DOGE Catch-All

[farce©]

Over the next year or two the hoi polloi are going to have an epiphany...

that Reagan was wrong. Government is not the problem ; GQPers running the government is the problem

I suspect they won’t. That would require a degree of analysis I don’t believe will happen. The “epiphany” will require a charismatic communicator to convince them to change course. They need to be told, they won’t just figure it out. Their media bubble will de-platform conflicting messages so reaching that audience is difficult. The best bet is getting a popular influencer, a Joe Rogan type, to carry the message. It’s unlikely to get traction in a hierarchical organization like right wing news networks.

 

[altmin]

I suspect they won’t. That would require a degree of analysis I don’t believe will happen. The “epiphany” will require a charismatic communicator to convince them to change course. They need to be told, they won’t just figure it out. Their media bubble will de-platform conflicting messages so reaching that audience is difficult. The best bet is getting a popular influencer, a Joe Rogan type, to carry the message. It’s unlikely to get traction in a hierarchical organization like right wing news networks.

Agreed. They will be told it was the fault of immigrants or something and the angry mob will gladly follow the arrow.

 

[nycfan]

 

[wmheel1287]

Again, what Trump or Elon said is beside the point. There is something wrong with their system regardless of whether or not every person is correctly being paid.

If my employer had a flaw in their backend system, that showed an extra zero at the end of each payroll payment ($4000 showed as $40000), but each person got paid the correct ($4000) amount, that would not negate the clear issue with the system/data/reporting.

When your system shows you paying money to tens of millions of dead people, that is, in itself, an issue.

If "the system" is generating the correct payments to the correct recipients, then there is absolutley nothing wrong with "the system".

The purpose of the Social Security Administration is not to maintain a pristine database that cannot be forced to generate useless reporting of remnant data. The purpose of "the system" is to get payments to the appropriate parties and not pay those who should not be.

If you want people to recognize a flaw in that system then you need to demonstrate that it is not accomplishing those goals.

 

[wmheel1287]

I can imagine that one's political affiliation and campaign giving will be the primary determining factor in whether they need fear the IRS. Make no mistake that a BIG reason to have all this data from all these agencies is to start correlating it.

 

[nycfan]

New Social Security chief was being investigated when Musk team tapped him​

Leland Dudek, a data analyst working in a small anti-fraud office, was suspected of sharing unauthorized access to information with representatives of Musk’s U.S. DOGE Service. Now he’s the acting Social Security commissioner.

“Leaders of the Social Security Administration had just opened an investigation into a career employee they believed was improperly sharing information with Elon Musk’s cost-cutting team when President Donald Trump elevated the employee this week to acting commissioner, according to three current or former government officials with knowledge of the events.

The agency’s leadership team became aware in recent weeks that Leland Dudek, a data analyst working in a small anti-fraud office who had been unknown to many of them, was sharing unauthorized access to information with representatives of Musk’s U.S. DOGE Service, according to the three, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to describe an internal matter.

It’s not clear what data Dudek shared, but his actions raised enough alarm that he may have violated privacy and tax laws that senior officials placed him on paid leave as they launched their investigation.

The officials, including attorneys in the general counsel’s office, also were notified late last week that Dudek had sent harassing emails to employees in the agency’s personnel and security divisions to rush them to let several engineers hired by DOGE start work and gain access to agency computer systems. The officials pushed back, saying that they had not completed background investigations into the new hires.

… The White House skipped over scores of career senior executives in the agency’s line of succession in appointing Dudek, an IT expert with a zeal for eliminating fraud who was a high-ranking employee on the federal salary scale but not a manager.

… “They want to fire me for cooperating with DOGE,” Dudek wrote in a now-deleted LinkedIn post that was captured by several Social Security employees and is making the rounds of the staff.

