Boston College Biorhythms (2:15 start)

[BillOfRights]

I feel like this is a key. This team really needs to create TOs and when it doesn't bad things happen. And TOs are a function of defense and intensity. I think the focus should be less on giving up 3 point shots and more on not forcing TOs.

I don't think they should focus on any one area of defense, I think they should focus on EVERY area of defense. The defense was horrid today by almost any measure.

 

[Zoo_View]

I don't think they should focus on any one area of defense, I think they should focus on EVERY area of defense. The defense was horrid today by almost any measure.

I’m going with a win is good and a loss is bad.

 

[BillOfRights]

I’m going with a win is good and a loss is bad.

While this is true, I also look at the big picture. How did they play? In this instance, a 30-point win would have been good, a 20-point win ok, an overtime win, not good, and a loss would have been disastrous.

 

[Centerpiece]

I'm interested in hearing your thoughts after you watch it.

@stankeylegjones - OK... Admittedly I did NOT watch most of the game, at first - and did not see the first half much at all - so I never should have spoken out too much to begin with (although my initial statement of "Trimble... in position... on 3's" was accurate. On review of the tape:
1) First basket came off a turnover (poor decision by Cadeau to feed Lubin, leading him right into a double team); entire team off guard and was lazy/late getting back - Brown beats the entire team back, gets behind all of them for the easy, uncontested left-handed lay up.
2) 2nd basket - Cadeau played Olè defense up top = lay up by Beadle; no big man to help in the back
3) 3rd basket off a skip pass Beadle to Hand on the wing; Hand head fakes Jackson and gets easy lay up; Lubon failed to help on drive.
4) 13-9 Heels: Hand simply dribbles left, right past Powell - Cadeau no help; RJ late rotating over to help - easy layup.
5) @ 10 minute mark UNC up by 9 (24-15) looks like Heels go on auto pilot (perhaps thinking game is in hand; lets the Vegas odds of 18-19 pt spread go to their heads perhaps?). Scoring has been easy for them thus far. And Cadeau did make a great defensive play that resulted in a run out and slam by Trimble in the first couple of minutes. Trimble and RJ both hit the first couple of 3pt attempts. I think the team felt at this point they could coast... and they DID coast on offense (89 in reg. 102 for the game); But unfortunately they also "coasted" on D.
6) At 24-15 Brown (after hitting the layup early on) hits his first 3 pointer - He got lost on the wing (RJ was supposed to be on him) the Ball rotated to him; wide open. RJ late getting there. Splash! You could see the light come on in Brown's eyes and he knew right then that the basket looked really big to him for that game. As with a lot of players, you see that first one going in....
7) Next possession - another poor play and ill-advised pass by Cadeau results in another TO and a run out - Hand gets it on the wing and splits between Jackson & Davis (neither stepped in to take the charge) Olè D again... another layup - Lubin late getting there to help.
8) At 27-22 Brown is loosely guarded by Withers in corner. You can tell Withers was not wanting to get beat off the dribble and plays off of him (scouting report was obviously in play here - as in Brown is not a threat to score - only 6pts per game). Not a "wide open" 3 but it was still an open look with no hand in the face.

At that point mid-way through the first half, it's now a 2pt game - and BC has the look of a team who is no longer scared and thinks "we can play with these guys". UNC has the look of a team who feels they can still coast to that 18 pt victory just like the prognosticators claimed all week long. And Brown feels it's his day and continued to jack shots - and hit them. And of course Hand played like Hand - perhaps and All-ACC player. Now the game is "in the grinder" as I say... the Heels were forced to "grind out" the game till the end. Fortunately, they got the W.

I think Heelsandeers sums it up best: "It was shot luck AND about the worst defensive effort you can imagine"

 

[donbosco]

Like a lot of young folks that grew up during COVID these guys have a tough time staying on task. Of course they are playing with and against their own generation so that is simply an observation. I do note that about 15% of my students (same generation) at present don't have any issues with attention. That percentage used to be pretty close to flipped.

 

[donbosco]

BTW

Kudos to Ty Claude. He made a huge difference at a key juncture in the game. Adam Lucas nails it here. Lucas: Change The Game - University of North Carolina Athletics

PS...Ty Claude had the Ritmos...

 

[stankeylegjones]

