No fact or data is sufficient to penetrate the MAGA mind once made up.
Trump / Musk (other than DOGE)
- Thread starter nycfan
- Start date
- Replies: 12K
- Views: 643K
- Politics
lawtig02
Inconceivable Member
- Messages
- 4,966
Probably. And there are things he says here that do bug me. This is not one of them. I couldn’t care less what any MAGAs think about birthright citizenship. I just don’t know why someone would waste time arguing 127 year old SCOTUS precedent should be revisited.
- Messages
- 3,421
Because other posters keep trying to ‘splain it to him after he keeps posting the same bullshit. Rinse and repeat.
I'm collecting varietal bloviations.
Last edited:
Zen is a troll, which is why he is on Super Ignore. More upstanding board members should try this feature. Their lives will improve significantly, and they will be spared the indignity of chasing a rabbit with a kazoo.
Corporations are people, my friends?
Does that mean corporations will adopt their employees, give them allowances instead of a salary and avoid that whole nasty visa thing?
No, maybe, and possibly.
Corporations were never people until our Supremely Corrupt Court said they were. God help us because most assuredly, the government as it's currently constituted and the Oligarchs won't.
- Messages
- 29,548
Trying to break up the first week firehose thread I to more focused topics as makes sense.
Lots of changes in how and what the DOJ will focus on is not uncommon when the executive branch changes parties, but the whiplash could be quite extreme here as Trump personal attorneys and an election denier AG are installed at the top.
Lots of changes in how and what the DOJ will focus on is not uncommon when the executive branch changes parties, but the whiplash could be quite extreme here as Trump personal attorneys and an election denier AG are installed at the top.
Last edited:
- Messages
- 29,548
“They replaced a Biden-era memo telling prosecutors to show leniency to some drug offenders with a new policy calling for the pursuit of the most serious charges and the stiffest penalties for all crimes. They halted much of the department’s civil-rights and environmental work. And they transferred more than 15 career employees to relatively marginal positions, part of a broader effort to ultimately thin the workforce. That was just the first week.
… Many department employees are on edge as they await Senate confirmation of Pam Bondi, Trump’s nominee for attorney general. Her chief of staff, Chad Mizelle, is leading the department until then, along with acting Attorney General James McHenry, a longtime immigration lawyer, and his temporary deputy, Emil Bove, who previously served as one of Trump’s criminal defense attorneys.
…
As part of the department’s pivots, Mizelle issued a memo Friday sharply limiting prosecutions of people accused of blocking access to abortion clinics, calling such cases the “prototypical example” of federal weaponization.
Mizelle put an immediate hold on civil-rights litigation, meaning department lawyers can’t take additional steps in many existing cases “to ensure that the President’s appointees or designees have the opportunity to decide whether to initiate any new cases,” according to a memo viewed by The Wall Street Journal. Another memo told lawyers not to complete any settlements and suggested that the new administration could reconsider dozens of consent decrees meant to overhaul local police departments, a priority of the Biden administration.
Some of the Justice Department employees reassigned or demoted last week included people who advised on the two prosecutions of Trump or worked closely with Biden appointees in areas that the new leadership wants to overhaul or revamp. Those reassigned include lawyers who held senior roles within the national-security and criminal divisions. …”
… Many department employees are on edge as they await Senate confirmation of Pam Bondi, Trump’s nominee for attorney general. Her chief of staff, Chad Mizelle, is leading the department until then, along with acting Attorney General James McHenry, a longtime immigration lawyer, and his temporary deputy, Emil Bove, who previously served as one of Trump’s criminal defense attorneys.
…
As part of the department’s pivots, Mizelle issued a memo Friday sharply limiting prosecutions of people accused of blocking access to abortion clinics, calling such cases the “prototypical example” of federal weaponization.
Mizelle put an immediate hold on civil-rights litigation, meaning department lawyers can’t take additional steps in many existing cases “to ensure that the President’s appointees or designees have the opportunity to decide whether to initiate any new cases,” according to a memo viewed by The Wall Street Journal. Another memo told lawyers not to complete any settlements and suggested that the new administration could reconsider dozens of consent decrees meant to overhaul local police departments, a priority of the Biden administration.
