Elon Musk / Tesla / SpaceX / Twitter

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superrific said:
I don't think there is a constitutional right to pay people to sign a petition. That there is no applicable statute perhaps speaks to the perceived wisdom of such a rule, but I can't see how the First Am would bar it.

Paying a canvasser is completely different. That's an employment relationship. I don't think it's governed by the First Amendment. For instance, suppose a canvassing firm wanted to pay its canvassers below minimum wage. I don't think there would be a First Am defense to that. Do you?

Think about it in terms of practicality. It would be really, really hard to get enough signatures for ballots without paying people. It is not hard at all to get people to sign a petition without being paid. This speaks, I think, to my argument above that canvassing is an employment activity and not political activity, but you could also look at it from the perspective of strict scrutiny. A law outlawing canvassing would be broad, and perhaps unlikely to be narrowly tailored as required by any form of heightened scrutiny. A law outlawing paying for signatures is much more narrowly tailored toward the problem at hand.

I don't think it's a hard case. As you know, my experience in criminal law is limited so what I think about the difficulty of proving it isn't worth that much, but at least in theory I don't think it's hard.
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The issue, as I understand it from the Hazen post linked above, is not the paid canvassers. It is the lottery for registered voters in swing states signing a petition.

I could see this Supreme Court saying Musk has a right to do what he is doing. After all, he is not vote buying - he is arguably registration buying, which is not that much different from a paid get out the vote campaign. After all, we supposedly think it is a societal good to have more registered voters.
 
nycfan said:
From link above:

“An initiative called Progress 2028 that purports to be Kamala Harris’ liberal counter to the conservative Heritage Foundation’s Project 2025 is actually run by a dark money network supporting former President Donald Trump.

Building America’s Future, the dark money group at the helm of the network, has steered money to a constellation of groups and initiatives boosting Trump’s agenda and spreading messaging aimed at chipping away voters from Harris. The dark money group reportedly received over $100 million in funding from billionaire Elon Musk, along with other donors, the New York Times recently reported.

The newest effort to benefit from their largesse is Progress 2028. Building America’s Future registered to use Progress 2028 as a fictitious nameon Sept. 23 and the website was created three days later, OpenSecrets’ analysis of corporate filings and DNS records found. …

Some of the policies listed in Progress 2028 highlight disproven and misleading claims about Harris’ positions. Policies listed include “Empowering Undocumented Immigrants, Building Our Future” and “Expanding Medicaid to Undocumented Immigrants.” …”
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Why isn’t the mainstream media reporting progress 2028? Elon Musk is a GD menace!
 
“… Many other titans of Silicon Valley have tethered themselves to Trump. But Musk is the one poised to live out the ultimate techno-authoritarian fantasy. With his influence, he stands to capture the state, not just to enrich himself.

His entanglement with Trump will be an Ayn Rand novel sprung to life, because Trump has explicitly invited Musk into the government to play the role of the master engineer, who redesigns the American state—and therefore American life—in his own image.

… Like so many other billionaire exponents of libertarianism, he has turned the government into a spectacular profit center. His company SpaceX relies on contracts with three-letter agencies and the Pentagon. It has subsumed some of NASA’s core functions. Tesla thrives on government tax credits for electric vehicles and subsidies for its network of charging stations. By Politico’s tabulation, both companies have won $15 billion in federal contracts. But that’s just his business plan in beta form. According to The Wall Street Journal, SpaceX is designing a slew of new products with “national security customers in mind.”

… Musk will advocate for privatizing the government, outsourcing the affairs of state to nimble entrepreneurs and adroit technologists. That means there will be even more opportunities for his companies to score gargantuan contracts. So when Trump brags that Musk will send a rocket to Mars during his administration, he’s not imagining a reprise of the Apollo program. He’s envisioning cutting SpaceX one of the largest checks that the U.S. government has ever written. He’s talking about making the richest man in the world even richer. …”
 
“… This isn’t a standard-issue case of oligarchy. It is an apotheosis of the egotism and social Darwinism embedded in Silicon Valley’s pursuit of monopoly—the sense that concentration of power in the hands of geniuses is the most desirable social arrangement.

As Peter Thiel once put it, “Competition is for losers.” (He also bluntly admitted, “I no longer believe that freedom and democracy are compatible.”) In this worldview, restraints on power are for losers, too.

… At a moment when the government is confronting crucial decisions about the future of AI and the commercialization of space, his [Musk’s] ideals will hold sway.

… At Tesla, Musk assigned himself the title of “technoking.” That moniker, which sits on the line between jokiness and monomania, captures the danger.

Following the example set by Trump, he wouldn’t need to divest himself from his businesses, not even his social-media company. In an administration that brashly disrespects its critics, he wouldn’t need to fear congressional oversight and could brush aside any American who dares to question his role. Of all the risks posed by a second Trump term, this might be one of the most terrifying.”