“I confess,” he wrote. “I helped DOGE understand SSA. I mailed myself publicly accessible documents and explained them to DOGE. I confess. I moved contractor money around to add data science resources to my anti-fraud team. I confess. I asked where the fat was and is in our contracts so we can make the right tough choices.” …”

 

[nycfan]

New Social Security chief was being investigated when Musk team tapped him​

Leland Dudek, a data analyst working in a small anti-fraud office, was suspected of sharing unauthorized access to information with representatives of Musk’s U.S. DOGE Service. Now he’s the acting Social Security commissioner.

“Leaders of the Social Security Administration had just opened an investigation into a career employee they believed was improperly sharing information with Elon Musk’s cost-cutting team when President Donald Trump elevated the employee this week to acting commissioner, according to three current or former government officials with knowledge of the events.

The agency’s leadership team became aware in recent weeks that Leland Dudek, a data analyst working in a small anti-fraud office who had been unknown to many of them, was sharing unauthorized access to information with representatives of Musk’s U.S. DOGE Service, according to the three, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to describe an internal matter.

It’s not clear what data Dudek shared, but his actions raised enough alarm that he may have violated privacy and tax laws that senior officials placed him on paid leave as they launched their investigation.

The officials, including attorneys in the general counsel’s office, also were notified late last week that Dudek had sent harassing emails to employees in the agency’s personnel and security divisions to rush them to let several engineers hired by DOGE start work and gain access to agency computer systems. The officials pushed back, saying that they had not completed background investigations into the new hires.

… The White House skipped over scores of career senior executives in the agency’s line of succession in appointing Dudek, an IT expert with a zeal for eliminating fraud who was a high-ranking employee on the federal salary scale but not a manager.

… “They want to fire me for cooperating with DOGE,” Dudek wrote in a now-deleted LinkedIn post that was captured by several Social Security employees and is making the rounds of the staff.

“I confess,” he wrote. “I helped DOGE understand SSA. I mailed myself publicly accessible documents and explained them to DOGE. I confess. I moved contractor money around to add data science resources to my anti-fraud team. I confess. I asked where the fat was and is in our contracts so we can make the right tough choices.” …”

“… Dozens of probationary employees were notified Thursday that they would be fired unless they transferred to lower-paying front-line roles. Officials have struggled since the coronavirus pandemic to provide timely customer service, particularly to those seeking disability benefits, with long waits for phone service and growing processing times for disability claims.

Meanwhile, legislation passed in December giving full retirement benefits to public sector employees has thrown the agency a new and complex task of implementing the changes, which affect the benefits for more than 3 million people.

… Dudek proposed some big changes for agency operations, including digitizing Social Security cards, reorganizing IT functions and outsourcing “lower risk transactions” now staffed by employees, raising concerns among some attendees that personally identifiable information would land in the hands of outside companies.

Dudek told at least one manager that their staff was too large, attendees said. On Friday, a press release said that almost all agreements with outside researchers, who study ideas to keep retirement benefits solvent, monitor disability benefit trends and analyze program data, would be canceled. The release said $15 million would be saved.

“There ARE good people in the government who want to eliminate fraud & waste,” Musk posted Thursday on X about Dudek’s elevation to acting commissioner. “Amazingly, Leland was fired by Social Security upper management for helping @DOGE find taxpayer savings. Can you believe that?? Thanks to President Trump, Leland was brought back right away and now HE is upper management.”

Musk’s and Trump’s claims on social media and in press briefings that people who are 100, 200 and even 300 years old are improperly receiving retirement benefits were wildly overstated and misrepresent Social Security data, The Post found.

Dudek, in a statement to employees this week, acknowledged that the claims involve people who do not have a date of death listed on their record. “These individuals are not necessarily receiving benefits,” he wrote. …”

 

[nycfan]

“… Dozens of probationary employees were notified Thursday that they would be fired unless they transferred to lower-paying front-line roles. Officials have struggled since the coronavirus pandemic to provide timely customer service, particularly to those seeking disability benefits, with long waits for phone service and growing processing times for disability claims.

