Mass Shooting & Gun Violence

[superrific]

He’s never found work again because he was vilified by the media,

Actually, I just looked this up. The reason he never found work as a cop again was that he stopped trying to look for work as a cop.

Ferguson Cop Darren Wilson Will Never Police Again, His Lawyer Says

The police officer who fatally shot Michael Brown "can never be a police officer again, and he understands that," his attorney told NBC News.

www.nbcnews.com

This was right after the grand jury declined to indict him. It was not after a months-or-years long job search. Note that his attorney did not say he wouldn't be hired. He said that he was choosing to leave the profession.

He had long given up the profession when Kamala said that about him, so Kamala was not the reason he wasn't working. Do you ever check your facts before posting, or is it just a firehose of bullshit coming from you whenever this subject is broached?

 

[superrific]

The Mormon world loves Trump. He's definitely a renegade in that respect.

The Mormon world loves Trump less than other conservative churches. Some of the diehard segregationists and extremists probably love him, but in general Utah has been less supportive of Trump than you would think.

McCain got 65% in Utah in 2008, despite the national environment being horrible. Romney got 72%. Trump got 45%, then 58%, and then 59%.

 

[Icky Mettle]

He’s never found work again because he was vilified by the media, by politicians and publicly called a murderer by Kamala Harris even after the facts came out. By all accounts, prior to the shooting he was one of the “good cops” and had an excellent relationship with the people that he served. His only mistake that day was not letting a criminal murder him, and for that he was forced into hiding for the rest of his life. Another reason why good people have left law enforcement or never consider it in the first place anymore.

This is 2025. Being vilified by the media, politicians, and Kamala Harris will not only help land you a job; it’ll also help you rise to the top and line your pockets.

 

[akillesheel]

This is 2025. Being vilified by the media, politicians, and Kamala Harris will not only help land you a job; it’ll also help you rise to the top and line your pockets.

there are popular conservatives right now calling for trump to pardon derek chauvin, lol

 

[ZenMode]

The Mormon world loves Trump less than other conservative churches. Some of the diehard segregationists and extremists probably love him, but in general Utah has been less supportive of Trump than you would think.

McCain got 65% in Utah in 2008, despite the national environment being horrible. Romney got 72%. Trump got 45%, then 58%, and then 59%.

Utah is only around 50-ish percent Mormon.

 

[JCTarheel82]

there are popular conservatives right now calling for trump to pardon derek chauvin, lol

The MAGA base also wants this badly as a "fuck you" to Democrats and minorities everywhere.

 

[ZZLPHeels]

Actually, I just looked this up. The reason he never found work as a cop again was that he stopped trying to look for work as a cop.

Ferguson Cop Darren Wilson Will Never Police Again, His Lawyer Says

The police officer who fatally shot Michael Brown "can never be a police officer again, and he understands that," his attorney told NBC News.

www.nbcnews.com

This was right after the grand jury declined to indict him. It was not after a months-or-years long job search. Note that his attorney did not say he wouldn't be hired. He said that he was choosing to leave the profession.

He had long given up the profession when Kamala said that about him, so Kamala was not the reason he wasn't working. Do you ever check your facts before posting, or is it just a firehose of bullshit coming from you whenever this subject is broached?

Did you read the article that you posted?

"He knows how to do the job, and could do the job. He believes that if he ever went back to a department, he would put other officers at risk," Bruntrager said. "And he just, he won’t do that, he won’t do that."

He didn’t choose to leave law enforcement because he wanted to. He left because he couldn’t safely work in law enforcement anymore.

 

[superrific]

Did you read the article that you posted?

"He knows how to do the job, and could do the job. He believes that if he ever went back to a department, he would put other officers at risk," Bruntrager said. "And he just, he won’t do that, he won’t do that."

He didn’t choose to leave law enforcement because he wanted to. He left because he couldn’t safely work in law enforcement anymore.

Yeah, that's what we call grade A bullshit.

In any event, you have no facts on your side. You have the supposed belief of one guy. That is not evidence.

And you blamed Kamala Harris for his inability to find work. Shouldn't you admit that you were 100% wrong about that?

 

[ZZLPHeels]

Yeah, that's what we call grade A bullshit.

In any event, you have no facts on your side. You have the supposed belief of one guy. That is not evidence.

And you blamed Kamala Harris for his inability to find work. Shouldn't you admit that you were 100% wrong about that?

What? The law enforcement shortage post Ferguson and post Floyd is well documented. It isn’t just “one guy.” It is tens of thousands of people deciding not to work in the field anymore, which has repercussions from coast to coast.

 

[superrific]

What? The law enforcement shortage post Ferguson and post Floyd is well documented. It isn’t just “one guy.” It is tens of thousands of people deciding not to work in the field anymore, which has repercussions from coast to coast.