Wizard Of Oz GIF
 
gtyellowjacket said:
He really is pretty terrible but he does have some great companies. SpaceX is about half the cost of Boeing's equivalent rocket. Boeing was bilking taxpayers for forever until a serious competitor got into the game.

The competition has caught up with their electric car offerings but Tesla still has the best self-driving technology out there And without Musk, I don't think we see the big companies introducing things that would replace greenhouse gas spewing cars anytime soon.

Starlink is a terrific way to get an internet service to people that usually can't have it.

I actually forgot this but Musk co-founded open AI which really gave us the first widespread consumer focused AI platform with ChatGPT.

And as much as folks complain about the Twitter, we all love nyc's posts which are all Twitter. It's a great platform for spreading information.

I think people use his companies because he's been involved with some pretty great companies.
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Those companies are not him. It seems like he no longer involved in every day to day function of those companies and rather is doing a lot of drugs and trying to ruin American by supporting the turd.

Twitter has went down hill since he purchased it. It's 80% maga now and not a place for the open discussion he claims to love.

It's also interesting how much funding for those companies comes from the government.

Starlink might be the one that seems to actually be helping people.

BUT, non of this matters. What he's openly doing to try and buy off the election for the turd is much worse than any good we get from the companies.
 
UNCatTech said:
Those companies are not him. It seems like he no longer involved in every day to day function of those companies and rather is doing a lot of drugs and trying to ruin American by supporting the turd.

Twitter has went down hill since he purchased it. It's 80% maga now and not a place for the open discussion he claims to love.

It's also interesting how much funding for those companies comes from the government.

Starlink might be the one that seems to actually be helping people.

BUT, non of this matters. What he's openly doing to try and buy off the election for the turd is much worse than any good we get from the companies.
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Reminds me of Ross Perot raging about big government but of course made most of his money off the government.
 
Paine said:
Yeah, just like Bill and Melinda Gates advanced education.

Tesla was bought by Musk, he didn’t build it. Its success is despite him not because of him. He’s supporting a presidential candidate that actively works against the electric vehicle industry.

Expanding internet access with what? Starlink? The government can provide internet access much cheaper and better than Musk ever could.

Lowering the cost of space missions? Again, if we funded NASA, we could do all of this without involving a billionaire freak.
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Tesla's been operating under Elon's push for almost 25 years and everyone else has been chasing to catch up.
Starlink can provide rural internet today. Check the progress of BEAD.
SpaceX is doing things NASA cannnot, today.
 
ColdBlueSteel said:
Tesla's been operating under Elon's push for almost 25 years and everyone else has been chasing to catch up.
Starlink can provide rural internet today. Check the progress of BEAD.
SpaceX is doing things NASA cannnot, today.
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The government is providing rural broadband today and not charging a fee to do so. Most rural people who lack internet aren’t going to be able to get it through Starlink.

How much money has been cut from the NASA budget in order to give contracts to Boeing, SpaceX, etc? Does that contribute to NASA not being able to do things?

You’re right that others have been trying to catch up to Tesla, but I don’t think that has anything to do with Musk. They have been better marketed than other EVs for a long time. It’s not like Musk had some sort of major innovation that he brought to the table. In fact, Tesla has consistently overpromised and under delivered under Musk.

Regardless of any of this, it’s silly to sit here and act like Musk is some sort of technology savant. He has made some good bets like a lot of businessmen. Now that’s he’s filthy rich, he can afford to lose a lot of them too.

Even if he was what his supporters make him out to be, his absolutely retrograde political views would negate any other accomplishments.
 
www.yahoo.com

Elon Musk ‘Jokes’ in a Church About Someone Killing Kamala Harris

“Assassinating a puppet is pointless,” the Trump-backing billionaire said in a Saturday church appearance
www.yahoo.com www.yahoo.com

Elon Musk ‘Jokes’ in a Church About Someone Killing Kamala Harris​


“… Acting as a Donald Trump surrogate — in addition to the $75 million moneyman behind a leading Trump Super PAC — Musk spoke Saturday night at the Life Center megachurch in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, which is notable for launching the career of Christian supremacist God-rocker Sean Feucht.

… But Musk also used the pro-gun rally to attempt — for at least the third time — to land his “joke” about someone making an attempt on the life of Trump’s rival and the sitting vice president, Harris.

“I just call it the machine, [the] big government machine,” Musk told attendees of his church rally. “And when the Biden puppet was not working out, they got a new puppet. But it’s still the same machine, obviously,” he added of Harris replacing President Joe Biden at the top of the ticket. Musk then alleged that returning Trump to the White House would be “the thing that scares the system” because “Donald Trump is not a puppet, he’s a real person,” adding darkly, “That’s why they’re … trying to kill him.”

