—> ICE / Immigration Catch-All

  • Thread starter Thread starter nycfan
  • Start date Start date
  • Replies: 2K
  • Views: 94K
  • Politics 
ZenMode said:
He didn't have to be here. Every death caused by an illegal immigrant could have been prevented.
Click to expand...
You continue to be math illiterate and generally a moron. If you really can't understand the logical fallacy here, you should ask the neurosurgeon for your money back
 
ZenMode said:

Illegal migrant truck driver suspect in deadly Florida crash was given work permit under Biden after being denied by Trump: DHS​


.........Harjinder Singh crossed the southern border into California in September 2018 and was processed for fast-track deportation by the first Trump administration, sources told The Post.

The Indian national was previously processed for deportation, but was able to stay after claiming he feared being sent back home. Singh was later released on a $5,000 immigration bond in January 2019 and still awaits a decision on his asylum case.

After receiving his work permit in June 2021, Singh was able to secure a Commercial Driver’s License in California, according to DHS.



nypost.com

Illegal migrant truck driver suspect in deadly Florida crash was given work permit under Biden after being denied by Trump: DHS

After receiving his work permit, Singh was able to secure a Commercial Driver’s License in California, DHS said.
nypost.com nypost.com
Click to expand...

Shane Jason Woods: Woods pleaded guilty to assaulting police and a press photographer. After Trump’s pardon, Woods was convicted in April for multiple counts including reckless homicide and driving under the influence in 2022.

At least 10 pardoned insurrectionists face other criminal charges - CREW | Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington At least 10 pardoned insurrectionists face other criminal charges - CREW | Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington
 
BillOfRights said:
Shane Jason Woods: Woods pleaded guilty to assaulting police and a press photographer. After Trump’s pardon, Woods was convicted in April for multiple counts including reckless homicide and driving under the influence in 2022.

At least 10 pardoned insurrectionists face other criminal charges - CREW | Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington At least 10 pardoned insurrectionists face other criminal charges - CREW | Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington
Click to expand...
I'm not entirely sure what the connection is, but I did not support any of the pardons for January 6th rioters, especially those that were violent towards police officers.
 
Here is a piece by Barbara Kingsolver, written after September 11th.



The Los Angeles Times
Sunday, September 23, 2001

A Pure, High Note of Anguish
by Barbara Kingsolver​

TUCSON -- I want to do something to help right now. But I can't give blood (my hematocrit always runs too low), and I'm too far away to give anybody shelter or a drink of water. I can only give words. My verbal hemoglobin never seems to wane, so words are what I'll offer up in this time that asks of us the best citizenship we've ever mustered. I don't mean to say I have a cure. Answers to the main questions of the day--Where was that fourth plane headed? How did they get knives through security?--I don't know any of that. I have some answers, but only to the questions nobody is asking right now but my 5-year old. Why did all those people die when they didn't do anything wrong? Will it happen to me? Is this the worst thing that's ever happened? Who were those children cheering that they showed for just a minute, and why were they glad? Please, will this ever, ever happen to me?

There are so many answers, and none: It is desperately painful to see people die without having done anything to deserve it, and yet this is how lives end nearly always. We get old or we don't, we get cancer, we starve, we are battered, we get on a plane thinking we're going home but never make it. There are blessings and wonders and horrific bad luck and no guarantees. We like to pretend life is different from that, more like a game we can actually win with the right strategy, but it isn't. And, yes, it's the worst thing that's happened, but only this week. Two years ago, an earthquake in Turkey killed 17,000 people in a day, babies and mothers and businessmen, and not one of them did a thing to cause it. The November before that, a hurricane hit Honduras and Nicaragua and killed even more, buried whole villages and erased family lines and even now, people wake up there empty-handed. Which end of the world shall we talk about? Sixty years ago, Japanese airplanes bombed Navy boys who were sleeping on ships in gentle Pacific waters. Three and a half years later, American planes bombed a plaza in Japan where men and women were going to work, where schoolchildren were playing, and more humans died at once than anyone thought possible. Seventy thousand in a minute. Imagine. Then twice that many more, slowly, from the inside.​
There are no worst days, it seems. Ten years ago, early on a January morning, bombs rained down from the sky and caused great buildings in the city of Baghdad to fall down--hotels, hospitals, palaces, buildings with mothers and soldiers inside--and here in the place I want to love best, I had to watch people cheering about it. In Baghdad, survivors shook their fists at the sky and said the word "evil." When many lives are lost all at once, people gather together and say words like "heinous" and "honor" and "revenge," presuming to make this awful moment stand apart somehow from the ways people die a little each day from sickness or hunger. They raise up their compatriots' lives to a sacred place--we do this, all of us who are human--thinking our own citizens to be more worthy of grief and less willingly risked than lives on other soil. But broken hearts are not mended in this ceremony, because, really, every life that ends is utterly its own event--and also in some way it's the same as all others, a light going out that ached to burn longer. Even if you never had the chance to love the light that's gone, you miss it. You should. You bear this world and everything that's wrong with it by holding life still precious, each time, and starting over.

And those children dancing in the street? That is the hardest question. We would rather discuss trails of evidence and whom to stamp out, even the size and shape of the cage we might put ourselves in to stay safe, than to mention the fact that our nation is not universally beloved; we are also despised. And not just by "The Terrorist," that lone, deranged non-man in a bad photograph whose opinion we can clearly dismiss, but by ordinary people in many lands. Even by little boys--whole towns full of them it looked like--jumping for joy in school shoes and pilled woolen sweaters.

There are a hundred ways to be a good citizen, and one of them is to look finally at the things we don't want to see. In a week of terrifying events, here is one awful, true thing that hasn't much been mentioned: Some people believe our country needed to learn how to hurt in this new way. This is such a large lesson, so hatefully, wrongfully taught, but many people before us have learned honest truths from wrongful deaths. It still may be within our capacity of mercy to say this much is true: We didn't really understand how it felt when citizens were buried alive in Turkey or Nicaragua or Hiroshima. Or that night in Baghdad. And we haven't cared enough for the particular brothers and mothers taken down a limb or a life at a time, for such a span of years that those little, briefly jubilant boys have grown up with twisted hearts. How could we keep raining down bombs and selling weapons, if we had? How can our president still use that word "attack" so casually, like a move in a checker game, now that we have awakened to see that word in our own newspapers, used like this: Attack on America.

Surely, the whole world grieves for us right now. And surely it also hopes we might have learned, from the taste of our own blood, that every war is both won and lost, and that loss is a pure, high note of anguish like a mother singing to any empty bed. The mortal citizens of a planet are praying right now that we will bear in mind, better than ever before, that no kind of bomb ever built will extinguish hatred.

"Will this happen to me?" is the wrong question, I'm sad to say. It always was.

©2001 Los Angeles Times​
 
sringwal said:
And what if sending someone back to an unsafe environment causes their untimely death, or that of their child? Was that death, too, preventable?

Does life only matter if it is on United States' soil? Is life, somehow, more precious based on where someone happens to enter it?
Click to expand...
There are correct ways to claim asylum and enter the US for situations that warrant it. This guy did not follow that process. He snuck in and, when caught, claimed asylum. He's not married. Has no kids. Knows nobody in the US, etc.

He should have been deported as soon as caught, IMO.
 
Last edited:
ZenMode said:
There's no math that makes what I said untrue.
Click to expand...
What you said is true of every single unplanned death. Every time someone dies in a car accident, that could have been prevented if that person had decided not to drive that day, or took a different route, or what have you.

So if you want to defend yourself by claiming to have typed out a tautology, I mean, you do you. You didn't make a point. You could have saved time and electrons by typing the equally vapid 1=1.

If you were trying to make a point, it is defeated by simple arithmetic that has been presented to you and I'm not going to do it again.

I would be mortified if I ever came close to proudly asserting a tautology.
 
ZenMode said:
There are correct ways to claim asylum and enter the US for situations that warrant it. This guy did not follow that process. He snuck in and, when caught, claimed asylum. He's not married. Has no kids. Knows nobody I'm the US, etc.

He should have been deported as soon as caught, IMO.
Click to expand...

Enter at Your Own Risk: Criminalizing Asylum-Seekers – Columbia Human Rights Law Review

hrlr.law.columbia.edu hrlr.law.columbia.edu

"Particularly disturbing is the targeting of asylum-seekers, employing the criminal justice system and the illegal entry statute in the “zero tolerance policy.” Under this policy, children, including toddlers, are seized and languish for months and years separate from their families, many of whom are seeking asylum. Directly contrary to federal statute and international law, another policy makes anyone who enters the country without inspection ineligible for asylum. Kirstjen Nielsen, Trump’s second Secretary of the Department of Homeland Security (“DHS”), ordered asylum applicants to await the lengthy processing of their claims in cartel-ruled border areas of Mexico, with no realistic safe shelter and deprived of all meaningful opportunity to exercise their statutorily-guaranteed right to access to counsel—a necessity, given today’s convoluted asylum law."

www.usccb.org

Why Don't Unauthorized Migrants Come Here Legally?