Meanwhile, legislation passed in December giving full retirement benefits to public sector employees has thrown the agency a new and complex task of implementing the changes, which affect the benefits for more than 3 million people.

… Dudek proposed some big changes for agency operations, including digitizing Social Security cards, reorganizing IT functions and outsourcing “lower risk transactions” now staffed by employees, raising concerns among some attendees that personally identifiable information would land in the hands of outside companies.

Dudek told at least one manager that their staff was too large, attendees said. On Friday, a press release said that almost all agreements with outside researchers, who study ideas to keep retirement benefits solvent, monitor disability benefit trends and analyze program data, would be canceled. The release said $15 million would be saved.

“There ARE good people in the government who want to eliminate fraud & waste,” Musk posted Thursday on X about Dudek’s elevation to acting commissioner. “Amazingly, Leland was fired by Social Security upper management for helping @DOGE find taxpayer savings. Can you believe that?? Thanks to President Trump, Leland was brought back right away and now HE is upper management.”

Musk’s and Trump’s claims on social media and in press briefings that people who are 100, 200 and even 300 years old are improperly receiving retirement benefits were wildly overstated and misrepresent Social Security data, The Post found.

Dudek, in a statement to employees this week, acknowledged that the claims involve people who do not have a date of death listed on their record. “These individuals are not necessarily receiving benefits,” he wrote. …”

“… Dudek said that DOGE officials have access to some Social Security data, identified by people familiar with it as the Enterprise Data Warehouse, but that the access is on a read-only basis.

The database contains records for all Americans who have been issued Social Security numbers and interacted with the agency to apply for benefits. Also included are wage, tax and bank account information as well as addresses.

Employee access to Social Security’s sensitive data is severely restricted to those who are authorized to see it to complete their job duties. The systems are continuously monitored to identify suspicious behaviors.

During Trump’s first term, the White House sought access to a particularly sensitive database known as the No Match File that compares Social Security numbers with employers’ earning statements. The White House was interested in finding undocumented immigrants who may have been using stolen identities.

Officials denied access at the time, but career officials are concerned that with its more aggressive second-term approach to deporting undocumented immigrants and asserting control over government operations, the White House could gain access to the data. …”

 

[superrific]

Reporting, like the type provided by Elon, very, very, very likely isn't compiled manually on in an Excel spreadsheet. It would take an army of people weeks to manually count people in each age group. It IS based on a query that generates a report. That query is run against a database.

Here's a query

update tbl_Bad_Faith_Posters set bullshit_level = 'MAX' where posterID = 'ZenMode';

 

[ZenMode]

Here's a query

update tbl_Bad_Faith_Posters set bullshit_level = 'MAX' where posterID = 'ZenMode';

..... Because we can't simply disagree or see things differently, it has to be bad faith on one of our parts, right?

I used to believe that about some of the leftist positions, particularly as it's relates to race. I used to think that no rational person could actually believe some of the things that Ibram X Kendi claims to believe. I came to realize that people actually do believe a lot of very odd things. But, before that realization, it was easier just to write them off as being dishonest or operating in bad faith.

 

[Healing]

Bad faith (Latin: mala fides) is a sustained form of deception which consists of entertaining or pretending to entertain one set of feelings while acting as if influenced by another. It is associated with hypocrisy, breach of contract, affectation, and lip service. It may involve intentional deceit of others, or self-deception.

Some examples of bad faith include: soldiers waving a white flag and then firing when their enemy approaches to take prisoners (cf. perfidy); a company representative who negotiates with union workers while having no intent of compromising;a prosecutor who argues a legal position that he knows to be false; and an insurer who uses language and reasoning which are deliberately misleading in order to deny a claim.

Bad faith - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Bad faith: lack of honesty in dealing with other people

Definition of BAD FAITH

lack of honesty in dealing with other people… See the full definition

www.merriam-webster.com

Honesty: adherence to the facts; fairness and straightforwardness of conduct

Definition of HONESTY

adherence to the facts : sincerity; fairness and straightforwardness of conduct… See the full definition

www.merriam-webster.com

 

[nycfan]

 

[superrific]

..... Because we can't simply disagree or see things differently, it has to be bad faith on one of our parts, right?