@stankeylegjones - OK... Admittedly I did NOT watch most of the game, at first - and did not see the first half much at all - so I never should have spoken out too much to begin with (although my initial statement of "Trimble... in position... on 3's" was accurate. On review of the tape:
1) First basket came off a turnover (poor decision by Cadeau to feed Lubin, leading him right into a double team); entire team off guard and was lazy/late getting back - Brown beats the entire team back, gets behind all of them for the easy, uncontested left-handed lay up.
2) 2nd basket - Cadeau played Olè defense up top = lay up by Beadle; no big man to help in the back
3) 3rd basket off a skip pass Beadle to Hand on the wing; Hand head fakes Jackson and gets easy lay up; Lubon failed to help on drive.
4) 13-9 Heels: Hand simply dribbles left, right past Powell - Cadeau no help; RJ late rotating over to help - easy layup.
5) @ 10 minute mark UNC up by 9 (24-15) looks like Heels go on auto pilot (perhaps thinking game is in hand; lets the Vegas odds of 18-19 pt spread goes to their heads perhaps?). Scoring has been for them thus far. And Cadeau did make a great defensive play that resulted in a run out and slam by Trimble in the first couple of minutes. Trimble and RJ both hit the first couple of 3pt attempts. I think the team felt at this point they could coast... and they DID coast on offense (89 in reg. 102 for the game); But unfortunately they also "coasted" on D.
6) At 24-15 Brown (after hitting the layup early on) hits his first 3 pointer - He got lost on the wing (RJ was supposed to be on him) the Ball rotated to him; wide open. RJ late getting there. Splash! You could see the light come on in Brown's eyes and he knew right then that the basket looked really big to him for that game. As with a lot of players, you see that first one going in....
7) Next possession - another poor play and ill-advised pass by Cadeau results in another TO and a run out - Hand gets it on the wing and splits between Jackson & Davis (neither stepped in to take the charge) Olè D again... another layup - Lubin late getting there to help.
8) At 27-22 Brown is loosely guarded by Withers in corner. You can tell Withers was not wanting to get beat off the dribble and plays off of him (scouting report was obviously in play here - as in Brown is not a threat to score - only 6pts per game). Not a "wide open" 3 but it was still an open look with no hand in the face.

At that point mid-way through the first half, it's now a 2pt game - and BC has the look of a team who is no longer scared and thinks "we can play with these guys". UNC has the look of a team who feels they can still coast to that 18 pt victory just like the prognosticators claimed all week long. And Brown feels it's his day and continued to jack shots - and hit them. And of course Hand played like Hand - perhaps and All-ACC player. Now the game is "in the grinder" as I say... the Heels were forced to "grind out" the game till the end. Fortunately, they got the W.

I think Heelsandeers sums it up best: "It was shot luck AND about the worst defensive effort you can imagine"

Thank you for the detailed response! Incredibly poor defense for the majority of the game.

 

[heelwithnoname]

I'm no analyst but it seemed to me multiple times on defense we - particularly J Wash - forced the ball handler baseline in classic UNC defensive fashion expecting help, but the help wasn't there. Layup BC.

 

[Centerpiece]

Thank you for the detailed response! Incredibly poor defense for the majority of the game.

Unfortunately, yes. Poor defense and poor effort. And as Roy used to think: "I'm tired of having to coach 'effort'!"

But taking one step further to what Joel Berry was saying a week or so ago - there is simply no leader(s) on this team. No vocal leader. No locker-room rah rah guy. Nobody to get in your face during a time out huddle. Nobody getting vocal at the free-throw-line-dead-ball-huddle... which Dean made famous.

Last year, guys like Ingram and Ryan were those guys - 29-8 ACC reg.season champs. Couple that lack of floor leadership with no big to replace Bacot, and now we look like 2022/2023 again.

Yes, it eventually falls on Hubert's head, and on to an increasingly hot office chair. But like Roy, he's probably getting tired of "coaching effort". RJ needs to step in and take a charge in at least 2 or 3 instances yesterday. Take the charge, then get up, yelling encouragement and firing up the boyz. But that is obviously not in his nature.

From the portal we need bigs, but we also need those leadership "dogs" like Manek, Ingram and Ryan.

 

[Peppers49]

Unfortunately, yes. Poor defense and poor effort. And as Roy used to think: "I'm tired of having to coach 'effort'!"

But taking one step further to what Joel Berry was saying a week or so ago - there is simply no leader(s) on this team. No vocal leader. No locker-room rah rah guy. Nobody to get in your face during a time out huddle. Nobody getting vocal at the free-throw-line-dead-ball-huddle... which Dean made famous.

Last year, guys like Ingram and Ryan were those guys - 29-8 ACC reg.season champs. Couple that lack of floor leadership with no big to replace Bacot, and now we look like 2022/2023 again.

Yes, it eventually falls on Hubert's head, and on to an increasingly hot office chair. But like Roy, he's probably getting tired of "coaching effort". RJ needs to step in and take a charge in at least 2 or 3 instances yesterday. Take the charge, then get up, yelling encouragement and firing up the boyz. But that is obviously not in his nature.

From the portal we need bigs, but we also need those leadership "dogs" like Manek, Ingram and Ryan.

People love to cite that quote from Roy about effort. I’m sure if you pressed him or any other good coach to expand on that topic, they would all agree that a key skill for the job is being able to motivate the team to consistently bring a competitive edge game in and game out. To your point, a big part of that is bringing in talented players that also have natural leadership.

 

[Centerpiece]

People love to cite that quote from Roy about effort. I’m sure if you pressed him or any other good coach to expand on that topic, they would all agree that a key skill for the job is being able to motivate the team to consistently bring a competitive edge game in and game out. To your point, a big part of that is bringing in talented players that also have natural leadership.

And thus my last point: "...but we also need those leadership "dogs".
Hubert did that twice already. Manek, and then Ingram/Ryan.
He missed with Nance and Cade... and some would argue Lubin and Withers.
Here's hoping the next round of Portal dudes are more like the former than the latter.

