Charlie Kirk shot and killed at Utah rally.

CFordUNC said:


Absolutely hate, hate, hate that he was killed. Absolutely hate murder of any kind for any reason. Absolutely hate that Kirk is dead and this wife and children are left to pick up the pieces of their shattered lives.

Also absolutely hate, hate, hate that he held such grotesque beliefs as this one, and that he used his platform to spread them.
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The irony that his event today had armed security that didn't prevent his own death by gunfire is...well...you know...
 
Icky Mettle said:
You don’t have an understanding of the facts or the law here. He was charged with the misdemeanor of misusing 911 back in January. The charge stemmed from him having an episode where he thought someone was putting “materials” in his body to control him. When the police responded and tried to talk him down, he called the 911 on them, thinking they were in on it. They then arrested him.

Nobody is going to be sitting in jail for that. By NC law, the magistrate (it was not a judge) was required to set conditions of release for that charge, which she did. In addition, the US and NC Constitutions prohibit excessive bond. To be frank, the State probably was not going to be able to get a conviction in that charge because they would have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that he knowingly misused 911. Based on the psychotic episode he was having, he most likely did not knowingly misuse 911. He most likely believed he was using it for its intended purpose.

But let’s say hypothetically that he was not released from jail after that arrest. Based on his prior record level, the maximum sentence he could have faced for being convicted of misusing 911 was 45 days. So after sitting in jail for 45 days awaiting his next court date, one of two things would have happened: (1) his lawyer would have moved for his bond to be unsecured, resulting in his release, since he had already served his maximum punishment, or (2) he could have pled guilty and, under NC law, the judge could sentence him to no more than the time he served, thus resulting in his release. So even if he was held in jail, he would have been released a long time ago anyway.

As the claim of 14 arrests, there were not actually 14 separate arrests. There had been 14 charges. A number of those charges occurred during the same arrest as they arose out of the same incident. (Referring to those charges as 14 arrests would be like referring to Donald Trump’s 34 charges in NY as 34 arrests. Trump was not arrested 34 times, however). Many of them were for minor offenses, including disorderly conduct.

As for his felonies, he had been convicted in all of those matters. That resulted in a. Trial do three felony convictions Two of them were from 2014 and arose out of the same incident. They were low level (Class H) felonies. The last one was the more serious one. That was for robbery with a dangerous weapon from 2015. When he was sentenced, the judge imposed the maximum sentence he could legally receive for that offense, which was 73-100 months (6 years, 1 month to 8 years, 4 months). Under NC structured sentencing, every sentence has a minimum and a corresponding maximum. That was the highest minimum and corresponding maximum he could receive by law. Pursuant to NC law, he was given credit for the 176 days he had already served while in custody awaiting arraignment (he remained in custody while that case was pending). Once a defendant goes to prison, they have an opportunity to work their sentence down to the minimum— and no less than the minimum (in this case 73 months)— if they participate in rehabilitative programming, work jobs, while incarcerated, and avoid serious infractions. He worked his case down to the minimum of 73 months and was released on September 20, 2020. He was then placed on post-release supervision for 12 months as required by law. That ended on September 20, 2021.

As for him being schizophrenic, that is not a crime. Also, one cannot be involuntarily committed simply for being schizophrenic.

So despite the narrative that some want to push that someone in the criminal justice system did something wrong or was soft on crime, that was not all the case. Now, you could certainly point to a lack of availability and/or affordability of metal health treatment as a problem.
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I understand and know everything you posted. You left out that police reports show he attacked another woman after his release on parole. And yes, schizophrenia isn't a sole reason for being locked up. However, another violent act after being released on parole for a violent act with a weapon, 14 times being arrested + mental illness is enough for someone not playing social justice warrior to do more than make him write a letter. Every sign is there. If this was a white guy who shot up a school and had this guys background this board would be losing its collective mind wondering how he was not somewhere away from society.
 
Icky Mettle said:
You don’t have an understanding of the facts or the law here. He was charged with the misdemeanor of misusing 911 back in January. The charge stemmed from him having an episode where he thought someone was putting “materials” in his body to control him. When the police responded and tried to talk him down, he called the 911 on them, thinking they were in on it. They then arrested him.

Nobody is going to be sitting in jail for that. By NC law, the magistrate (it was not a judge) was required to set conditions of release for that charge, which she did. In addition, the US and NC Constitutions prohibit excessive bond. To be frank, the State probably was not going to be able to get a conviction in that charge because they would have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that he knowingly misused 911. Based on the psychotic episode he was having, he most likely did not knowingly misuse 911. He most likely believed he was using it for its intended purpose.

But let’s say hypothetically that he was not released from jail after that arrest. Based on his prior record level, the maximum sentence he could have faced for being convicted of misusing 911 was 45 days. So after sitting in jail for 45 days awaiting his next court date, one of two things would have happened: (1) his lawyer would have moved for his bond to be unsecured, resulting in his release, since he had already served his maximum punishment, or (2) he could have pled guilty and, under NC law, the judge could sentence him to no more than the time he served, thus resulting in his release. So even if he was held in jail, he would have been released a long time ago anyway.

As the claim of 14 arrests, there were not actually 14 separate arrests. There had been 14 charges. A number of those charges occurred during the same arrest as they arose out of the same incident. (Referring to those charges as 14 arrests would be like referring to Donald Trump’s 34 charges in NY as 34 arrests. Trump was not arrested 34 times, however). Many of them were for minor offenses, including disorderly conduct.

As for his felonies, he had been convicted in all of those matters. That resulted in a. Trial do three felony convictions Two of them were from 2014 and arose out of the same incident. They were low level (Class H) felonies. The last one was the more serious one. That was for robbery with a dangerous weapon from 2015. When he was sentenced, the judge imposed the maximum sentence he could legally receive for that offense, which was 73-100 months (6 years, 1 month to 8 years, 4 months). Under NC structured sentencing, every sentence has a minimum and a corresponding maximum. That was the highest minimum and corresponding maximum he could receive by law. Pursuant to NC law, he was given credit for the 176 days he had already served while in custody awaiting arraignment (he remained in custody while that case was pending). Once a defendant goes to prison, they have an opportunity to work their sentence down to the minimum— and no less than the minimum (in this case 73 months)— if they participate in rehabilitative programming, work jobs, while incarcerated, and avoid serious infractions. He worked his case down to the minimum of 73 months and was released on September 20, 2020. He was then placed on post-release supervision for 12 months as required by law. That ended on September 20, 2021.

As for him being schizophrenic, that is not a crime. Also, one cannot be involuntarily committed simply for being schizophrenic.

So despite the narrative that some want to push that someone in the criminal justice system did something wrong or was soft on crime, that was not all the case. Now, you could certainly point to a lack of availability and/or affordability of metal health treatment as a problem.
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So nice it should be posted twice.
 


In fact it’s the opposite. Here are the facts for those with short memories:

The man who targeted and killed Democratic state Rep Melissa Hortman was a Trump supporter.

The man who targeted the home of Dem Governor Josh Shapiro was a Trump supporter.

The men who wanted to hang Mike Pence on Jan 6th were Trump supporters.

The man who targeted and killed the son of Obama-appointed District Judge Esther Salas was a Trump supporter.

The man who tried to kidnap Nancy Pelosi and assaulted her husband was a Trump supporter.

The men who were convicted trying to kidnap Dem Governor Gretchen Whitmer were Trump supporters.

The man who sent pipe bombs to the homes of Obama and Biden was a Trump supporter.

There is no equivalent or even similar list of Obama or Biden supporters who have carried out similar murders, attempted murders, or violent attacks
 
TarSpiel said:
I made a promise to myself not to follow the news after Trumps 2nd election. I doom scrolled the first, and was engaged with the news on a daily basis. This time, I have a young son to raise, and I'll be damned if I waste my time that could be spent with him getting sucked into these stories.

I checked in on this thread, because it's a big story. And I wanted to lament the toxicity of our political rhetoric that leads to this kind of stuff.

From someone who is basically checked out of the news, coming onto this thread and reading it is just nutso. It's fucking CRAZY how much rage and outrage are driving people on this thread, on both sides of the issue. I'm not used to it...I'm like someone who hasn't had a drink in a decade taking a couple shots of whiskey and getting soused by it. I'm going to close down now & go spend some time with my kid. Jesus, Mary and Joseph.
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The world doesn't seem to be going to right direction at this time. I hope that it can recover.
 
farce© said:
Dude, just because you are a criminal attorney in NC and actually know the DA who prosecuted his robbery charge doesn’t mean you understand this stuff better than Callatoroy, who has assured me he didn’t misrepresent anything.

I wonder if you’ll get a response to this? And if so will it include the phrase “common sense?”
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Something not included in his post that you creamed your pants over.

"2022-2024: Arrests, but no court record
According to Mecklenburg County jail records, Charlotte-Mecklenburg police arrested Brown three times between 2022 and 2024. None of those arrests appear to have led to charges, or the cases were dismissed in a way that no longer appears in court records.

In September 2022, Brown was arrested for assault on a female and property injury, but court records do not reflect a corresponding charge.

Jail and police records indicate arrests in April and May 2024, both for repeatedly dialing 911 without an emergency. WBTV, again, could not locate a corresponding court record for the arrests.

Smells like DEI doesn't it farce? Of course it does. That's just common sense
 
altmin said:
With all the accusations that this was a leftist, which it still could be, it helps to remember that the far right is not exactly a unity love fest. Groups on the extreme splinter and have rivalries all the time. All purity movements fall victim to them, i know Nick Fuentes was no fan of Charlie Kirk and would send the Groypers out to harass the Turning Point folks. When you get to the end of the spectrums, you find a lot of unbalanced people.
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Pretty much. Until the killer is caught (hopefully they will be) and we know their motivations then it seems wildly premature to be blaming anybody for anything. Even if the shooter is a "leftist" that hardly tarnishes all liberals, especially given all of the wild rhetoric we've heard from the right for at least the past decade. This tragedy definitely seems to be giving at least some conservatives a chance to vent all of their rage and bitterness at liberals though, as we've clearly been seeing on this very thread.
 
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