Trump / Musk (other than DOGE)

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nycfan said:

Trump officials fired nuclear staff not realizing they oversee the country’s weapons stockpile, sources say​



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www.cnn.com

“Trump administration officials fired more than 300 staffers Thursday night at the National Nuclear Security Administration — the agency tasked with managing the nation’s nuclear stockpile — as part of broader Energy Department layoffs, according to four people with knowledge of the matter.

Sources told CNN the officials did not seem to know this agency oversees America’s nuclear weapons.

… The agency began rescinding the terminations Friday morning.

Some of the fired employees included NNSA staff who are on the ground at facilities where nuclear weapons are built. These staff oversee the contractors who build nuclear weapons, and they inspect these weapons.

It also included employees at NNSA headquarters who write requirements and guidelines for contractors who build nuclear weapons.

A source told CNN they believe these individuals were fired because “no one has taken anytime to understand what we do and the importance of our work to the nation’s national security.”

… Members of Congress made their concerns about the NNSA firings known to the Energy Department, a Hill staffer told CNN. A person with knowledge of the matter told CNN that senators visited Energy Sec. Chris Wright to express concern about the NNSA cuts.

“Congress is freaking out because it appears DOE didn’t really realize NNSA oversees the nuclear stockpile,” one source said.

“The nuclear deterrent is the backbone of American security and stability – period. For there to be any even very small holes poked even in the maintenance of that deterrent should be extremely frightening to people.” …”
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Silence Dogood said:
The problem with your rationale is you're assuming there is no fraud and the govt is doing everything effectively and efficiently.
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And the problem with YOUR rationale is that you attribute opinions to people despite the fact they've never held that belief. Nobody on this thread has EVER assumed or stated there is no fraud and inefficiency in government. But you don't weed fraud out by removing entire departments from our government.

Explain to me how firing 1260 members of the CDC's Epidemic Intelligence Service is eliminating fraud and inefficiency. These are the people designed to track and locate new viruses before they spread and become epidemics. Explain to me how that makes our country more safe. Explain how that benefits us to not be able to adequately prepare for possible health crises that may arise.
 
WaynetheDrain said:
And the problem with YOUR rationale is that you attribute opinions to people despite the fact they've never held that belief. Nobody on this thread has EVER assumed or stated there is no fraud and inefficiency in government. But you don't weed fraud out by removing entire departments from our government.

Explain to me how firing 1260 members of the CDC's Epidemic Intelligence Service is eliminating fraud and inefficiency. These are the people designed to track and locate new viruses before they spread and become epidemics. Explain to me how that makes our country more safe. Explain how that benefits us to not be able to adequately prepare for possible health crises that may arise.
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Or this…

 
Silence Dogood said:
The problem with your rationale is you're assuming there is no fraud and the govt is doing everything effectively and efficiently.
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Nobody is assuming there is no fraud. Fraud has always existed and to some extent will always exist.

There are also far more capable procedures already in place to find and root out fraud. It isn’t a battle you just win. It is and will always be a constant battle.

Most importantly, the two fraudsters you have put in charge aren’t interested in rooting out fraud. In fact they are removing all of the checks that exist. Instead they are interested in perpetuating their own fraud and DOGE is just a propaganda campaign to give them cover to do it.
 
BlooVooDoo said:
How bad does a deal have to be for Ukraine for you to think it qualifies as being thrown under the bus?
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How good does it have to be for you to say ukraine wasn't thrown under the bus? Pete was right when he said its a non starter to think russia is going to give back land it holds now. That was never going to be agreed to by putin so that can't be part of any analysis of a peace deal. Likewise with ukraine joining NATO.
ukraine isn't in a position of leverage. Zelensky wants assurances of security against future invasions. Short of NATO i'm not sure what that looks like. Maybe arms deals with the US in return for access to mineral rights. Giving the US favorable rebuilding terms to greatly increase US investment that putin might think twice about attacking. I think ukraine gets the short end of the stick but that was always going to be the case. Russia has more time than ukraine does. Even if the US greatly increased its support, it wouldn't be enough to force putin to slink back to russia. So it isn't accurate to say ukraine got thrown under the bus if boundaries are redrawn an no nato admission.
 
