Trump to take over D.C. Policing | Chicago Next

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nycfan said:


“… privately, Pritzker and Chicago Mayor Brandon Johnson began discussing what they could do to shield Chicago from a federal deployment like those underway in two other Democrat-run cities with Black mayors, Los Angeles and Washington, D.C.

Their conclusion: not much….”
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“… Chicago has long had a reputation as a city with an elevated crime rate, particularly around gun violence. There have been 1,229 shootings so far this year, including a high-profile drive-by shooting in July targeting a rap artist.
However, the city has made marked progress since the end of the pandemic, according to Chicago crime data. Fatal shootings fell 36% from January 1 through August 25 compared to the same period a year ago. Its July homicide rate, opens new tab of 1.66 per 100,000 residents ranks it below Washington, New Orleans, Kansas City and Little Rock, Arkansas, among other cities.

The falling crime trend mirrors other U.S. cities, reflecting the impact of hundreds of millions of federal dollars allocated in recent years for teachers, police and social workers – the people likely to influence at-risk youth most vulnerable to gun violence, said John Roman, a senior fellow at the research organization NORC at the University of Chicago.

Some of those funds, including $158 million in grants for violence prevention programs across the U.S., were cut in April as part of the Trump administration's reshaping of government….”
 
And, even if they were, there are some real ethical, legal, and practical concerns regarding the use of military as an internal policing force within a country. There are lines that governments should not cross; this is one of them. From a human rights perspective this opens a can of worms. From the perspective of someone who lives in a democratic republic, this erodes a lot of the checks and balances that are integral to a functioning republic - on a national, state, and local level. Trump's actions are undermining not only other government officials at all three levels, and of all three branches of government, but also the country's ideals.

I am deeply concerned about all of that. What keeps me up at night, however, is this: At some point, a proster, or group of protesters, will respond with force against either ICE or the military. I'm not convinced that either group is trained in how to respond to that, or to peaceful protest that includes passive resistance. I do not condone violent protest, but I do recognize that it is, sometimes, the reality. I will, however, actively support passive resistance, and may find the need to do it at some point in the near future.

What happens when people fight back, or refuse to move?

How much are you willing to sacrifice in the name of feeling incrementally safer?
 
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Calheel said:
But again. The military aren’t deployed in the neighborhoods where people feel unsafe.
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Right, they're probably being deployed in the downtown areas, where businesses are, where people tend to congregate, where commerce is happening, etc.

When NY did stop and frisk, it wasn't in neighborhoods.
 
ZenMode said:
Right, they're probably being deployed in the downtown areas, where businesses are, where people tend to congregate, where commerce is happening, etc.

When NY did stop and frisk, it wasn't in neighborhoods.
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First. DC doesn’t really have a downtown. It’s not like a normal city.

Second, the touristy areas are where people are creeped out about large guns. It doesn’t make them feel safe at all. It makes it feel third world.
 
Calheel said:
First. DC doesn’t really have a downtown. It’s not like a normal city.

Second, the touristy areas are where people are creeped out about large guns. It doesn’t make them feel safe at all. It makes it feel third world.
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With respect to crime, DC is like Detroit. The crack epidemic in the 70s and 80s caused crime rates to spike, especially in certain parts of the cities. Now that we're doing better at managing that dynamic, crime rates, and especially homicide rates, in both cities are lower than they have been in decades.
 
lawtig02 said:
With respect to crime, DC is like Detroit. The crack epidemic in the 70s and 80s caused crime rates to spike, especially in certain parts of the cities. Now that we're doing better at managing that dynamic, crime rates, and especially homicide rates, in both cities are lower than they have been in decades.
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Prohibitions have a worse record of working on behavioral issues than the Republicans do of aiding the economy. Why control and regulation isn't almost always a better choice is beyond me.
 
Carolina Fever said:
You really believe Trump sent in the guard because of crime?
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I think that was one of the reasons.

That's separate from the assertion that military being bad in one situation means nobody will welcome them or should welcome them.

Somewhere, a kid will die from a peanut allergy. Does that mean all peanut consumption is bad?
 
ZenMode said:
I think that was one of the reasons.

That's separate from the assertion that military being bad in one situation means nobody will welcome them or should welcome them.

Somewhere, a kid will die from a peanut allergy. Does that mean all peanut consumption is bad?
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I have no idea what you're arguing here. Yes, the NG was needed and welcomed in WNC after Helene, as it was in LA after the wildfires. The NG serves a vital and welcome role in times and places of public catastrophe. The fact that almost NOBODY in DC, Chicago, Baltimore, etc. wants or feels a need for the NG should be dispositive.

Nobody is saying the NG has no role in domestic disaster response. But there should be no argument whatsoever that:

1. Federal law prevents the NG from being used for ordinary law enforcement purposes;
2. The places in which Trump is deploying or has threatened to deploy the NG do not rise to the level of a disaster or an invasion; and
3. Whether the local community wants the NG or not should at least be relevant, and there's no question whatsoever that DC does NOT want the NG.
 
ZenMode said:
When NY did stop and frisk, it wasn't in neighborhoods.
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Yes, it was.

Stop-and-frisk in New York City - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

"New York police officer Adrian Schoolcraft made extensive recordings in 2008 and 2009, which documented orders from NYPD officials to search and arrest black people in the Bedford-Stuyvesant neighborhood. "

"In early July 2012, stop-question-and-frisk protesters who videotaped police stops in New York City were targeted by police for their activism. A "wanted"-style poster hung in a police precinct headquarters, without any allegation of criminal activity, accused one couple of being "professional agitators" whose "purpose is to portray officers in a negative way and too [sic] deter officers from conducting their responsibilities." Police officers later surveilled and recorded the exit of persons from a "stop stop-and-frisk" meeting held at the couple's residence, allegedly in response to an emergency call of loitering and trespass.

"Part of the stop-question-and-frisk program is executed under Operation Clean Halls, a program in which private property owners grant officers prior permission to enter a property for enforcement against criminal activity."

Wrong. About. Everything. You are.
 
ZenMode said:
Yes. Seeing military, like law enforcement in general, can be reassuring.

Other countries have cheered the arrival of the US military.
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I am NEVER reassured by the presence of law enforcement or anyone who is armed. Never. I avoid such areas and interactions like the plague.
 
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