It was then that Musk reprised his quip about the death of the vice president. “I mentioned as a joke — I meant it as a joke — that no one’s even bothering to try to kill Kamala,” Musk said.

“Because there’s no point. There’s no point. [They’d] just get another puppet, you know.” The billionaire hastened to add, “I’m not suggesting someone should try to kill her. It’s pointless! I’m just making an observation. Nobody’s bothered. Why is that? Because it doesn’t matter. Yeah? Assassinating a puppet is pointless.”

This is at least the third time the world’s richest man — whose billions significantly derive from his role as a government contractor — has attempted to stick this “joke” for a global audience. The first time was on his X platform, where Musk has 200 million followers. Responding to someone who asked why do “they want to kill Donald Trump?” Musk wrote in September: “And no one is even trying to assassinate Biden/Kamala 🤔.” (Musk deleted his post after backlash, writing: “One lesson I’ve learned is that just because I say something to a group and they laugh doesn’t mean it’s going to be all that hilarious as a post on X.”) …”
 
nycfan said:
www.yahoo.com

Elon Musk ‘Jokes’ in a Church About Someone Killing Kamala Harris

“Assassinating a puppet is pointless,” the Trump-backing billionaire said in a Saturday church appearance
www.yahoo.com www.yahoo.com

Elon Musk ‘Jokes’ in a Church About Someone Killing Kamala Harris​


“… Acting as a Donald Trump surrogate — in addition to the $75 million moneyman behind a leading Trump Super PAC — Musk spoke Saturday night at the Life Center megachurch in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, which is notable for launching the career of Christian supremacist God-rocker Sean Feucht.

… But Musk also used the pro-gun rally to attempt — for at least the third time — to land his “joke” about someone making an attempt on the life of Trump’s rival and the sitting vice president, Harris.

“I just call it the machine, [the] big government machine,” Musk told attendees of his church rally. “And when the Biden puppet was not working out, they got a new puppet. But it’s still the same machine, obviously,” he added of Harris replacing President Joe Biden at the top of the ticket. Musk then alleged that returning Trump to the White House would be “the thing that scares the system” because “Donald Trump is not a puppet, he’s a real person,” adding darkly, “That’s why they’re … trying to kill him.”

It was then that Musk reprised his quip about the death of the vice president. “I mentioned as a joke — I meant it as a joke — that no one’s even bothering to try to kill Kamala,” Musk said.

“Because there’s no point. There’s no point. [They’d] just get another puppet, you know.” The billionaire hastened to add, “I’m not suggesting someone should try to kill her. It’s pointless! I’m just making an observation. Nobody’s bothered. Why is that? Because it doesn’t matter. Yeah? Assassinating a puppet is pointless.”

This is at least the third time the world’s richest man — whose billions significantly derive from his role as a government contractor — has attempted to stick this “joke” for a global audience. The first time was on his X platform, where Musk has 200 million followers. Responding to someone who asked why do “they want to kill Donald Trump?” Musk wrote in September: “And no one is even trying to assassinate Biden/Kamala 🤔.” (Musk deleted his post after backlash, writing: “One lesson I’ve learned is that just because I say something to a group and they laugh doesn’t mean it’s going to be all that hilarious as a post on X.”) …”
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Musk in a church is enough of a joke in itself.
 
JCTarheel82 said:
While railing against big government. Every aspect of MAGA is beyond parody.
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I still think it is hilarious (in a terrible way, I guess) that Musk is apparently STILL smarting from posting a "joke" (why doesn't anyone assassinate Harris) that he claims all his entourage got and totally thought was hilarious is not actually funny. He keeps saying it like everyone will eventually get it and praise him for the comic genius his entourage assures him he is.

Otherwise, would love for someone to point out that people also tried to assassinate George Wallace and Hitler. Having someone try to kill you is horrible but doesn't mean you are some great person. And I even get that his response would probably be well, at least they were important enough for someone to try to kill. But what about all the women murdered by significant others? What about the poor guy behind Trump who got killed by the assassin? Ordinary people are murdered all the time.
 
nycfan said:
I still think it is hilarious (in a terrible way, I guess) that Musk is apparently STILL smarting from posting a "joke" (why doesn't anyone assassinate Harris) that he claims all his entourage got and totally thought was hilarious is not actually funny. He keeps saying it like everyone will eventually get it and praise him for the comic genius his entourage assures him he is.

Otherwise, would love for someone to point out that people also tried to assassinate George Wallace and Hitler. Having someone try to kill you is horrible but doesn't mean you are some great person. And I even get that his response would probably be well, at least they were important enough for someone to try to kill. But what about all the women murdered by significant others? What about the poor guy behind Trump who got killed by the assassin? Ordinary people are murdered all the time.
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I heard this interview one time with a newly minted billionaire and he was very introspective reflecting on how his life changed. One of the first things he thought about was that he was never going to tell an unfunny joke again. He did not consider that a good thing.
 
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