The Charlie Kirk Thread

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Ok. Explain how
They tried to murder members of Congress and the Vice President to overturn the results of a free and fair election. I’d say that’s a threat to Democracy. Even if you buy the bullshit that they weren’t trying to kill anyone (despite them beating cops within inches of their lives), just trying to intimidate them with threats of physical violence ie “HANG MIKE PENCE!” (with a gallows erected in front of the Capitol) is a threat to Deomcracy.
 
More than your cosplay crowd yet no doubt your hate of intellectuals will doom you and your cronies. My father always said that experience is a thorough but grueling teacher! Learn it in a book or classroom instead.
I’m afraid that your hatred of teachers and intellectuals will doom the country. But carry on my wayward son!

I’m pretty sure/certain this is the internet and your shitty drivel and wrong brain bullshit will unfortunately likely live forever!
I pity our grandchildren.
You seem hostile. Maybe take a break.
 
I think/hope that everyone here knows very well of the intellect and connection with reality that nycfan brings to bear. And that information war is exactly why we need to know every sordid detail of what the purveyors of untruths are disseminating.
They likely don’t. I get frustrated with NYC precisely because I know she’s smart AF and I know she doesn’t agree with ram. And I know she’s not a flaming liberal. So I find it disappointing that instead of asking ram “why would that even matter” she apparently runs off to investigate if ram’s obvious hate-fueled claim is true or not. As a gay person, if I don’t feel like people like people like NYC have my back, it worries me. I wish everyone here would go and watch Celluloid Closet and see that the way trans people are being portrayed today is exactly how gay people were portrayed in the past - sick and or criminal. It took a fucking battle for gay people to get beyond that so it’s shitty to see well meaning people fall for the same shtick.
 
Not at all. Just applying common sense and not being shepherded by people trying to scare me and rile me up. Sure worked on you apparently


Here’s your boogeyman

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Just curious, what do you think it would take to overthrow our democracy?


Undermining Free and Fair Elections
Destroying Checks and Balances
Normalizing corruption
Flooding society with misinformation

To take it farther back...in the Federalist Papers, Madison wrote that factions pursuing their own agendas at the expense of the common good, the concentration of power in a single branch and the acquiescence of the other two, and an ill-informed public could readily combine to destroy our constitutional democratic republic (Hereafter, CDR).

Hamilton: Earlier today I wrote about rereading Federalist Paper #1, right there Hamilton wrote..."Of those men who have overturned the liberties of republics, the greatest number have begun their career by gaining the confidence of the people...” -- i.e., Demagoguery can lead to the end. Hamilton also saw incompetence as a detriment to the continuance of CDR -- the kind of thing one sees with Hegseth, Patel, Noem, Long, Bondi, and RFK Jr. In Federalist #29 Hamilton argues that a similar incompetence and coupled with the same type of misinformation that worried Madison could also threaten the CDR.
 
Oh, I dunno, maybe that the January 6 rioters were actually trying to kill leading members of Congress or take them hostage to prevent them from doing their Constitutional duty and certify the electoral vote making Biden the winner of the election? It's no accident that the riot took place on the very day that Congress was voting to read and certify the electoral vote. People literally died in this riot and members of Congress had to flee for their lives and/or hide for their safety (including gutless tools like Josh Hawley, who stirred the rioters up before being videotaped fleeing the Capitol like a coward). Yeah, I'd say that was one of the biggest direct threats ever to the government. In the entire Civil War the Confederates were never able to drag their flag into the Capitol building, but on January 6 Neo-Confederates brought that damn flag of treason right into the heart of the nation's capital.
 
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They likely don’t. I get frustrated with NYC precisely because I know she’s smart AF and I know she doesn’t agree with ram. And I know she’s not a flaming liberal. So I find it disappointing that instead of asking ram “why would that even matter” she apparently runs off to investigate if ram’s obvious hate-fueled claim is true or not. As a gay person, if I don’t feel like people like people like NYC have my back, it worries me. I wish everyone here would go and watch Celluloid Closet and see that the way trans people are being portrayed today is exactly how gay people were portrayed in the past - sick and or criminal. It took a fucking battle for gay people to get beyond that so it’s shitty to see well meaning people fall for the same shtick.
Well...thanks for the explanation I really do appreciate it...but as a historian I can't not look.
 
Get away from social media and all the “influencers” that are quoted here 1000 times a day. Seems many on this board feed into it and slurp it up. Seriously, what does it take to overthrow the US g’ment? Literally, the one person trump needed to begin a coup told him to fuck off? His generals didn’t like him. The tweets quoted on here are poison and do nothing but perpetuate the violent rhetoric that people on here and politicians say need to be eliminated. But I bet next week you guys will be right back to posting those very tweets and ginning yourselves up because it has become addictive to you. Either you are serious about changing the toxic discourse or not. If so it requires independent thought. Not influenced by social media.

If you're not going to read my posts yet write as if you have - just...well...fuck off.
 
