UNC Football Catch-all | Bill Belichick Era underway

[gregh1]

2. Syracuse is an awful football team, with the worst defense in the ACC, was playing their 4th string walk-on lax player-turned-quarterback, and likely won't win another game this season. They had no chance with that kind of limitation. If we had lost to them last night, it would have been the program's worst loss since Furman in 1999.

You mean offense, right? I'd think Stanford or BC would be worst D, and espn FPI and F+ have Cuse 50's / 60's.

Our ability to run the ball last nite, when they knew we were going to run, was impressive. They were without their MLB, perhaps their DL was just demoralized at that point, but Fran Brown is a really good coach and that would be an interesting contrast given all the "toxic lockerroom" junk that has been passed as truth recently.

 

[stankeylegjones]

Went to sleep at half last night, woke up this morning and saw we won and decided to watch he second half on replay. From my observation, the following two things appear to be true:

1. Sincere props to the players and staff for not throwing in the towel on the season when it would have been easy to do so, not only after the humiliation against Clemson, but also the back to back "snatch defeat from the jaws of victory" games the last two weeks. The team is very clearly improving game by game, as you would hope and expect a team would over the course of a 12 game season. After looking completely lost against TCU, UCF, and Clemson, the defense looks way more so like one that I'd expect to be coached by Bill Belichick.

2. Syracuse is an awful football team, with the worst defense in the ACC, was playing their 4th string walk-on lax player-turned-quarterback, and likely won't win another game this season. They had no chance with that kind of limitation. If we had lost to them last night, it would have been the program's worst loss since Furman in 1999.

Both of those things said, I am glad we won- mostly for all of the players, coaches, and support staff. I've been part of losing teams and it's miserable. All of those folks are clearly still working hard every day to get better and it was nice to see their effort rewarded last night, no matter who the opponent was. Whereas after the Clemson game, I thought there was exactly zero chance whatsoever of this Bill Belichick experiment working out for us, now after the last three weeks, I believe it's still quite a long shot overall but not an impossibility.

I remain skeptical about three things: 1. the staff's plan to try to rebuild this mess with a ~45 person high school recruiting class next year; 2. the staff's (primarily Lombardi's) hubris in how they evaluate player personnel; 3. how shockingly undisciplined, non-detail oriented and sloppy the entire on-field operation still is. Until or unless Belichick is willing to 1. jettison Lombardi and bring in actual collegiate player personnel staffers with actual experience successfully evaluating collegiate player personnel, and 2. completely change our offensive philosophy in the offseason, I think it's going to be a continuation of the "8 wins is pretty good around here" mediocrity that has defined Carolina football for decades.

All of that said, glad to have won last night, and hope we can continue to build on the last three weeks by winning the "state championship" over the last 3 weeks of the season.

Regarding 1, I don't agree, yet. Given the shit-show start to the year, all the reports of BB/staff trying to get out of UNC, and so, you'd think it would be hard, nearly impossible, to recruit talented players. Who would want to come here when people are telling you that the coaches are just here for the checks and are looking for other avenues as we speak - or will be fired shortly? Yet, even so, Lombardi is still putting together a really good HS class. If you can put together a really good class, given the headwinds that are blowing, then I think you have shown an ability to attract talent.

This is why I keep saying that we should hold off judgment until after this next portal cycle. Then, we can look at the HS class and the portal class, and with that data have a better idea of if he's an effective GM or not.

 

[CFordUNC]

You mean offense, right? I'd think Stanford or BC would be worst D, and espn FPI and F+ have Cuse 50's / 60's.

Our ability to run the ball last nite, when they knew we were going to run, was impressive. They were without their MLB, perhaps their DL was just demoralized at that point, but Fran Brown is a really good coach and that would be an interesting contrast given all the "toxic lockerroom" junk that has been passed as truth recently.

Ahhh shoot good catch! I definitely meant that they have the worst offense in the league, not defense. Thanks for that.

 

[stankeylegjones]

I’d love to see Bill Belichick get a Mayonnaise bath………except for one thing…….a Mayo Bowl win likely means a contract extension.

LosPollosHermanos,

Your opinion is meaningless.

It’s November 1st and this season is done. It’s already done. We’re what? 3-5? With wins against Phillips Junior High School?

We have 4 games left against piss-poor ACC teams. If we win all four, no one cares.

Why?

They’re the little weak sisters of the poor and horrid ACC.

UNC can run the table and be 7-5 and go to the Mayonnaise Bowl or the Military Bowl and play Temple or Louisiana Tech or Rutgers and win and end up 8-5.

We’re still a shitty team with shitty coaches and a crappy general manager that NO ONE but his best buddy would hire.

