Russia - Ukraine “peace negotiations”

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finesse said:
Then why did you bring it up? It was irrelevant.

I might as well spell out the actual point while I'm here. Our great ally, Israel, have killed more US military than they have had military die for us unlike virtually every other ally we have.
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Americans fighting and dying in Ukraine is irrelevant to you? Its relevant to me which is why I brought it up.
 
milom98 said:
I see that your "mess" comment has already been addressed by a few members, so no need to expand further on that.

But anyway, guess since Zelensky walked away without agreeing to the minerals deal, Trump ain't the great dealmaker you MAGA cultist make him out to be.

Of course it was never really a deal anyway and more like an attempted shakedown.
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Why couldn't the nobel peace prize winner Obama solve this conflict?
 
gtyellowjacket said:
Americans fighting and dying in Ukraine is irrelevant to you? Its relevant to me which is why I brought it up
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It's not relevant to this conversation because it's not a government action. Ukraine's government committed troops as an ally of the US. That's not the same thing as a few random people deciding they want to fight the russkies or Saddam
 
gtyellowjacket said:
Americans fighting and dying in Ukraine is irrelevant to you? Its relevant to me which is why I brought it up.
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In terms of national commitment it is. Whether it was the Lafayette Escadrille, the Abraham Lincoln battalion, the Eagle Squadrons or the Flying Tigers, to name a few, they were Americans but not American military. A couple were adopted by the military, one by the intelligence agencies and one was threatened with arrest, fwiw.
 
CFordUNC said:
Same reason he didn’t stop the 9/11 attacks when he was golfing!
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So now Democrats are retroactively to blame for things that didn't even happen on their watch? Brilliant reasoning from Trumpers! And when SS and Medicare and Medicaid all get deep cuts I'm sure that will retroactively be Obama or Biden or Bill Clinton's fault too! Who knew you could just dismiss Trump's dumbass, self-destructive policies by blaming them on his Democratic predecessors?
 
ZenMode said:
Did you say those words? No. Did he make it clear that protecting Ukraine from Russia was unimportant to the US? Yes.

He also said, in a debate with Romney, that being concerned about Russia was a foreign policy view from the '80s.
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For the resident pedantic critic to make this leap from what i said to what Obama might have meant is rich indeed.

Lord, you really do have your head buried deeply.

Obama was wrong about Russia. He would say the same himself now I'm sure. Obama certainly never said we would abandon an ally nor did he say we would capitulate to an enemy.
 
finesse said:
Were they sent or were they volunteers? I'm pretty sure Americans who fought for the Abraham Lincoln Brigade in the Spanish Civil War weren't considered military personnel.
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They weren’t. And didn’t fight like military personnel. They were passionate in their support of the government Franco was fighting to overthrow, but they lacked sufficient training in how to fight.
 
Gmonet said:
Why is this person allowed to post on this board? Linking utterly absurd lies on this board without (intentionally) any effort to vet them should not be allowed. I'll just do super ignore, but I'd suggest that idiocy of this sort should be moderated out of existence here.
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What does everyone else think? Personally, I think Michael Flynn is a disgraceful human being. Pretty much the same with Elon Musk. But, I’m aware others may have a different view.

Do we want an opposing side to have a voice or is this just blatant “trolling”?
 
wmheel1287 said:
For the resident pedantic critic to make this leap from what i said to what Obama might have meant is rich indeed.

Lord, you really do have your head buried deeply.

Obama was wrong about Russia. He would say the same himself now I'm sure. Obama certainly never said we would abandon an ally nor did he say we would capitulate to an enemy.
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You know that our resident Trumpers and bosiders have lost this argument when they're retroactively blaming Obama for a war that started five years after he left office, or using his words from years ago to try and argue that Democrats were wrong about Russia too - even though it was Democrats under Biden who have been arming and supporting Ukraine since the war started, and it's Trump and the Republicans who appear totally clueless as to what Putin really is about and that he is no way our friend or ally.

Meanwhile in the here and now their party's leader is kissing Putin's ass left and right, driving a deep wedge between us and every one of our allies, uniting Europe against us, and literally doing Putin's bidding by having our draft dodger POTUS petulantly chew out a global hero whose underdog nation has heroically held out for three years against a nation that has done nothing but try to harm and divide us since Putin seized power decades ago. I know that this may shock the Trumpers and bosiders on this board, but perhaps, just perhaps, Trump is so enamored of Putin that he's willingly doing his bidding at the expense of our traditional allies and to the long-term detriment of the country he is leading and whose interests he is supposedly serving.
 
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Rock said:
What does everyone else think? Personally, I think Michael Flynn is a disgraceful human being. Pretty much the same with Elon Musk. But, I’m aware others may have a different view.

Do we want an opposing side to have a voice or is this just blatant “trolling”?
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Personally I think it's pretty clear that it is clever trolling, in that this poster is smart enough not to cross a line that would get them banned, but they are clearly not arguing in good faith and their goal is just to stir other posters up rather than have a genuine debate or argument. Having said that, I generally prefer to put such posters on ignore or super ignore myself (even though I haven't with this particular poster, at least yet). But I'm aware that others disagree and want these posters banned, and at times it's not hard to see why. My own dividing line is when a poster crosses into deliberate and consistent personal attacks or even stalking posters and sending them ugly PMs and such, which happened on the old IC ZZL and ZZLP in the past. I don't really have a strong opinion about banning them either way, to be honest. If they annoy me too much I'll just put them on ignore. Just my two cents, for whatever it is worth.
 
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