Trump still hasn't figured out tariffs are a tax on consumers | Trump announces “External Revenue Service”
- Thread starter evrheel
- Start date
- Replies: 278
- Views: 7K
- Politics
- Messages
- 1,122
William McKInley was not president in the 1880s, nor most of the 1890s.
there was a depression from 1882 to 1885 and a recession from 1887 through 1888, then another in 1890.
Two panic and bank runs (1893 and 1896) and another recession in 1899 when McKinkley actually was president
but I know facts mean nothing so tariff away orange man
there was a depression from 1882 to 1885 and a recession from 1887 through 1888, then another in 1890.
Two panic and bank runs (1893 and 1896) and another recession in 1899 when McKinkley actually was president
but I know facts mean nothing so tariff away orange man
JCTarheel82
Honored Member
- Messages
- 901
sigh
*facepalm emoji*
Turd Ferguson
Distinguished Member
- Messages
- 346
And we had segregation and women didn't have rights, and we could lynch minorities and gay people. Great times.
Turd Ferguson
Distinguished Member
- Messages
- 346
I wish one of these other leaders would just turn to him and say he is such a dumbass.
Everyone knows no gay people existed back then.
Letting that Billy Crystal play that queer Jodie Dallas on “Soap” in the late ‘70’s……that turned millions of blue-blooded American men into queens. That’s when we started having gays.
Mulberry Heel
Iconic Member
- Messages
- 1,273
Not to mention that Gilded Age business tycoons often treated their workers like shit because there were no legal restraints on them not to do so, and so many workers tried to organize labor unions to strike for better pay, working conditions, etc. And many of these strikes were violently opposed by the company owners and aided by the state and federal governments. Hundreds of workers were killed in violent strikes in that era - The National Railroad Strike of 1877, the Chicago Haymarket Square Riot, the Pullman Strike, the Homestead Strike, and so on. Ugly stuff, and it certainly wasn't a paradise for many, or even most, workers.
Also, instead of the capitalist idea of corporate competition, many companies formed monopolies which allowed for crappy products and high prices - farmers were routinely the victims of price gouging by railroad companies to move their products to market, for example. It may have been great for the wealthiest upper class, but it sure as hell wasn't all that great for the working class. But of course as we all know that's not who Trump is talking about - he's talking about himself and his buddies like Elon and that LA Times owner.
- Messages
- 1,122
America the mob state, apparently.
Tariffs all the way down!!!!!!
Step 1. Raise tariffs on Canada
Step 2. say "That's Fine" when Canada threatens to cut off oil sales
Step 3. Tell EU they have to buy more US petroleum while unleashing a supply from up North onto the free market and expect the EU not to buy the Canadian supply
Step 4. Profit?
I am personally shocked that this man managed to bankrupt a casino.
ChileG
Esteemed Member
- Messages
- 742
He’s the personification of a “solution looking for a problem.”
Can anyone here who voted for this man defend this?
- Messages
- 1,012
Of course they can. Theyve breathlessly defended the ignoramus for damn near 10 years. Now, if “logical” is implicitly embedded in your version of “defend”, no, they can’t, but ttump and his Pepe the frog/maga milieu have never operated on sound logic.
- Messages
- 1,122
Bleak outlook for US farmers – and Trump tariffs could make it worse
Bumper grain crop set to weigh heavily as farmers count costs of seed, fertilizer – and effects of possible trade war
Many US midwestern grain farmers will lose money this year after reaping a bumper crop, and the outlook for their future income is bleak.
US farmers harvested some of the largest corn and soybean crops in history this year. Big harvests traditionally weigh on crop prices because of plentiful supply. And those price pressures comes at a time when costs remain persistently high to grow corn and soybeans, the US’s most valuable crops.
That double whammy is hurting farmers. Income will vary per farmer and per state, yet even for producers in top agricultural states such as Illinois, losses could be staggering.
Agricultural economists from the University of Illinois and Ohio State University estimate that the average Illinois farm could make a loss of $30,000 for 2024. Their projections place farm incomes at the lowest level since the 1980s’ farm crisis led to bankruptcies.
The decks are stacked against farmers for 2025 as well. Costs for seed, fertilizer and other inputs rose during 2022, fueled by the Russia-Ukraine war, which also lifted crop prices to record highs.
While crop prices are down nearly 50% from those highs, in part due to a global supply glut, input prices remain elevated. Sterling Smith, an independent commodities researcher, says the national average break-even price for corn is $5.67 a bushel, and $12.72 a bushel for soybeans. Those levels are far above current Chicago Board of Trade most-active futures prices of $4.43 for corn and $9.76 for soybeans.
“We’re looking at this crop, that, when it gets planted, of being a money-loser next year,” Smith says.
And things could look worse for farmers if Donald Trump places tariffs on imports. Trump pledged to impose across-the-board tariffs of 20% on all US imports, with a 60% tariff on Chinese goods. Recently, he advocated for 25% tariffs on goods from Canada and Mexico.
...
Until the first trade war between China and the US in 2018, China was the No 1 destination for US agricultural goods. That came to a halt during the trade war, although China and the US eventually signed an agreement in 2019 to import a set amount of agricultural goods for two years.
During the skirmish, China began diversifying its suppliers, including buying from Brazil. Brazil was already a global grower and exporter of soybeans, but Chinese investment ramped up expansion, Smith says.