Some of the Justice Department employees reassigned or demoted last week included people who advised on the two prosecutions of Trump or worked closely with Biden appointees in areas that the new leadership wants to overhaul or revamp. Those reassigned include lawyers who held senior roles within the national-security and criminal divisions. …”
- Messages
- 29,548
White House warns of ‘consequences’ for Republicans who don’t support all of Trump’s nominees
More Trump nominees with potentially rocky paths to confirmation face hearings in the Senate this week, including Tulsi Gabbard, Robert F. Kennedy Jr. and Kash Patel.
White House warns of ‘consequences’ for Republicans who don’t support all of Trump’s nominees
More Trump nominees with potentially rocky paths to confirmation face hearings in the Senate this week, including Tulsi Gabbard, Robert F. Kennedy Jr. and Kash Patel.
www.nbcnews.com
“… “It’s pass-fail. You either support everyone or you don’t,” a senior White House official told NBC News. “The Senate needs to advise and consent, not advise and adjust.”
… “There is a very well-funded consortium of outside groups and political actors that are sophisticated, smart and tough. We’ve already seen that they’ve provided air support and narrative support to some nominees,” said the official, referring to allied groups close to, but not directly controlled by, the White House.
“They’ll still be very well-funded when the nominations are over, and they’ll exact consequences, I’m sure, to those who do not support the president’s nominees and get them to the finish line.”
… Still, there is some unease. One Republican senator who has voted for all of Trump’s nominees so far said his colleagues will be wary of national security picks who “sound more like Tucker Carlson than a Republican,” referring to the hard-right conservative commentator who has been seen as friendly to U.S. adversaries such as Russian President Vladimir Putin.
“We’ll only give so much,” said the senator, who spoke on condition of anonymity to describe the internal Senate thinking. “Because this is the future of the country. It’s not entertainment television.” …”
ZenMode
Legend of ZZL
- Messages
- 5,140
I don't think that the ability to charge somebody with a crime, when they are in your country, is the sole determiner of what is meant by jurisdiction.
ZenMode
Legend of ZZL
- Messages
- 5,140
Of course and it's does. It has to. Obviously the founding fathers had no way to anticipate the existence of social media when drafting the First Amendment, right? I would say there's virtually no doubt that the spirit of free speech would undoubtedly include speech in digital format.
So, when the drafters of the 14th Amendment were imagining who would be given citizenship based on being born in the US, does it seem likely that they were talking about the children of people who were truly immigrating to the US or, in the unfortunate case of slaves, were forced here against their will?
Do we think that they were imagining a time when traveling halfway around the world would take a matter of hours and not months and travel would be so easy that people would be coming here at the 11th hour of their pregnancy, just to take advantage of our birthright citizenship policy, under the guise of "vacationing"?
Last edited:
14th Amendment. Inside the border.
- Messages
- 3,958
- Messages
- 1,893
... That is literally the definition of jurisdiction. The ability to enact and enforce legal decisions.
ZenMode
Legend of ZZL
- Messages
- 5,140
Right. I'm just saying that I don't think the ability to charge somebody with a crime is the only consideration in legal jurisdiction.
- Messages
- 1,893
Then tell us what you "think" is needed?
Because if the text reads "All persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof[.]" So why is criminal jurisdiction not sufficient? It's also clear that they're subject to civil jurisdiction as well ..
So is there some other kind of jurisdiction that we need to discuss?
ZenMode
Legend of ZZL
- Messages
- 5,140
I think the better question is whether or not simply being able to charge somebody with a crime is the basis for giving their kids citizenship. If I were to drive to Florida and get a speeding ticket, should I start being taxed based on Florida's personal income tax policy? Obviously not. That would be silly because it's clear that my ties to Arizona means that they have jurisdiction over any number of things, not just the ability to write me a speeding ticket.
As I mentioned here, it was a much different time back then. People were picking up their entire lives just to get to our shores to be handed citizenship. Of course it makes sense to give their kids citizenship. It also makes perfect sense to give the children of slaves, who were brought here against their will, citizenship in the US.
The people participating in birth tourism are not immigrating to the US, they are taking advantage of a loophole that doesn't seem to align with the original intention of the 14th Amendment.
EDIT: But what do I know? I'm just a troll who doesn't believe what he's saying, anyway.
Last edited: