Trump begins the Military Purge

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StrangePackage said:
I mean, what other reasons come into play when you fire a vastly more qualified minority in favor of a categorically unqualified white guy?

And not to put too fine a point on it, but when the guy who is doing the firing's right-hand man is throwing out Nazi salutes in public, I am going to go ahead and assume racial animus.
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Umm, I don't know maybe shared philosophy. Maybe what Trump said about handling ISIS.

There were plenty of black conservatives who ran for office and were qualified but lost. Did you vote for them or defend them or smear them. We could use more black conservatives in gov't. But but but not that kind of DEI lol.
 
Silence Dogood said:
Umm, I don't know maybe shared philosophy. Maybe what Trump said about handling ISIS.

There were plenty of black conservatives who ran for office and were qualified but lost. Did you vote for them or defend them or smear them. We could use more black conservatives in gov't. But but but not that kind of DEI lol.
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Why weren't there qualified individuals who share this philosophy?

Like Mark Robinson? Or... Who are you talking about specifically?
 
Silence Dogood said:
Based on what evidence?
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Look at a lineup of the presidents, congresspeople, and supreme court justices of America in its 250 year history.

Is it your belief that those white men were simply always more qualified than *any* other woman or person of color?

Next look CEO's of major corporations during that same time frame. Next mayors, etc.
 
Silence Dogood said:
And there's nothing you give him credit for. If this is your gotcha moment, I've got news for you most Americans don't care. This is a small issue everyone will forget. Most Americans trust Trump more on keeping America safe and handling the military than they do with Biden and Kamala. Thats the big picture here.
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I hate to tell you this, but most Americans actually do care, as polls clearly show rising levels of concern about your boy's proposed cuts and actual cuts and all of these other chaotic changes, and it's only going to get worse. It's not a small issue for a president to fire most of his military leadership and replace them with less-qualified flunkies. When was the last time such a large number of firings happened in the military, especially to the top levels of officers? And it appears they're not done yet.

The "big picture" is Trump & Musk taking a wrecking ball to the government, and the growing concerns about it. Did you see the GA GOP Congressman at what was supposed to be a friendly town hall meeting? It wasn't so friendly. But keep your head in the sand and pretend that all is well in MAGA Nation. And like I said, when the fallout from all of this starts to really hit hard, people like you will vanish from the board within another year or two.
 
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Silence Dogood said:
Umm, I don't know maybe shared philosophy. Maybe what Trump said about handling ISIS.
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It's true that Trump might have that motivation. That's what the president would do if he wanted the military to be more effective if he think it hasn't been.

But it's also true that this is what a president does if he wants to claim dictatorial power. No ruler can be effective without the military on his side, so he purges the competent people and replaces them with underqualified people who are fully loyal to him because they have no other options, because without him they are nobodies.

Two possibilities. How would we distinguish which of them is happening? Oh, I don't know, maybe the fact that Trump is screaming from the rooftops about how much he wants absolute power. He's said he wants to be a dictator, on multiple occasions. He's compared himself to Napoleon. He's claimed the law doesn't apply to him. He's referred to himself as the king.

Now, please explain why we are wrong to suspect that the second option above is what is happening? What more evidence do we need that Trump is trying to pull off a coup, than Trump literally saying over and over again that he's pulling off a coup? Oh, and that he's tried the coup in the past. And the fact that his other cabinet members all share this same quality: completely unqualified people selected purely for fealty to him. And the fact that they have enemies lists, and have talked for years about going after political enemies.

But yeah, sure, it's probably a big nothing, just the ordinary sort of thing that happens when a new administration comes in -- except that it's never happened before.
 
We need to do a check of how many competent generals Putin keeps around? Kinda odd, the competent ones in Russia seem to be scarce. If I didn't know better, I'd say we got some copycat syndrome going on.
 

In Pursuit of a ‘Warrior Ethos,’ Hegseth Targets Military’s Top Lawyers​

The defense secretary has repeatedly derided the military lawyers for war crime prosecutions and battlefield rules of engagement.

www.nytimes.com

Hegseth Fires Military’s Top JAG Lawyers in Pursuit of ‘Warrior Ethos’

The defense secretary has repeatedly derided the military lawyers for war crime prosecutions and battlefield rules of engagement.
www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com

“… His decision to replace the military’s judge advocate generals — typically three-star military officers — offers a sense of how he defines the ethos that he has vowed to instill.

…
Inside the Pentagon and on battlefields around the world, military lawyers aren’t decision makers. Their job is to provide independent legal advice to senior military officers so that they do not run afoul of U.S. law or the laws of armed conflict.

Senior Pentagon officials said that Mr. Hegseth has had no contact with any of the three fired uniform military lawyers since taking office. None of the three — Lt. Gen. Joseph B. Berger III, Air Force Lt. Gen. Charles Plummer and Rear Adm. Lia M. Reynolds — were even named in the Pentagon statement announcing their dismissal from decades of military service.

A senior military official with knowledge of the firings added that the military lawyers had “zero heads up” that they were being removed from office and that the top brass in the Army, Navy and Air Force were also caught unaware.

The unexplained dismissals prompted widespread concern. “In some ways that’s even more chilling than firing the four stars,” Rosa Brooks, a professor at Georgetown Law, wrote on X. “It’s what you do when you’re planning to break the law: you get rid of any lawyers who might try to slow you down.” …”
 
Continued

“… In his book, “The War on Warriors,” which was published last year, Mr. Hegseth castigates military lawyers for imposing overly restrictive rules of engagement on frontline troops, which he argues repeatedly allowed the enemy to score battlefield victories.

Mr. Hegseth derisively refers to the lawyers in the book as “jagoffs.”

… Mr. Hegseth’s account of this period in his book and his Senate testimony conflict with how battlefield rules of engagement were set during the wars. Senior officers in Iraq and Afghanistan, such as Gen. David H. Petraeus, came to believe that civilian deaths were turning the local population against U.S. forces and feeding the enemy’s ranks. So these officers emphasized protecting civilian life even if it meant that U.S. troops might have to incur greater risk.

… Ultimately, the rules belonged to battlefield leaders and not their military lawyers. The axiom — “lawyers advise, and commanders decide” — is a core piece of every military lawyer’s education, current and former JAG officers said.

… During the president’s first term, Mr. Hegseth appealed to Mr. Trump to issue pardons for U.S. troops accused or convicted of war crimes or murder for their actions in Iraq and Afghanistan. In October 2019, Mr. Trump called Mr. Hegseth to tell him that he was pardoning two soldiers and a Navy SEAL whose causes Mr. Hegseth had championed for months on his Fox television show.

… One of the pardoned soldiers was First Lt. Clint Lorance, who was turned in by his own troops after he ordered them to fire on unarmed Afghans over 100 yards away from his platoon, killing them. The soldier then radioed a false report claiming the bodies had been removed and couldn’t be searched for weapons.

The Army convicted Lieutenant Lorance of second-degree murder and other charges and sentenced him to 19 years in prison.

… Senior Army lawyers strongly disagreed with the decision to pardon Lieutenant Lorance, according to Pentagon officials.

Among those most upset by the presidential pardon were the troops who served under him and made the difficult decision to accuse him of war crimes and testify at trial. …”
 
nycfan said:
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Would any of our resident Trumpers like to weigh in on yet another high-ranking female officer being fired? Seems to be a real pattern developing here, don't you think?

ETA: Like so many other Trump minions in the government, Hegseth had a long record of saying that women shouldn't be in the military and disdaining their accomplishments, but when he appeared for his Senate hearing he of course denied much of what he had said or claimed it was taken "out of context" or other bullshit. And now that he's been confirmed he's gone right back to his original statements and does appear to be purging women from high positions in the military. We're a 21st Century society being governed by white men whose mindset is still in the 1950s (or in Trump's case even earlier - the Gilded Age).
 
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nycfan said:
Continued

“… In his book, “The War on Warriors,” which was published last year, Mr. Hegseth castigates military lawyers for imposing overly restrictive rules of engagement on frontline troops, which he argues repeatedly allowed the enemy to score battlefield victories.

Mr. Hegseth derisively refers to the lawyers in the book as “jagoffs.”

… Mr. Hegseth’s account of this period in his book and his Senate testimony conflict with how battlefield rules of engagement were set during the wars. Senior officers in Iraq and Afghanistan, such as Gen. David H. Petraeus, came to believe that civilian deaths were turning the local population against U.S. forces and feeding the enemy’s ranks. So these officers emphasized protecting civilian life even if it meant that U.S. troops might have to incur greater risk.

… Ultimately, the rules belonged to battlefield leaders and not their military lawyers. The axiom — “lawyers advise, and commanders decide” — is a core piece of every military lawyer’s education, current and former JAG officers said.

… During the president’s first term, Mr. Hegseth appealed to Mr. Trump to issue pardons for U.S. troops accused or convicted of war crimes or murder for their actions in Iraq and Afghanistan. In October 2019, Mr. Trump called Mr. Hegseth to tell him that he was pardoning two soldiers and a Navy SEAL whose causes Mr. Hegseth had championed for months on his Fox television show.

… One of the pardoned soldiers was First Lt. Clint Lorance, who was turned in by his own troops after he ordered them to fire on unarmed Afghans over 100 yards away from his platoon, killing them. The soldier then radioed a false report claiming the bodies had been removed and couldn’t be searched for weapons.

The Army convicted Lieutenant Lorance of second-degree murder and other charges and sentenced him to 19 years in prison.

… Senior Army lawyers strongly disagreed with the decision to pardon Lieutenant Lorance, according to Pentagon officials.

Among those most upset by the presidential pardon were the troops who served under him and made the difficult decision to accuse him of war crimes and testify at trial. …”
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So Clint Lorance grew up in a town of about 4000 people that was 16 miles away from the town I grew up in (pop 1900).

Two sisters who were near my age (one a year younger and one a year older, both cute) were cousins or Clint. They would post all the time in support of Clint’s pardon. I had to bite my tongue every time I saw a post.

I of course know that I can’t express my opinion to family of his.
 
Mulberry Heel said:
Would any of our resident Trumpers like to weigh in on yet another high-ranking female officer being fired? Seems to be a real pattern developing here, don't you think?
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Don’t expect anything, and if you do it won’t be insightful. I posted then reposted my request to the maga/bosiding horde to explain how don’s claim to a kingship and the right to make and take any laws was in keeping with democracy or rule of law - not even one meager attempt.
 
Just spoke with an old friend who I keep up with on social media who works in Veterans Assistance and Administration.

I won't go into details to protect their identity, cause at this point, I'm pretty sure they will track anyone with anything negative to say about the current administration. But according to my friend, the VA has lost it's mind. They're firing anyone at the lower levels that even mentions diversity. Not letting people go because of performance or position. Everyone is tired of being called worthless, unproductive, and lazy, and they're all tattle-telling on each other. Local leaders are completely confused and have no guidance. They're cancelling appointments with vets left and right because they don't know if they're going to have anyone available to speak to them. Hiring freezes are in effect, and they're already short staffed.


I know that this nation has shit on two worker groups more than any other in the history of our country, no matter the party and affiliation--those groups are teachers and the military. But doing this to vets...especially as much as they claim to love this nation...it sickens me. It really does.

And that's the second friend I've had confide in me they're afraid they're going to lose their job because of 4547.
 
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