But I disagree with your first statement. Roy was the one who kept saying that. People cite that quote because Roy said it so many times. And if you think for one minute Roy wasn't trying 24-7 to "motivate the team to consistently bring a competitive edge game in and game out" then you weren't paying attention from the time Roy started coaching at Kansas until his retirement 4 years ago.

 

[Peppers49]

And thus my last point: "...but we also need those leadership "dogs".
Hubert did that twice already. Manek, and then Ingram/Ryan.
He missed with Nance and Cade... and some would argue Lubin and Withers.
Here's hoping the next round of Portal dudes are more like the former than the latter.

But I disagree with your first statement. Roy was the one who kept saying that. People cite that quote because Roy said it so many times. And if you think for one minute Roy wasn't trying 24-7 to "motivate the team to consistently bring a competitive edge game in and game out" then you weren't paying attention from the time Roy started coaching at Kansas until his retirement 4 years ago.

Your second paragraph makes no sense. Roy didn’t believe he had a responsibility to motivate his players, yet he was trying to do just that 24/7 from the time he started coaching at Kansas to the time he retired? Which one is it? It can’t be both.

 

[BillOfRights]

Your second paragraph makes no sense. Roy didn’t believe he had a responsibility to motivate his players, yet he was trying to do just that 24/7 from the time he started coaching at Kansas to the time he retired? Which one is it? It can’t be both.

I think it can be both. Motivation, encouragement, firing them up, all can be different things at different times, but constantly having to push players during games to give more effort is frustrating. That's how I interpret what Coach Williams, Coach Davis, and Coach Centerpiece are talking about.

 

[Peppers49]

I think it can be both. Motivation, encouragement, firing them up, all can be different things at different times, but constantly having to push players during games to give more effort is frustrating. That's how I interpret what Coach Williams, Coach Davis, and Coach Centerpiece are talking about.

I agree with this. I just think people take Roy’s quote about effort too literally, and beyond that a lot of people in these threads don’t assign enough credit to the role that the head coach plays in modern CBB and CFB. Like they think that NIL and the new transfer rules suddenly made them obsolete and that the results would be the same regardless of who we have on the bench sidelines or sidelines.

 

[BillOfRights]

I agree with this. I just think people take Roy’s quote about effort too literally, and beyond that a lot of people in these threads don’t assign enough credit to the role that the head coach plays in modern CBB and CFB. Like they think that NIL and the new transfer rules suddenly made them obsolete and that the results would be the same regardless of who we have on the bench sidelines or sidelines.

A wise coach used to say that he was a much better coach when he had better players. Coach Smith said after winning the title in 1982 that he wasn't any better as a coach after winning it than he was before.

Part of it is Xs and Os, and part of it is Jimmies and Joes. NIL can certainly help with the Jimmies and Joes. The current Carolina team has personnel challenges, but I'm still optimistic that Coach Davis can find the right combinations at the right times, and I'm hopeful that the players will buy in to much better effort and attention to detail on the defensive end and with rebounding. It probably won't happen to the extent that I wish it would, but I'll still watch and cheer for the Heels.

 

[Peppers49]

A wise coach used to say that he was a much better coach when he had better players. Coach Smith said after winning the title in 1982 that he wasn't any better as a coach after winning it than he was before.

Part of it is Xs and Os, and part of it is Jimmies and Joes. NIL can certainly help with the Jimmies and Joes. The current Carolina team has personnel challenges, but I'm still optimistic that Coach Davis can find the right combinations at the right times, and I'm hopeful that the players will buy in to much better effort and attention to detail on the defensive end and with rebounding. It probably won't happen to the extent that I wish it would, but I'll still watch and cheer for the Heels.

For sure. You don’t have to be some master Xs and Os tactician like Dean Smith to be a successful coach. I just see this take floated around that NIL has made the role of the head coach not matter anymore and that the results are going to be what they are no matter who that person is, and I feel like that’s a crazy oversimplification. The job description is certainly different than it used to be, but it’s not any less important.

That’t not commentary one way or the other on Hubert specifically. Just a general observation.

 

[BubbaOtis]

I've read the basketball NIL fund got stocked along with the football fund. From the number I heard for Caleb Wilson I'm thinking recruiting will improve.

 

[UNCatTech]

I've read the basketball NIL fund got stocked along with the football fund. From the number I heard for Caleb Wilson I'm thinking recruiting will improve.

I read $3M over on IC?

I also read that AJ got $7M to waste a year at BYU.

I really don't see how there is any ROI on this kind of money for a year in college.

 

[Centerpiece]

“Roy didn’t believe he had a responsibility to motivate his players”

That’s not what Roy said.
And Roy would be the first to say that it is coach’s responsibility to motivate. What he said was that he shouldn’t have to coach effort.

You ever coach anything?

 

[Peppers49]

That’s not what Roy said.
And Roy would be the first to say that it is coach’s responsibility to motivate. What he said was he shouldn’t have to coach effort.

You ever coach anything?

Effort, motivation, we’re arguing semantics here.

What sort of coaching experience do you have that makes you know any more qualified to pontificate about this stuff than me or anyone else that posts on a message board?