I’m hoping LSU follows through with its Governor’s statement and Trump hires LSU’s new coach and that coach is Trump’s favorite Trumplican coach, Bill Belichick.

Was it progress?

Has it been progress?

Syracuse SUCKS. They are bad. Horribly bad.

Cal and UVA are not good teams. Yeah. UVA’s ranked and they beat Louisville. Whoopie!

UNC hasn’t beaten a good team and it hasn’t played a definitively good team.

UNC still makes Mack Era brain dead errors - penalty coming out of our own time-out inside the 5……….and lining up offsides - shades of Des Formerly 5-Star, then 4-Star….then Pffftt as a career….I can’t remember his name.

UNC could run the table (Stanford, Wake, d00k, and ncsulol) and it proves nothing. Lose one and we still suck. Lose all four and we still suck. Win all four? We likely still suck because all four of Stanford, Wake, d00k, and ncsulol are bad-to-mediocre.

Like I said, I think we're at the point that if you can't find any positives then it's because you don't want this staff to succeed.

 

[CFordUNC]

Regarding 1, I don't agree, yet. Given the shit-show start to the year, all the reports of BB/staff trying to get out of UNC, and so, you'd think it would be hard, nearly impossible, to recruit talented players. Who would want to come here when people are telling you that the coaches are just here for the checks and are looking for other avenues as we speak - or will be fired shortly? Yet, even so, Lombardi is still putting together a really good HS class. If you can put together a really good class, given the headwinds that are blowing, then I think you have shown an ability to attract talent.

This is why I keep saying that we should hold off judgment until after this next portal cycle. Then, we can look at the HS class and the portal class, and with that data have a better idea of if he's an effective GM or not.

Not that this is the wrong thing for us to do and so I’m not criticizing it, but I know for a fact we are dropping some hefty bags on many of these high school recruits relative to some of the offers they are getting at other schools (especially the two that recently flipped from Miami and Penn State, respectively, they got supremely paid- and good for them), so it doesn’t surprise me in the slightest that they’re signing here. Let’s hope we are nailing the talent evaluation and program fit, not just signing the guys who are looking for a payday. I do agree with you, though, that we probably need a full high school recruiting cycle and transfer portal cycle this off-season to really be able to evaluate Lombardi.

 

[OGtruthhurts]

Bad wins are better than bad losses. I'll take a bad win over a bad loss every day of the week.

who said they werent? the context is the win was over a very bad team with a more than pathetic walk on qb. if that makes you swell up with pride then thats your prerogative as a fan but dont put words in my mouth trying to move the goalposts.

 

[Calheel]

Went to sleep at half last night, woke up this morning and saw we won and decided to watch he second half on replay. From my observation, the following two things appear to be true:

1. Sincere props to the players and staff for not throwing in the towel on the season when it would have been easy to do so, not only after the humiliation against Clemson, but also the back to back "snatch defeat from the jaws of victory" games the last two weeks. The team is very clearly improving game by game, as you would hope and expect a team would over the course of a 12 game season. After looking completely lost against TCU, UCF, and Clemson, the defense looks way more so like one that I'd expect to be coached by Bill Belichick.

2. Syracuse is an awful football team, with the worst defense in the ACC, was playing their 4th string walk-on lax player-turned-quarterback, and likely won't win another game this season. They had no chance with that kind of limitation. If we had lost to them last night, it would have been the program's worst loss since Furman in 1999.

Both of those things said, I am glad we won- mostly for all of the players, coaches, and support staff. I've been part of losing teams and it's miserable. All of those folks are clearly still working hard every day to get better and it was nice to see their effort rewarded last night, no matter who the opponent was. Whereas after the Clemson game, I thought there was exactly zero chance whatsoever of this Bill Belichick experiment working out for us, now after the last three weeks, I believe it's still quite a long shot overall but not an impossibility.

I remain skeptical about three things: 1. the staff's plan to try to rebuild this mess with a ~45 person high school recruiting class next year; 2. the staff's (primarily Lombardi's) hubris in how they evaluate player personnel; 3. how shockingly undisciplined, non-detail oriented and sloppy the entire on-field operation still is. Until or unless Belichick is willing to 1. jettison Lombardi and bring in actual collegiate player personnel staffers with actual experience successfully evaluating collegiate player personnel, and 2. completely change our offensive philosophy in the offseason, I think it's going to be a continuation of the "8 wins is pretty good around here" mediocrity that has defined Carolina football for decades.

All of that said, glad to have won last night, and hope we can continue to build on the last three weeks by winning the "state championship" over the last 3 weeks of the season.