WaynetheDrain said:
Explain to me how firing 1260 members of the CDC's Epidemic Intelligence Service is eliminating fraud and inefficiency. These are the people designed to track and locate new viruses before they spread and become epidemics. Explain to me how that makes our country more safe. Explain how that benefits us to not be able to adequately prepare for possible health crises that may arise.
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It's possible that the 1260 could be a little bloat. Maybe the optimal staffing level is lower. Problem is that nobody knows how to determine the *optimal* staffing level. The people going around whacking jobs certainly don't.

It would be like me revamping military operations. What do you mean, 25 people in a platoon, when only 10 are necessary? It's possible that 25 *is* too many, but I wouldn't be able to determine that; my alternative idea is almost certainly wrong (and if it's not, it's only by luck); and the folks who do this for a living have way, way, way better insight as to the optimal platoon size. They might not be perfect, but their 90% accurate rate is going to be way better than my 10% accuracy rate.
 
DiehardHeelFan said:
Or this…

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I expect to see a lot of this over the next four years. Federal agency or program or department lays off too many workers or necessary workers, discovers they have fucked up and start facing a major backlash as things fall apart, then rush to rehire said people but either can't find them or the fired workers just tell them to eff off after getting new jobs. It's going to be a total shitshow, no question. And the problem is that after this it is likely going to be very hard to hire new federal workers (especially highly qualified) in any federal agency and department for years and years, even under a Democratic POTUS.
 
WaynetheDrain said:
And the problem with YOUR rationale is that you attribute opinions to people despite the fact they've never held that belief. Nobody on this thread has EVER assumed or stated there is no fraud and inefficiency in government. But you don't weed fraud out by removing entire departments from our government.

Explain to me how firing 1260 members of the CDC's Epidemic Intelligence Service is eliminating fraud and inefficiency. These are the people designed to track and locate new viruses before they spread and become epidemics. Explain to me how that makes our country more safe. Explain how that benefits us to not be able to adequately prepare for possible health crises that may arise.
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Science is fake news hur dee hur
 
Calheel said:
It was posted earlier than the entire federal workforce is only 15% of the federal budget, so firing even 5% of the workforce would only save 1% of the budget -- so this obviously has nothing to do with savings or efficiency.
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I believe the entire civilian workforce is actually just over 4% of the budget. A CBO study stated $271 billion in compensation to 2.3 million civilian employees in 2022. So you would need to cut around 600,000 to conceivably get to about 1% of the budget or ~$68 billion. Those cuts would also need to be evenly distributed across the wage spectrum to even achieve that.
 
Mulberry Heel said:
So the way to fix that is to literally gut the government and abolish whole departments and agencies that have existed and done good work for decades, and fire millions of government workers and cut off vital research funding for things like cancer and vaccine research? I'm sorry but that's insane and wildly impractical. It's like cutting off an entire arm to get rid of a hangnail.
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You went way off the rails and started exaggerating.
 
ChapelHillSooner said:
Nobody is assuming there is no fraud. Fraud has always existed and to some extent will always exist.

There are also far more capable procedures already in place to find and root out fraud. It isn’t a battle you just win. It is and will always be a constant battle.

Most importantly, the two fraudsters you have put in charge aren’t interested in rooting out fraud. In fact they are removing all of the checks that exist. Instead they are interested in perpetuating their own fraud and DOGE is just a propaganda campaign to give them cover to do it.
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There isn't capable procedures in place, hence the mess the govt is in. What fraud is taking place thus far in this administration??
 
Mulberry Heel said:
That's what is so crazy about all this. By arming Ukraine we were helping to bleed the Russian military dry and hurting Putin without sacrificing anything ourselves, other than the money we were spending to supply Ukraine with weapons. For us it was a win-win situation. And now Trump is going to screw it all up because he's a Putin and dictator fanboy and wants to help him out. Again, it's crazy time in US foreign policy, even more so than it was in his first term. Kiss up to our enemies and rivals and piss off all of our allies to the maximum degree possible. And this time it will likely take years to fix the damage, if that will even be possible.
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There is something our trumpers need to address for us. Trump is making it crystal clear that America under him can’t be trusted. Trust is a hard thing to get. It is easy to lose. It is almost impossible to regain. We have been the leader of the free world for 80 years now. But now, none of our allies will ever be able to trust us again. They will not look to us for leadership. We are threatening our nearest allies and giving assurances to our enemies. WTF trumpers? Your man is destroying in a few short weeks what it took our presidents from FDR to Biden 80 years to build. Unfucking believable.
 
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