Hamilton actually started off the Federalist Papers with these words:

"AFTER an unequivocal experience of the inefficiency of the subsisting federal government, you are called upon to deliberate on a new Constitution for the United States of America. The subject speaks its own importance; comprehending in its consequences nothing less than the existence of the UNION, the safety and welfare of the parts of which it is composed, the fate of an empire in many respects the most interesting in the world. It has been frequently remarked that it seems to have been reserved to the people of this country, by their conduct and example, to decide the important question, whether societies of men are really capable or not of establishing good government from reflection and choice, or whether they are forever destined to depend for their political constitutions on accident and force. If there be any truth in the remark, the crisis at which we are arrived may with propriety be regarded as the era in which that decision is to be made; and a wrong election of the part we shall act may, in this view, deserve to be considered as the general misfortune of mankind. This idea will add the inducements of philanthropy to those of patriotism, to heighten the solicitude which all considerate and good men must feel for the event. Happy will it be if our choice should be directed by a judicious estimate of our true interests, unperplexed and unbiased by considerations not connected with the public good. But this is a thing more ardently to be wished than seriously to be expected. The plan offered to our deliberations affects too many particular interests, innovates upon too many local institutions, not to involve in its discussion a variety of objects foreign to its merits, and of views, passions and prejudices little favorable to the discovery of truth."

Frankly we were in far, far less danger of losing our constitutional democratic republic (which was actually more of a confederation at the time of the composition of the Federalist Papers since The Constitution had yet to be ratified) in October of 1787 and of descending into an abyss of inequalities, dishonesty, corruption, oligarchy , and orchestrated faux elections than we are today. At least the Articles of Confederation, while weak, were not the sort of anti-democratic, anti-republican kleptocracy that trumpism shows itself to be and intend to deepen.
 
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Get away from social media and all the “influencers” that are quoted here 1000 times a day. Seems many on this board feed into it and slurp it up. Seriously, what does it take to overthrow the US g’ment? Literally, the one person trump needed to begin a coup told him to fuck off? His generals didn’t like him. The tweets quoted on here are poison and do nothing but perpetuate the violent rhetoric that people on here and politicians say need to be eliminated. But I bet next week you guys will be right back to posting those very tweets and ginning yourselves up because it has become addictive to you. Either you are serious about changing the toxic discourse or not. If so it requires independent thought. Not influenced by social media.
You support Donald Trump and you are preaching about changing the toxic discourse.
Spit Take Lol GIF by Justin
 
They tried to murder members of Congress and the Vice President to overturn the results of a free and fair election. I’d say that’s a threat to Democracy. Even if you buy the bullshit that they weren’t trying to kill anyone (despite them beating cops within inches of their lives), just trying to intimidate them with threats of physical violence ie “HANG MIKE PENCE!” (with a gallows erected in front of the Capitol) is a threat to Deomcracy.
So that equals overthrowing the g’ment? How? Trump had no military support for a coup, no meaningful congressional support, and no meaningful public support. The one guy he needed to not certify the election told him to fuck off and you are claiming trump and 200 knuckle draggers could end our 244 yo democracy. You can’t in any logical way make a credible argument to support that even being remotely possible. But rather than applying any critical thinking you allowed your news media, politicians who want to stoke anger and fear, social media influencers and zzl posters to leverage your hatred of trump and convince you of something that had a zero possibility of happening. Hope you apply better logic in representing your clients.
 
Proving a little context or disclaimer would be helpful, then. As posted, it comes across as a legit topic of discussion. She’s elevating ram’s bigotry by making it seem like a legit question. And I know she doesn’t agree with ram. Does everyone? I can’t believe people still don’t get that we are in an information war.
i agree with this. As much as I respect what NYC does for this board, there are times where I think some editorial comments are missing and because of that she is just amplifying lies (inadvertently).

Again, not trying to be critical but just saying what I believe needs to be said. Not personal to NYC as I have upmost respect for her.
 
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So that equals overthrowing the g’ment? How? Trump had no military support for a coup, no meaningful congressional support, and no meaningful public support. The one guy he needed to not certify the election told him to fuck off and you are claiming trump and 200 knuckle draggers could end our 244 yo democracy. You can’t in any logical way make a credible argument to support that even being remotely possible. But rather than applying any critical thinking you allowed your news media, politicians who want to stoke anger and fear, social media influencers and zzl posters to leverage your hatred of trump and convince you of something that had a zero possibility of happening. Hope you apply better logic in representing your clients.
pedal stage GIF
 
So that equals overthrowing the g’ment? How? Trump had no military support for a coup, no meaningful congressional support, and no meaningful public support. The one guy he needed to not certify the election told him to fuck off and you are claiming trump and 200 knuckle draggers could end our 244 yo democracy. You can’t in any logical way make a credible argument to support that even being remotely possible. But rather than applying any critical thinking you allowed your news media, politicians who want to stoke anger and fear, social media influencers and zzl posters to leverage your hatred of trump and convince you of something that had a zero possibility of happening. Hope you apply better logic in representing your clients.
When the avoidance of a coup depends on “one guy” being willing to tell Trump to fuck off, we’re damn close to the overthrow of our government. Especially when that “one guy” would do literally anything Trump asked him to do today.
 
