Iran Catch-All | IRAN WAR

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Callatoroy said:
So are you ok in 5 years handing that regime nuclear bombs? Because that is exactly what that agreement did.

Israel (nor SA, UAE, Jordan, Iraq, etc) surely wouldn’t be ok and we would be in a much worse situation with a much higher threat of nuclear weapons being used. It’s existential to Israel. Not sure how people don’t understand how fucked it would be for the US to green light Iran’s development of nukes

My intent in criticizing the agreement wasn’t an indictment of Obama. Pub and dem presidents have kicked the can down the road since the revolution and all share in the blame in not addressing the Iran nuke problem. Trump decided to not kick the can anymore for a multitude of reasons. Reasonable people can agree with it or disagree. I happen to agree. That doesn’t mean I agree with everything he has done since and sure as hell doesn’t mean I agree with what has come out of his mouth. He has made it much harder than he had to but that is how he rolls. We disagree on the decision to act, but I have many of the same concerns you do.
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You keep saying things like “this is how he rolls” and “this is the messaging” as if those things do not matter. They do matter. They are of significant importance.

You wave away concerns about rhetoric and propaganda as if they were insignificant gnats, but the rhetoric and propaganda go to the soul of who Trump is. His bluster and hatred that litter his talk are part and parcel of who he is and his policies. It’s why supporters think they have free rein to storm the capitol on January 6. It’s why ICE thinks they can just shoot and detain people without warrants. It’s why we have a secretary of defense invoking holy war and having his Christian nationalist pastor spreading his hatred at government functions. It’s why the administration cites racist white supremacists to try and overturn birthright citizenship.
Our president is an awful person who supports awful ideas. There is no separating his ridiculous, inflammatory rhetoric from who he is as a person or who he is as president.
 
LeoBloom said:
You keep saying things like “this is how he rolls” and “this is the messaging” as if those things do not matter. They do matter. They are of significant importance.

You wave away concerns about rhetoric and propaganda as if they were insignificant gnats, but the rhetoric and propaganda go to the soul of who Trump is. His bluster and hatred that litter his talk are part and parcel of who he is and his policies. It’s why supporters think they have free rein to storm the capitol on January 6. It’s why ICE thinks they can just shoot and detain people without warrants. It’s why we have a secretary of defense invoking holy war and having his Christian nationalist pastor spreading his hatred at government functions. It’s why the administration cites racist white supremacists to try and overturn birthright citizenship.
Our president is an awful person who supports awful ideas. There is no separating his ridiculous, inflammatory rhetoric from who he is as a person or who he is as president.
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You are right that rhetoric and propaganda matter. I so wish he wouldn’t act like and talk like a petulant child. His comments about the SC today are horrible. However, the difference between you and me is that I place more importance on the actions and policies than the rhetoric and crass behavior. I despise the behavior. You despise the behavior and the policy. It is possible to like the policies and not the man. I have accepted he isn’t going to start behaving and speaking presidentially. I can dwell on it while knowing it won’t change or accept that it won’t change and be less angry by the baffoonery.
 
Calheel said:
So it is the Iran speech that has allies concerned? Not the years of complete buffoonery and incompetence before that?

I have trouble believing that this speech moved the needle in any way in how our allies view Donald Trump.
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I don’t think he meant that it was the first instance of concern from US allies.
 
Callatoroy said:
Water is wet

Farce “no it’s not”
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trump sounds nuet dr a review of them
LeoBloom said:
You keep saying things like “this is how he rolls” and “this is the messaging” as if those things do not matter. They do matter. They are of significant importance.

You wave away concerns about rhetoric and propaganda as if they were insignificant gnats, but the rhetoric and propaganda go to the soul of who Trump is. His bluster and hatred that litter his talk are part and parcel of who he is and his policies. It’s why supporters think they have free rein to storm the capitol on January 6. It’s why ICE thinks they can just shoot and detain people without warrants. It’s why we have a secretary of defense invoking holy war and having his Christian nationalist pastor spreading his hatred at government functions. It’s why the administration cites racist white supremacists to try and overturn birthright citizenship.
Our president is an awful person who supports awful ideas. There is no separating his ridiculous, inflammatory rhetoric from who he is as a person or who he is as president.
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Yeah, but how otherwise can you look at the facts of whats going on here, epstein, grift or just huckster behavior?

They give him this talking point..
 
Callatoroy said:
You are right that rhetoric and propaganda matter. I so wish he wouldn’t act like and talk like a petulant child. His comments about the SC today are horrible. However, the difference between you and me is that I place more importance on the actions and policies than the rhetoric and crass behavior. I despise the behavior. You despise the behavior and the policy. It is possible to like the policies and not the man. I have accepted he isn’t going to start behaving and speaking presidentially. I can dwell on it while knowing it won’t change or accept that it won’t change and be less angry by the baffoonery.
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What I think you miss, though, is that the rhetoric is part of the action. Trump’s rhetoric becomes policy.
 
Speaking of not agreeing with Trump’s policies, here are things Republicans and I agreed upon on November 4, 2024:

1. We don’t want to get involved in foreign entanglements.
2. We don’t want war, specifically with Iran.
3. We are not into regime change.
4. We don’t like tariffs.
5. We don’t like fraud and corruption.
6. We don’t like the massive increases to the deficit.
7. We want a president who will not mettle in the markets or in individual American businesses.
8. We believe a strong global economy is good for the USA.

The difference between me and Republicans is that I still believe the above, but their beliefs take an immediate and 180-degree turn the moment Trump says or does anything different from their supposed core beliefs.
 
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