It’s amazing all the 20-20 hindsight on Syracuse being the worst team we’ve played since Furman. We were a 1.5 point underdog for a reason. Syracuse is bad without Angeli, but we absolutely destroyed them in the second half. Keep in mind that Syracuse has played the top teams in the ACC the last month and has looked better against all of them (except maybe Duke) than they looked against us.

 

[CFordUNC]

It’s amazing all the 20-20 hindsight on Syracuse being the worst team we’ve played since Furman. We were a 1.5 point underdog for a reason. Syracuse is bad without Angeli, but we absolutely destroyed them in the second half. Keep in mind that Syracuse has played the top teams in the ACC the last month and has looked better against all of them (except maybe Duke) than they looked against us.

I don’t think it’s 20-20 hindsight at all. We were 1.5 point underdogs when, I assume, Vegas thought we were going to be playing Syracuse’s backup scholarship quarterback, not the 4th string freshman walkon from the lacrosse team. I’m certainly not saying that we shouldn’t be happy with the win- I’m saying that we should pump the brakes on making any declarations about what this means in the bigger picture as far as program direction. We beat a bad football team playing with a quarterback who quite literally could not complete a forward pass. We looked positively dreadful in the first half. Thankfully, we got our act together and looked much better in the second half. Hopefully it’s something on which we can build.

 

[stankeylegjones]

I don’t think it’s 20-20 hindsight at all. We were 1.5 point underdogs when, I assume, Vegas thought we were going to be playing Syracuse’s backup scholarship quarterback, not the 4th string freshman walkon from the lacrosse team. I’m certainly not saying that we shouldn’t be happy with the win- I’m saying that we should pump the brakes on making any declarations about what this means in the bigger picture as far as program direction. We beat a bad football team playing with a quarterback who quite literally could not complete a forward pass. We looked positively dreadful in the first half. Thankfully, we got our act together and looked much better in the second half. Hopefully it’s something on which we can build.

Didn't the backup also play last night, in the second half? Why didn't they play him more? Was he injured?

 

[CFordUNC]

Didn't the backup also play last night, in the second half? Why didn't they play him more? Was he injured?

I actually have no clue. His name is Rickie Collins, and I truly can’t remember whether he played in the second half or not. I don’t think he did, but I could be wrong. I was mainly watching our offensive series closely (and liked a lot of what I saw!). He wasn’t injured as far as I know, they benched him because he was 0-4 and a turnover machine and I guess they wanted to try something different.

 

[mpaer]

Not that this is the wrong thing for us to do and so I’m not criticizing it, but I know for a fact we are dropping some hefty bags on many of these high school recruits relative to some of the offers they are getting at other schools (especially the two that recently flipped from Miami and Penn State, respectively, they got supremely paid- and good for them), so it doesn’t surprise me in the slightest that they’re signing here. Let’s hope we are nailing the talent evaluation and program fit, not just signing the guys who are looking for a payday. I do agree with you, though, that we probably need a full high school recruiting cycle and transfer portal cycle this off-season to really be able to evaluate Lombardi.

You have to assume TOSU , Tex Tech etc have to cut payroll a lot for incoming 2026 folks... you know depending on how the Clearinghouse impacts their 30-40 mill payrolls.
Maybe, just maybe our 13 mill or whatever it is is more competitive with the big boys this cycle????
Yea if we get the talent evaluation right

 

[CFordUNC]

You have to assume TOSU , Tex Tech etc have to cut payroll a lot for incoming 2026 folks... you know depending on how the Clearinghouse impacts their 30-40 mill payrolls.
Maybe, just maybe our 13 mill or whatever it is is more competitive with the big boys this cycle????
Yea if we get the talent evaluation right

Yeah that would be awesome for sure. I definitely see a much more possible path forward for this whole thing to work next year and maybe even beyond, than I did three weeks ago.

 

[stankeylegjones]

I actually have no clue. His name is Rickie Collins, and I truly can’t remember whether he played in the second half or not. I don’t think he did, but I could be wrong. I was mainly watching our offensive series closely (and liked a lot of what I saw!). He wasn’t injured as far as I know, they benched him because he was 0-4 and a turnover machine and I guess they wanted to try something different.

I Googled but didn't see anything talking about him playing. I thought they brought him (or maybe someone else) in last night in the second half. I could totally be wrong though...I was watching it on my phone due to the Disney-YTTV beef.

I did find this, which is pretty harsh imo:

When asked if Collins would still be the Orange’s starting quarterback against the Tar Heels, Brown indicated that it depended on how the team’s practice went on Wednesday and said that he views the team’s quarterback competition as open.

