context:
  • Gender Roles in the 15th Century:
    Joan lived in a time where strict gender roles were enforced. Cross-dressing was seen as a transgression, and her actions were viewed through that lens.
    • Political and Religious Motives:
      Her trial and execution were primarily political, with cross-dressing used as a justification. The English crown used it as a way to discredit her and undermine French claims of divine support.
    • Divine Mandate:
      Joan believed God instructed her to wear men's clothing to fulfill her military and religious duties. She saw this as a way to serve God and France.
Modern Interpretations:
    • Transgender/Non-binary Identity:
      Some modern scholars and activists interpret Joan's actions as evidence of a transgender or non-binary identity, arguing that her actions defied traditional gender roles and she was willing to die for her chosen expression.
    • Pragmatic Cross-dressing:
      Others argue that Joan's cross-dressing was a practical, strategic decision, not a reflection of her gender identity. They point to her explanations during her trial about the need for male clothing on the battlefield.
    • Queer Icon:
      Joan is widely celebrated as a queer icon, regardless of whether she is definitively labeled as transgender or non-binary, due to her gender nonconformity and her challenges to societal norms.

      Conclusion: While Joan of Arc's story resonates with modern discussions about gender identity, it's crucial to acknowledge the historical context and the motivations behind her actions. Whether she was a transgender or non-binary individual in the modern sense is a matter of ongoing debate and interpretation, but her story continues to inspire conversations about gender, identity, and faith.
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Of course, it's also possible that part of her "divine revelation" was at least in part a response to gender dysphoria. Like, if you were a woman back then and you really felt like you wanted to be a man, what would you do? I think doing what she did would be a pretty good option if she had the chops to pull it off, which apparently she did.
 
it's certainly a valid interpretation. more so than how Joan lived, i think it's instructive to look at how she died. she was burned specifically for the crime of heresy - tied to her claiming divine inspiration just as much as to her refusing to wear women's clothing even under threat of death. but then again, "trans" isn't a category we can neatly retrofit onto the Middle Ages, even though gender has never been cleanly binary.

Joan of Arc didn't call herself non-binary – gendering her isn't that simple

An historian explains why we can't define Joan of Arc's gender through our modern gender binary, as a new play prompts predictable backlash.
www.thepinknews.com www.thepinknews.com
 
I am not sure, but I was surprised to learn that Joan in Bill & Ted's Excellent Adventure was a GoGo.
 
This is fun to speculate about but I'm not sure how we would ever get past the speculative stage. Certainly in her personal mythology it was very important that she was a woman, and more specifically a virgin. Absent a genuine personal diary of hers being unearthed 700+ years later I'm not sure what "evidence" you could really find in the historical record to support a claim.
 
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