That wasn't your claim. Your claim was that Darren Wilson is the reason why people didn't want to work as cops, and also that Darren Wilson couldn't find work because he was vilified by people including Kamala Harris.

I showed you direct proof that your second claim was false. You going to admit you were wrong, or are you going to keep piling bullshit upon bullshit? I ain't playing that game.

See, in a debate, when one person makes a good point, it's attendant on the other person to rebut it or accept it. If you won't do that, it's not a debate.

 

[superrific]

What? The law enforcement shortage post Ferguson and post Floyd is well documented. It isn’t just “one guy.” It is tens of thousands of people deciding not to work in the field anymore, which has repercussions from coast to coast.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/331744742_Is_It_Cool_to_Be_a_Cop_Exploring_the_Differential_Impact_of_Ferguson_on_Police_Applicants

" As an initial test of this question, this paper explores changes in the number of applicants to one large urban police agency, the Dallas Police Department, in the months following the death of Michael Brown in Ferguson, Missouri, using autoregressive integrated moving average time-series analysis. The paper determines if there was a differential impact in police applications across racial, ethnic, and gender groups. Findings showed stability in the number of applicants each month from each subgroup since 2010."

https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/14613557221074988?utm_source=chatgpt.com

"The results found that the Ferguson effect is related to increased difficulty in officer recruitment but its impact is relatively small when compared with traditional recruitment challenges such as limited budgets and competitive job markets. The findings also reported no impact of the Ferguson effect on police departments’ retention issues. "

 

[ZZLPHeels]

That wasn't your claim. Your claim was that Darren Wilson is the reason why people didn't want to work as cops, and also that Darren Wilson couldn't find work because he was vilified by people including Kamala Harris.

I showed you direct proof that your second claim was false. You going to admit you were wrong, or are you going to keep piling bullshit upon bullshit? I ain't playing that game.

See, in a debate, when one person makes a good point, it's attendant on the other person to rebut it or accept it. If you won't do that, it's not a debate.

What happened to Darren Wilson (and numerous other cops after him) is a large part of the reason so many people have either left law enforcement or refuse to work in it anymore. Kamala Harris publicly calling Wilson a murderer did not help with that regard. I imagine Trump pardoning the people who assaulted the police on 1/6 probably won’t help either.

 

[ZZLPHeels]

Some links about the law enforcement staffing crisis post Brown and Floyd-

https://www.theiacp.org/sites/default/files/239416_IACP_RecruitmentBR_HR_0.pdf

Insufficient police staffing continues throughout the U.S.

While some optimistic reports indicate that the slowdown in new police officer recruitment across the nation in recent years may be turning around, other accounts paint a more dire picture. […]

apbweb.com

Facing the Talent Crisis in Law Enforcement (Part 1) | FBI: Law Enforcement Bulletin

Part 1 of this three-part article series focuses on coaching to solve problems.

leb.fbi.gov

 

[superrific]

Some links about the law enforcement staffing crisis post Brown and Floyd-

https://www.theiacp.org/sites/default/files/239416_IACP_RecruitmentBR_HR_0.pdf

Insufficient police staffing continues throughout the U.S.

While some optimistic reports indicate that the slowdown in new police officer recruitment across the nation in recent years may be turning around, other accounts paint a more dire picture. […]

apbweb.com

Facing the Talent Crisis in Law Enforcement (Part 1) | FBI: Law Enforcement Bulletin

Part 1 of this three-part article series focuses on coaching to solve problems.

leb.fbi.gov

Those links do not support your position. They support the position in one of the papers I cited. Your last link in particular bears almost no resemblance to your earlier claims.

But in any event, let me help you a little bit. See, I linked actual DATA -- well, articles that generated and analyzed actual data. Your links are just generalized "this is what I think" nonsense with virtually no evidence at all.

And doubling down on your demonstrably errant claim about Kamala makes you even more unserious than you were. Why can't you admit you were wrong about Kamala? You didn't know that Darren Wilson had not sought further police work. That much is obvious. Why should you know that? The proper thing to do would be to say, "oh, I guess I was wrong about that." If you want to follow it up with, "but my point still stands," fine -- but if you can't even admit you were talking out your ass then, why should I assume you're ever NOT talking out of your ass?

 

[nycfan]

From the Salt Lake City Tribune:

“…“In 2016, 64% of LDS were Republicans but Trump only got 52% of their votes,” Burge wrote. “In 2024, 58% were Republicans but Trump got 66% of the vote. It seems that there’s just a lot of slippage between partisanship and actual voting behavior happening here.”

Trump, in 2016, won Utah — the church’s world headquarters — with 45.5% of the vote. Clinton received 27.5% of the vote in the state, while McMullin won 21.5% of the Utah vote. In Utah’s next presidential election, Trump won just over 58% of the vote share, while Biden won 37.6%. Trump’s margin increased slightly in Utah in 2024, when he garnered 59.4% of Utahns’ votes.