“China is not going to put their food supply at risk,” Smith says.
Brazil increased their soybean production by the equivalent of an area the size of the state of Kansas, and some estimates suggest it has as much as 70m acres (28m hectares) of unused pastureland it can plant to crops, the equivalent of two states the size of Iowa.
Brazil can also grow the equivalent of two crops in one year, planting soybeans in September and after that harvest, quickly plant a corn crop, he says, increasing Brazilian corn production. If Brazil continues with its aggressive expansion and the US continues its traditional output, a global situation of habitual oversupply will result, especially for soybeans, Smith says.
BlooVooDoo
Honored Member
- Messages
- 815
Not gonna lie, I kinda hope farm bankruptcies triple over the next 4 years. Some as trade war casualties, others due to a lack of affordable labor.
heelinhell
Iconic Member
- Messages
- 1,071
In the last trade war debacle, Trump wrote a check for over 30 billion dollars to bail out the farmers.
He will have no qualms doing the same after next year's trade war debacle.
BlooVooDoo
Honored Member
- Messages
- 815
DOGE will have qualms.
ChileG
Esteemed Member
- Messages
- 742
This “negotiating” style is keeping homeowners interest rates higher than they would be, and having a dampening effect on the stock market.
So, to those who defend Trump as saying this is just his style, then I’d say his style is actively hurting Americans, and it isn’t doing any good and will not have any tangible positive effects in the future.
Last time he did this our farmers lost large markets and never got them back. That necessitated Trump bailing them out with socialist payments the republicans claim to abhor so much.
None of this can be defended in good faith, imo.
So, to those who defend Trump as saying this is just his style, then I’d say his style is actively hurting Americans, and it isn’t doing any good and will not have any tangible positive effects in the future.
Last time he did this our farmers lost large markets and never got them back. That necessitated Trump bailing them out with socialist payments the republicans claim to abhor so much.
None of this can be defended in good faith, imo.
Last edited:
- Messages
- 2,627
Hmmm, didn't the tariffs during his first administration impact the farmers?Bleak outlook for US farmers – and Trump tariffs could make it worse
Bumper grain crop set to weigh heavily as farmers count costs of seed, fertilizer – and effects of possible trade warwww.theguardian.com
Many US midwestern grain farmers will lose money this year after reaping a bumper crop, and the outlook for their future income is bleak.
US farmers harvested some of the largest corn and soybean crops in history this year. Big harvests traditionally weigh on crop prices because of plentiful supply. And those price pressures comes at a time when costs remain persistently high to grow corn and soybeans, the US’s most valuable crops.
That double whammy is hurting farmers. Income will vary per farmer and per state, yet even for producers in top agricultural states such as Illinois, losses could be staggering.
Agricultural economists from the University of Illinois and Ohio State University estimate that the average Illinois farm could make a loss of $30,000 for 2024. Their projections place farm incomes at the lowest level since the 1980s’ farm crisis led to bankruptcies.
The decks are stacked against farmers for 2025 as well. Costs for seed, fertilizer and other inputs rose during 2022, fueled by the Russia-Ukraine war, which also lifted crop prices to record highs.
While crop prices are down nearly 50% from those highs, in part due to a global supply glut, input prices remain elevated. Sterling Smith, an independent commodities researcher, says the national average break-even price for corn is $5.67 a bushel, and $12.72 a bushel for soybeans. Those levels are far above current Chicago Board of Trade most-active futures prices of $4.43 for corn and $9.76 for soybeans.
“We’re looking at this crop, that, when it gets planted, of being a money-loser next year,” Smith says.
And things could look worse for farmers if Donald Trump places tariffs on imports. Trump pledged to impose across-the-board tariffs of 20% on all US imports, with a 60% tariff on Chinese goods. Recently, he advocated for 25% tariffs on goods from Canada and Mexico.
...
Until the first trade war between China and the US in 2018, China was the No 1 destination for US agricultural goods. That came to a halt during the trade war, although China and the US eventually signed an agreement in 2019 to import a set amount of agricultural goods for two years.
During the skirmish, China began diversifying its suppliers, including buying from Brazil. Brazil was already a global grower and exporter of soybeans, but Chinese investment ramped up expansion, Smith says.
“China is not going to put their food supply at risk,” Smith says.
Brazil increased their soybean production by the equivalent of an area the size of the state of Kansas, and some estimates suggest it has as much as 70m acres (28m hectares) of unused pastureland it can plant to crops, the equivalent of two states the size of Iowa.
Brazil can also grow the equivalent of two crops in one year, planting soybeans in September and after that harvest, quickly plant a corn crop, he says, increasing Brazilian corn production. If Brazil continues with its aggressive expansion and the US continues its traditional output, a global situation of habitual oversupply will result, especially for soybeans, Smith says.
This seems like another area where we really need to look for more balance, we need food producers, we should pay enough for them to stay in business and live. Of course, I believe we may also need to consider the actual crops. Why do we grow so many acres of these low-cost grain crops?
- Messages
- 2,627
See this is where I have issues with the fuck around and find out position.
I just can't hope for people to struggle, but this is a case if they don't struggle, they will never learn. So, I'm torn.
Of course, farm bankruptcies probably only impact the family farms and not the corporate farms. We probably need to get rid of all subsidies and let the markets work for the farmers. If that means food prices go up, it's ok. You can't demand low food prices, and living wages for farmers, can you?