Charlie Kirk shot and killed at Utah rally.

Callatoroy said:
I don’t know what to tell you other than read the room. A majority of voters apparently didn’t share your view that they (trump, Vance) were fascists or authoritarians. It doesn’t matter at all if trump and his cabinet can “handle” it because it isn’t about them. It’s about voters and whether they can handle it. The left has overused the labels so much they become meaningless. For a year and a half leading up to the election the left absolutely hammered trump as fascist and a threat to democracy, and even said if you vote for him you are supporting racism, fascism, etc. Yet they still voted for him because they don’t believe it because it became meaningless due to over-exaggeration and hyperbole. Continuing to beat that ineffective drum hasn’t worked and continuing to won’t work either. We could have a different conversation on another thread as to what it means and what would have to happen to overthrow the country. Not much more I can say on this topic but that the right isn’t going to tone down the rhetoric and the left can either continue the spiraling downward or use this as an opportunity to rebrand itself in a way that appeals to non hardcore righties and swing voters.
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I don't agree because I don't believe half the trump voters were knowledgeable about this or him, they simply voted for the party or for their eggs to be free again.
 
I believe fear is the simple driving factor towards embracing a "strong man" approach to government. Fear of change, fear of not creating a better life, fear of other, all magnified by orders of magnitude by social media. The strong man's team recognizes this and responds accordingly. The fear is real, and reasonable. The amplification of this fear can be, if left unchecked, Country destroying.
 
sringwal said:
I agree that the majority of voters didn’t share the perspective thst Trump and Vance are authoritarian, although I do believe some folks are yearning for authoritarianism.

With that in mind, there is a lot of evidence that supports the argument that Trump is an authoritarian. Show the evidence that he is not.

Regarding your point that the right is not going to tone down the rhetoric, why not? Why is this something that is solely the left’s responsibility?
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I remember when Trump was first elected in 2016 and people were still shocked by his social media posts and rantings in early 2017 that a right-winger on the roundtable on Meet the Press said that Democrats just needed to ignore him and be "the adult in the room". Yeah, that's worked out really well. Saying that is just another example of the ridiculous double standard that Democrats are now held to.
 
Callatoroy said:
Not at all. Just applying common sense and not being shepherded by people trying to scare me and rile me up. Sure worked on you apparently


Here’s your boogeyman

1757811153650.jpeg

Just curious, what do you think it would take to overthrow our democracy?
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Dude. The boogey man is Trump.
This is one of his warriors. He definitely had a bunch of fools who couldn’t deliver, but why is that okay?
 
BoonetheAiredale said:
I believe fear is the simple driving factor towards embracing a "strong man" approach to government. Fear of change, fear of not creating a better life, fear of other, all magnified by orders of magnitude by social media. The strong man's team recognizes this and responds accordingly. The fear is real, and reasonable. The amplification of this fear can be, if left unchecked, Country destroying.
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Yeah and at least 1920s/1930s Germany had the excuse of turning to a strongman after having gone through a brutal, costly war end with a punitive, embarrassing treaty, followed by an economic collapse and crushing inflation. They were ready to turn away from democracy because they thought democracy had failed all of them and they thought they literally had nothing to lose. As opposed to the modern USA, a country that for all its problems is prosperous, powerful, and at the top of the global world order, one that has been a democracy for its entire history and grown ever more rich and successful as a result, yet we still are becoming more miserable and more angry at each other to the point that people are willing to turn to a strongman mainly because we have let rich and powerful people divide us for the sake of their own ambition.
 
BoonetheAiredale said:
I believe fear is the simple driving factor towards embracing a "strong man" approach to government. Fear of change, fear of not creating a better life, fear of other, all magnified by orders of magnitude by social media. The strong man's team recognizes this and responds accordingly. The fear is real, and reasonable. The amplification of this fear can be, if left unchecked, Country destroying.
Click to expand...
For the "low-info" voter (many young voters fall into this bucket) this is definitely true. But theoretically a liberal president can appear strong, you don't have project authoritarian, or nationalistic or even populist views to come across as "strong".
 
Callatoroy said:
I don’t know what to tell you other than read the room. A majority of voters apparently didn’t share your view that they (trump, Vance) were fascists or authoritarians. It doesn’t matter at all if trump and his cabinet can “handle” it because it isn’t about them. It’s about voters and whether they can handle it. The left has overused the labels so much they become meaningless. For a year and a half leading up to the election the left absolutely hammered trump as fascist and a threat to democracy, and even said if you vote for him you are supporting racism, fascism, etc. Yet they still voted for him because they don’t believe it because it became meaningless due to over-exaggeration and hyperbole. Continuing to beat that ineffective drum hasn’t worked and continuing to won’t work either. We could have a different conversation on another thread as to what it means and what would have to happen to overthrow the country. Not much more I can say on this topic but that the right isn’t going to tone down the rhetoric and the left can either continue the spiraling downward or use this as an opportunity to rebrand itself in a way that appeals to non hardcore righties and swing voters.
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Leaving aside the debate about what the labels mean and whether it's fair to apply them to Trump and Vance, it's hard for me to believe that the voters who swung to Trump did so because of perceived "over-exaggeration and hyperbole" when that's the exact same thing they were getting from the Trump side about the left. The left is evil and hates America, the left hates God and God hates the left, the left wants to cut your kids' genitals off, the left wants to let teachers indoctrinate your kids to be gay and trans, Democrats want to replace white people with minorities, etc. Why didn't that turn off the voters who were supposedly turned off by being told Trump was a fascist, etc?
 
theel4life said:
Where are all the MAGA folks to defend shit like this? You get ghost when we show this type of stuff.
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I have to say some of the quotes are taken out of context. This is just bad. The man clearly had a Hangul about race. I mean who does he think he is to question the blackness or lack there of Kamala or any person of color. His remarks about Floyd Affirmative Action and Juneteenth relay bother me. Indefensible imo. The comments themselves are racist,and looking like might have been a racist. Maybe not he Klan variety but probably the type of racist that Affirmative Action is for.
 
BoonetheAiredale said:
I believe fear is the simple driving factor towards embracing a "strong man" approach to government. Fear of change, fear of not creating a better life, fear of other, all magnified by orders of magnitude by social media. The strong man's team recognizes this and responds accordingly. The fear is real, and reasonable. The amplification of this fear can be, if left unchecked, Country destroying.
Click to expand...
Strong man = the cowboy narrative. It's been used since Reagan to propt up the myth of doing it all on one's own. Cowboys were not what the myth portrayed, but who needs facts?
 
"In fact, a person on the left might argue, the data is clear — over the last decade, right-wing extremists have killed far more people than left-wing extremists."

But hey MAGA, never let the truth get in the way of a good story.

www.nytimes.com

Opinion | There Are Monsters in Your Midst, Too

No matter the direction of the tragedy, the end result is the same — the right grows angrier at the left, and the left grows angrier at the right.
www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com
 
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1moretimeagain said:
I think we’ve all faced a steep learning curve with regard to some aspects of this story. But not as steep as what Geraldo is facing.

Halo? What about Contra?


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My friends and I played the crap out of Halo in high school and college. I don’t know how I haven’t killed anyone yet.
 
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