Latter-day Saints who identify as ideologically moderate, meanwhile, split almost evenly in 2024, as 46% voted for Trump and 50% voted for Democratic nominee Kamala Harris. This, according to Burge, was a rightward swing since 2020, when 32% of moderate Latter-day Saints voted for Trump and 59% voted for Joe Biden.

… Burge also found that young Latter-day Saints are “less enamored” with the Republican Party than their older counterparts — but that they too have warmed to Trump, who had a 16% jump in support from 2020 to 2024 among Latter-day Saint voters between ages 18 and 35. There was a similar trend among Latter-day Saint voters ages 36 to 50.

And since a dip in 2016, Latter-day Saints over 50, he concluded, have emerged as a solidly Republican voting bloc. “[T]his group of voters,” he wrote, “is as Republican as white evangelicals on Election Day.”…”

LDS voters are getting less Republican — but they like Trump more than ever

Latter-day Saint voters are less Republican than they once were but have warmed to Donald Trump significantly, according to new research.

www.sltrib.com

 

[superrific]

What happened to Darren Wilson (and numerous other cops after him) is a large part of the reason so many people have either left law enforcement or refuse to work in it anymore.

Let me repeat the quote from the empirical study referred to above. You know, the one with actual data and statistical analysis.

"The findings also reported no impact of the Ferguson effect on police departments’ retention issues"

 

[ZZLPHeels]

Those links do not support your position. They support the position in one of the papers I cited. Your last link in particular bears almost no resemblance to your earlier claims.

But in any event, let me help you a little bit. See, I linked actual DATA -- well, articles that generated and analyzed actual data. Your links are just generalized "this is what I think" nonsense with virtually no evidence at all.

And doubling down on your demonstrably errant claim about Kamala makes you even more unserious than you were. Why can't you admit you were wrong about Kamala? You didn't know that Darren Wilson had not sought further police work. That much is obvious. Why should you know that? The proper thing to do would be to say, "oh, I guess I was wrong about that." If you want to follow it up with, "but my point still stands," fine -- but if you can't even admit you were talking out your ass then, why should I assume you're ever NOT talking out of your ass?

You misunderstanding the point I made and the articles I provided in support of my claim is not my problem.

 

[ZenMode]

From the Salt Lake City Tribune:

“…“In 2016, 64% of LDS were Republicans but Trump only got 52% of their votes,” Burge wrote. “In 2024, 58% were Republicans but Trump got 66% of the vote. It seems that there’s just a lot of slippage between partisanship and actual voting behavior happening here.”

Trump, in 2016, won Utah — the church’s world headquarters — with 45.5% of the vote. Clinton received 27.5% of the vote in the state, while McMullin won 21.5% of the Utah vote. In Utah’s next presidential election, Trump won just over 58% of the vote share, while Biden won 37.6%. Trump’s margin increased slightly in Utah in 2024, when he garnered 59.4% of Utahns’ votes.

Latter-day Saints who identify as ideologically moderate, meanwhile, split almost evenly in 2024, as 46% voted for Trump and 50% voted for Democratic nominee Kamala Harris. This, according to Burge, was a rightward swing since 2020, when 32% of moderate Latter-day Saints voted for Trump and 59% voted for Joe Biden.

… Burge also found that young Latter-day Saints are “less enamored” with the Republican Party than their older counterparts — but that they too have warmed to Trump, who had a 16% jump in support from 2020 to 2024 among Latter-day Saint voters between ages 18 and 35. There was a similar trend among Latter-day Saint voters ages 36 to 50.

And since a dip in 2016, Latter-day Saints over 50, he concluded, have emerged as a solidly Republican voting bloc. “[T]his group of voters,” he wrote, “is as Republican as white evangelicals on Election Day.”…”

LDS voters are getting less Republican — but they like Trump more than ever

Latter-day Saint voters are less Republican than they once were but have warmed to Donald Trump significantly, according to new research.

www.sltrib.com

I'm honestly curious how they know what percentage of Mormons voted for Trump. Exit polling?

 

[superrific]

You misunderstanding the point I made and the articles I provided in support of my claim is not my problem.

OK, Mike Johnson. Did I take your statement out of context?

The problem is that you don't even know what point you are trying to make. You're flitting about aimlessly, hoping someone will buy your general sentiment that police officers are oppressed by unfavorable public opinion.

Everything I've read on the subject points to a single factor that outweighs others: the pay sucks. It's also likely that the decline of cop shows like Chips or NYPD Blue has made fewer kids look up to cops or dream about being one. It isn't Ferguson and it isn't any of those cases where the cops get to kill people without repercussion.

 

[SnoopRob]

Everything I've read on the subject points to a single factor that outweighs others: the pay sucks. It's also likely that the decline of cop shows like Chips or NYPD Blue has made fewer kids look up to cops or dream about being one.

If this doesn't make folks want to be police officers, I don't know what will...