“It depends how he practices today,” Brown said when asked whether Collins would start on Friday night. “I can’t do that no more. I love Rickie but he had a month straight with me sticking by him. ... He had a month of running the program. We were 3-1 (with Steve Angeli at quarterback). Under Rickie’s time we went 0-4. You have to open that competition up and make sure you’re giving an opportunity for us to go out and win.”

 

[Calheel]

I don’t think it’s 20-20 hindsight at all. We were 1.5 point underdogs when, I assume, Vegas thought we were going to be playing Syracuse’s backup scholarship quarterback, not the 4th string freshman walkon from the lacrosse team. I’m certainly not saying that we shouldn’t be happy with the win- I’m saying that we should pump the brakes on making any declarations about what this means in the bigger picture as far as program direction. We beat a bad football team playing with a quarterback who quite literally could not complete a forward pass. We looked positively dreadful in the first half. Thankfully, we got our act together and looked much better in the second half. Hopefully it’s something on which we can build.

The line didn't move when Syracuse suggested on Wednesday that the backup might start, and it didn't move at all on Friday when it was clear the backup would start. And there is a reason the backup started. The QB the last four games was terrible. As bad as the lax player was last night, at least he didn't throw an interception and had some good QB runs. It is not as though Fran Brown is intentionally playing someone he thinks is worse.

We did not look positively dreadful in the first half. We completely dominated that first half in all ways that matter except the scoreboard.

 

[SnoopRob]

We beat a bad football team playing with a quarterback who quite literally could not complete a forward pass.

Actually, he completed 4 passes (out of 18 attempts, for 39 yards).



Also, the previous starter did not play. I guess they wanted to fully see what this guy could do.

 

[CFordUNC]

The line didn't move when Syracuse suggested on Wednesday that the backup might start, and it didn't move at all on Friday when it was clear the backup would start. And there is a reason the backup started. The QB the last four games was terrible. As bad as the lax player was last night, at least he didn't throw an interception and had some good QB runs. It is not as though Fran Brown is intentionally playing someone he thinks is worse.

We did not look positively dreadful in the first half. We completely dominated that first half in all ways that matter except the scoreboard.

We will have to very adamantly agree to disagree that UNC did not look dreadful in the first half. Sloppy penalties, sloppy turnover, cannot score on short goal to go down and distance, and would have been tied at best- even if you take out the fumble return for touchdown for Syracuse- with a team that had virtually no prayer of completing a forward pass. We were bad. Thankfully adjustments were obviously made at halftime and we looked a lot better.

 

[1moretimeagain]

I guess they wanted to fully see what this guy could do.

They certainly got themselves a good look!

 

[Calheel]

We will have to very adamantly agree to disagree that UNC did not look dreadful in the first half. Sloppy penalties, sloppy turnover, cannot score on short goal to go down and distance, and would have been tied at best- even if you take out the fumble return for touchdown for Syracuse- with a team that had virtually no prayer of completing a forward pass. We were bad. Thankfully adjustments were obviously made at halftime and we looked a lot better.

We would have been up 6-3, not tied. We were basically doubling Syracuse's yards per play, which is the most important efficiency stat in football. Our defense had completely shut down Syracuse's offense, except for one drive.

Yes, we had a bad fumble (why our are receivers/TEs fumbling after the catch so much?) but it was probably our fourth best half of football against a P4 team all season (2nd half of Syracuse, 1st half of UVa and 2d half of Cal ranked ahead).

If you want a dreadful first half of football, look at Clemson.

 

[CFordUNC]

We would have been up 6-3, not tied. We were basically doubling Syracuse's yards per play, which is the most important efficiency stat in football. Our defense had basically completely shut down Syracuse's offense, except for one drive.

Yes, we had a bad fumble (why our are receivers/TEs fumbling after the catch so much?) but it was probably our fourth best half of football against a P4 team all season (2nd half of Syracuse, 1st half of UVa and 2d half of Cal ranked ahead).

If you want a dreadful first half of football, look at Clemson.

I hear ya. We’re probably arguing semantics overall. UNC was not good in the first half, IMO, but was much better in the second half, and won the game going away, which is certainly a commendable feat on the road, regardless of the opponent, given how the first month of the season went.

 

[PTOHeel]

I was very happy and excited for the players to get a conference win, no matter how bad Syracuse is. I’m still quite skeptical that the BB experiment will ultimately work out well for UNC (in terms of wins and losses).

I think any debate about how much progress is being made and how good the defense is will take care of itself in the final three games. Those are not great but decent teams. If we can win 2 out of the final 3 (plus Stanford) and get to a bowl, I will feel cautiously optimistic going into the offseason. If we fall flat and look more like we did early on, I’ll continue to hope that major changes are made. I’ll be at the Stanford game next week and cheering for a win in every game though.