Iran Catch-All | IRAN WAR

  • Thread starter Thread starter nycfan
  • Start date Start date
  • Replies: 5K
  • Views: 146K
  • Politics 
theel4life said:
What is Trump’s end game here?
Click to expand...
I'm starting to think about it this way. Trump is a property developer. That's all he knows. He's generally a shitty property developer who has, at best, ridden the back of New York's economic success over the last 50 years, but when it comes down to it, Trump doesn't know shit about policy. He doesn't know shit about international relations. He doesn't know shit about pretty much anything except building "permanent" memorials to his greatness.

Trump 2.0 is all about building those memorials. Some are literal -- the Oval Office, the Rose Garden, the ballroom, the arch, the Kennedy Center. Some are not -- "peace in the Middle East." Trump has no fucking clue whether a policy proposal is good or bad, whether it's in America's interest or not. But if someone comes to him and says, "Mr. President, if you do this, you'll be remembered forever," Trump is pretty much an automatic yes.

Bibi figured that out a long time ago. And that's why we're where we are. So, to answer your question, there's no end game. From Trump's perspective, the end game is eternal glory for solving the Middle East problem. But that's literally impossible, as everyone except Trump and a few of his naive supporters know. Bibi certainly knows the problem can't be solved -- at best, the lines can be redrawn for the battles to be fought by the next generation. But Trump is incapable of that type of long-term strategic thinking. And thus, here we are.

1772812522716.png
 
Calheel said:
Like I say, there are A LOT of Iranians in Southern California.
Click to expand...
And in my part of SoCal (the Valley) many of those Iranians were Jews. Under the Shah, Jews were emancipated and although they were a significant minority there, they played a disproportionate role in cultural, medical, and economic affairs. Immediately after the Islamic Revolution, tens of thousand of Iranian Jews emigrated and many of them landed in SoCal. My wife's teaching partner in LA was an Iranian Jew. Also, they refused to refer to themselves as Iranians, preferring to be referred to as Persians.

A World Cup took place while we were living in Sherman Oaks in the early 2000s. Iran was playing a match one afternoon and you could hear the people cheering for the Iranian team coming from the condo/apartment buildings in our area.
 
CFordUNC said:


Boy, forget “too emotional”, the American Conservative has gone WOKE!!!!
Click to expand...

The lesson here is there's an exceptionally fine line between useful idiot and scapegoat. Trump has done an extraordinary job maintaining his status as a useful idiot for 10+ years now. It almost collapsed in early 2021, but Mitch gave him a lifeline.

Now, though, everyone is realizing Trump's idiocy cannot be useful any longer. And thus, we're moving to the land of scapegoating. Which is never, by definition, entirely fair, but in this particular case is fair by many multiples.
 
lawtig02 said:
The lesson here is there's an exceptionally fine line between useful idiot and scapegoat. Trump has done an extraordinary job maintaining his status as a useful idiot for 10+ years now. It almost collapsed in early 2021, but Mitch gave him a lifeline.

Now, though, everyone is realizing Trump's idiocy cannot be useful any longer. And thus, we're moving to the land of scapegoating. Which is never, by definition, entirely fair, but in this particular case is fair by many multiples.
Click to expand...
By the way, this is at the crux of the discussion Calla and I have had on this board and the ZZLP for a long time now. Calla thinks Trump is a useful idiot. I think Trump is the worst of us, and no amount of usefulness, to the extent it exists, could justify entrusting him with the power he has now been given twice by the American people.

I strongly suspect Trump has now set in motion dynamics that will cause many of those who have seen him as a useful idiot to scapegoat him instead. This is, in my opinion, America's best hope. It's not just important that we defeat Trump. It's that MAGA be tarred more broadly with Trump's infinite sins. This must stand as the moment we peered into the heart of our darkness but did not follow. Otherwise, we have little hope.
 
gtyellowjacket said:
They didn't. Are you hoping to have that discussion again because I think we've beat it to death at this point.
Click to expand...
You just confused me, is all, when you misspoke. I haven't read the entire thread so I guess I missed the horse beating portion. You said we're at war but only Congress can declare war. So we're not actually at war. Carry on.
 
lawtig02 said:
By the way, this is at the crux of the discussion Calla and I have had on this board and the ZZLP for a long time now. Calla thinks Trump is a useful idiot. I think Trump is the worst of us, and no amount of usefulness, to the extent it exists, could justify entrusting him with the power he has now been given twice by the American people.

I strongly suspect Trump has now set in motion dynamics that will cause many of those who have seen him as a useful idiot to scapegoat him instead. This is, in my opinion, America's best hope. It's not just important that we defeat Trump. It's that MAGA be tarred more broadly with Trump's infinite sins. This must stand as the moment we peered into the heart of our darkness but did not follow. Otherwise, we have little hope.
Click to expand...
I hear you, and definitely understand the sentiment, but if we are waiting for shitbirds like Ram and shit-for-brains like calla, and the millions of like-minded morons in the MAGA movement, to ever accept or acknowledge that they were wrong, we are going to be waiting forever. I think you are far too charitable about calla’s supposed belief that Donald Trump is a useful idiot. I do not believe for one solitary split second that calla disagrees with Trump on anything, no matter what he says here on this board. Nobody who actually thinks that Donald Trump is a useful idiot or disagrees with him would be so perpetually angry and aggrieved and lash out and project so intensely in defense of Trump‘s every move the way calla does. calla is a way too much of a chickenshit to actually have immutable principles and beliefs.

I also don’t believe that anyone in the MAGA cult will actually scapegoat Trump. They are too far dug in, and it is far too deeply a part of their entire identity now. More than likely, once Trump dies – which is hopefully soon- those people will just skulk back under their rocks and into their trailer parks as if nothing ever happened.

Those of us actual classical conservatives who were actually going to abandon Trump, did so no later than January 7, 2021.
 
Last edited:
lawtig02 said:
By the way, this is at the crux of the discussion Calla and I have had on this board and the ZZLP for a long time now. Calla thinks Trump is a useful idiot. I think Trump is the worst of us, and no amount of usefulness, to the extent it exists, could justify entrusting him with the power he has now been given twice by the American people.

I strongly suspect Trump has now set in motion dynamics that will cause many of those who have seen him as a useful idiot to scapegoat him instead. This is, in my opinion, America's best hope. It's not just important that we defeat Trump. It's that MAGA be tarred more broadly with Trump's infinite sins. This must stand as the moment we peered into the heart of our darkness but did not follow. Otherwise, we have little hope.
Click to expand...
I could not possibly agree more with your take on Trump and on this situation.

I will add that i think the anger being displayed by so many of the "he's a useful idiot" crowd is the manifestation of their own realization that Trump is fucking us all. They know this is the final straw and it absolutley must work out they have to admit to themselves that everyone else was right about Trump all along.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top