So that equals overthrowing the g’ment? How? Trump had no military support for a coup, no meaningful congressional support, and no meaningful public support. The one guy he needed to not certify the election told him to fuck off and you are claiming trump and 200 knuckle draggers could end our 244 yo democracy. You can’t in any logical way make a credible argument to support that even being remotely possible. But rather than applying any critical thinking you allowed your news media, politicians who want to stoke anger and fear, social media influencers and zzl posters to leverage your hatred of trump and convince you of something that had a zero possibility of happening. Hope you apply better logic in representing your clients.
That they failed doesn’t mean it wasn’t a threat. And Trump this time picked people significantly less competent but also significantly more loyal to him. Your argument essentially boils down to, sure, they tried to overthrow democracy but they were too incompetent and didn’t have two or three difference makers on their side this go around, so they were doomed to fail therefore it doesn’t actually count. A fake bomb threat is still a bomb threat even when there is no bomb and the caller doesn’t know how to make or buy one or even he plants a bomb but is sucks at making it so it doesn’t actually go off. All of that is still a threat.

You think Vance would tell him to fuck off the same way Pence did? You think Hegseth and Raisin’ Cain will tell him to fuck off the way Esper and Milley did? You think Bondi will tell him to fuck off the way Barr did? I don’t. Nor does anybody thinking rationally.
 
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When the avoidance of a coup depends on “one guy” being willing to tell Trump to fuck off, we’re damn close to the overthrow of our government. Especially when that “one guy” would do literally anything Trump asked him to do today.
True, and if the armed and very violent mob had been able to take members of Congress hostage they could have indeed delayed certification of the electoral vote and thrown the presidential transition into chaos, which is what Trump wanted. Maybe they couldn't have overthrown the government for long, but they sure as hell came close to delaying the electoral vote and thus disrupting the Constitutional process for the first time in our history, not to mention killing government officials. It's absurd to blow that off and pretend that it wasn't a serious threat to our constitutional democracy, but instead was just some sort of minor disturbance.
 
So that equals overthrowing the g’ment? How? Trump had no military support for a coup, no meaningful congressional support, and no meaningful public support. The one guy he needed to not certify the election told him to fuck off and you are claiming trump and 200 knuckle draggers could end our 244 yo democracy. You can’t in any logical way make a credible argument to support that even being remotely possible. But rather than applying any critical thinking you allowed your news media, politicians who want to stoke anger and fear, social media influencers and zzl posters to leverage your hatred of trump and convince you of something that had a zero possibility of happening. Hope you apply better logic in representing your clients.

Well at least the January 6 criminals are all behind bars where those who attempt such things ought to be.
 
So that equals overthrowing the g’ment? How? Trump had no military support for a coup, no meaningful congressional support, and no meaningful public support. The one guy he needed to not certify the election told him to fuck off and you are claiming trump and 200 knuckle draggers could end our 244 yo democracy. You can’t in any logical way make a credible argument to support that even being remotely possible. But rather than applying any critical thinking you allowed your news media, politicians who want to stoke anger and fear, social media influencers and zzl posters to leverage your hatred of trump and convince you of something that had a zero possibility of happening. Hope you apply better logic in representing your clients.
Touch grass Calla. Take a break from social media yourself.
 
Undermining Free and Fair Elections
Destroying Checks and Balances
Normalizing corruption
Flooding society with misinformation

To take it farther back...in the Federalist Papers, Madison wrote that factions pursuing their own agendas at the expense of the common good, the concentration of power in a single branch and the acquiescence of the other two, and an ill-informed public could readily combine to destroy our constitutional democratic republic (Hereafter, CDR).

Hamilton: Earlier today I wrote about rereading Federalist Paper #1, right there Hamilton wrote..."Of those men who have overturned the liberties of republics, the greatest number have begun their career by gaining the confidence of the people...” -- i.e., Demagoguery can lead to the end. Hamilton also saw incompetence as a detriment to the continuance of CDR -- the kind of thing one sees with Hegseth, Patel, Noem, Long, Bondi, and RFK Jr. In Federalist #29 Hamilton argues that a similar incompetence and coupled with the same type of misinformation that worried Madison could also threaten the CDR.
Were elections undermined in any way?
Were checks and balances eliminated in any way?
Corruption was never normalized although even though a small percentage refuse to believe their side isn’t corrupt.
Misinformation from the left and right has been in existence since the rise of social media. I would argue that is way more of a threat than anything trump could ever do.
 
Were elections undermined in any way?
Were checks and balances eliminated in any way?
Corruption was never normalized although even though a small percentage refuse to believe their side isn’t corrupt.
Misinformation from the left and right has been in existence since the rise of social media. I would argue that is way more of a threat than anything trump could ever do.

It appears that you may have read some of what I wrote. That's a start.

But you comprehended practically none of it.

I think I'd just as soon you put me on ignore.
 
Were elections undermined in any way?
Were checks and balances eliminated in any way?
Corruption was never normalized although even though a small percentage refuse to believe their side isn’t corrupt.
Misinformation from the left and right has been in existence since the rise of social media. I would argue that is way more of a threat than anything trump could ever do.
Uh, checks and balances have been absolutely decimated by Republicans in all three branches over the last ten years.
 
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