United States Conference of Catholic BishopsMigration and Refugee Services Migration Policy and Public Affairs Issue Briefing Series, Issue #1 Why Don't They...
www.usccb.org www.usccb.org
Under current laws, no "line" for lawful immigration to the United States actually exists for the majority of our immigrants.

So, why didn't they just "stand in line" to do so? For the large majority of unauthorized immigrants, no such "line" exists. Under the current immigration legal framework, lawful immigration to the United States is restricted to only a few narrow categories of persons.xvii Most current unauthorized immigrants residing in the United States are ineligible to enter legally with a "green card" as a lawful permanent resident for the purpose of living and working in the country. This is because most do not have the family relationships required to apply for lawful entry; they do not qualify as asylees because of economic hardship as such status is available only to those who are fleeing persecution; and the majority of the unauthorized do not hold advanced degrees and work in the high-skilled professions that would qualify them for work-sponsored lawful permanent residency.

U.S. immigration laws provide three core means by which an immigrant may obtain lawful permanent residency.(xviii) First, a qualified family member in the United States may petition to bring a foreign-born family member to the country lawfully. U.S. Citizens may petition for lawful permanent residency for their spouses, parents, children or siblings. Lawful Permanent Residents in the country may petition for their foreign-born spouses and unmarried children. To do so, sponsors must demonstrate an income level above poverty line and must commit to financially support the sponsored, foreign-born family member so that they do not become a public charge. The foreign-born immigrant, in turn, must meet all other eligibility requirements.(xix) However, there are numeric limitations on most of these family-based categories, resulting in backlogs for entry that often range anywhere from five years to nearly 20 years.

Second, immigrants fleeing political persecution or a well-founded fear of future persecution on account of their race, religion, membership in a particular social group, political opinion or national origin may seek political asylum in the United States or qualify for refugee status. To do so, they must meet a high evidentiary burden. Even if they do qualify for refugee status, there is an annual cap on the number of refugee admissions to the United States, which is set annually and is typically between 70,000 and 80,000.(xx) Most of today's unauthorized immigrants are fleeing poverty in their home countries, not political persecution. As a result, they do not qualify for asylum.

Third, and significantly, there are various immigration categories for workers to be sponsored by a U.S.-based employer to come to the United States to work and live lawfully. However, these categories are limited to multinational executives and professors; those with advance degrees, the exceptional in the arts, sciences or business; and narrowly-defined, specialized workers.xxi Today's unauthorized immigrants are largely low-skilled workers who come to the United States for work to support their families. They work in the agricultural, meatpacking, landscaping, services, and construction industries in the United States. They fill the ranks of U.S. businesses, large and small throughout the country. Over the past several decades, the demand by U.S. businesses for low-skilled workers has grown exponentially, while the supply of available workers for low-skilled jobs in the United States has diminished.(xxii) Yet, there are only 5,000 green cards available annually for low-skilled workers to enter the United States lawfully.(xxiii) This number stands in stark contrast to the estimated 300,000 immigrants who enter the United States unlawfully each year, most of whom are looking for work.(xxiv) The only alternative to this is to secure a temporary work visa through the H-2A (seasonal agricultural) or H2B (seasonal non-agricultural) visa programs which provide temporary status to low-skilled workers seeking to enter the country lawfully. While H-2A visas are not numerically capped, the requirements are onerous. H-2B visas are capped at 66,000 annually. Both only provide temporary status to work for a U.S. employer for one year.(xxv) At their current numbers, these are woefully insufficient to provide legal means for the foreign-born to enter the United States to live and work, and thereby meet our demand for foreign-born labor.
 
ZenMode said:
That isn't a case for allowing illegal immigrants. That a case for a more robust guest worker program.
Click to expand...
And your bullshit wasn't a case for anything. It was a red meat nasty slur meant to somehow paint all illegal immigrants as being responsible for the crimes of one.

If you'd stop being so grotesque in your overarching belief that you must justify an absolutist position on everything, you might actually be part of a solution and not a huge part of the problem.
 
wmheel1287 said:
And your bullshit wasn't a case for anything. It was a red meat nasty slur meant to somehow paint all illegal immigrants as being responsible for the crimes of one.
Click to expand...
Nope. There are plenty of illegal immigrants who are here to work and improve their lives. My daughter works with more than a half dozen of them.

wmheel1287 said:
If you'd stop being so grotesque in your overarching belief that you must justify an absolutist position on everything, you might actually be part of a solution and not a huge part of the problem.
Click to expand...
The fact remains that if we were more diligent about deporting people who don't follow the asylum rules, especially those who have already committed crimes, they wouldn't be here to commit more crimes and kill innocent people.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top