There is no seeing things differently on this issue. There is a fact, and there is bullshit.

1. I was in charge of developing a database application for TV ad buying. In my database, I had the full Nielsen ratings (there are actually more companies and more ratings than this, but for ease of reference) from over 30 countries. I also had a list of advertising time slots for all of those countries as well. All of it. For years and years. I literally had hundreds of data feeds being pumped into my system. Not a single one was a flawless file. Especially not US Nielsen, which were a mess. That was Nielsen's version 1.0. They had better systems in other countries. Want to guess why they hadn't changed it in all that time?

For another project I managed, I had all the purchasing data from Bristol Myers in my database. All of it. Gigs and gigs. And again, we were drawing data from a large number of sources: SAP data from the company; legacy systems from companies that had been acquired; vendor report; accounting systems. None were flawless. My database was not flawless. There were columns that we inserted to solve a problem, but then when the problem became more complicated, those columns didn't work any more. The original approach -- a single database flag, useful for a 1:1 relationship -- was insufficient for a many:many relationship, and thus did we need a glue table. Did I delete the column? No, because I've explained to you -- that's really expensive, cumbersome and completely unnecessary.

2. You played around with MS Access. Even this is doubtful because you probably would have mentioned it earlier in the conversation, so I suspect what you did was watch a video about it after you were called out on it. But even assuming you're being honest -- it's a fucking MS Access database. It's not real life. It's not a production environment. It's not remotely comparable in scope or scale to a large purchasing system, especially not the federal government's purchasing system.

3. You want me -- no, you're desparate for me -- to affirm your experience here as if it's remotely comparable. I have no need to poop on what you've done, except that you are literally trying to tell a professional how the world works on the basis of your goofing off. And it's not just me. Another poster with actual professional experience chimed in, saying exactly what I've been saying.

How do you expect me to treat you in this circumstance? "Oh, opinions differ?" Where does that end? Do you argue with cosmologists about general relativity? What about your physicians? Hey, maybe you should read something about a medication side effect and then lecture the doctor about it! This is precisely the mentality that has created Trump. It's not liberals being rude. It's people like you who think you can understand everything about the world from your armchair. So he promises the world, says things that don't make sense -- and when we tell you that it's all bullshit, you argue with us.

So you find out the hard way. Unfortunately, you sink the whole ship in the process, and we all drown.

 

[nycfan]

 

[ZenMode]

There is no seeing things differently on this issue. There is a fact, and there is bullshit.

1. I was in charge of developing a database application for TV ad buying. In my database, I had the full Nielsen ratings (there are actually more companies and more ratings than this, but for ease of reference) from over 30 countries. I also had a list of advertising time slots for all of those countries as well. All of it. For years and years. I literally had hundreds of data feeds being pumped into my system. Not a single one was a flawless file. Especially not US Nielsen, which were a mess. That was Nielsen's version 1.0. They had better systems in other countries. Want to guess why they hadn't changed it in all that time?

For another project I managed, I had all the purchasing data from Bristol Myers in my database. All of it. Gigs and gigs. And again, we were drawing data from a large number of sources: SAP data from the company; legacy systems from companies that had been acquired; vendor report; accounting systems. None were flawless. My database was not flawless. There were columns that we inserted to solve a problem, but then when the problem became more complicated, those columns didn't work any more. The original approach -- a single database flag, useful for a 1:1 relationship -- was insufficient for a many:many relationship, and thus did we need a glue table. Did I delete the column? No, because I've explained to you -- that's really expensive, cumbersome and completely unnecessary.

2. You played around with MS Access. Even this is doubtful because you probably would have mentioned it earlier in the conversation, so I suspect what you did was watch a video about it after you were called out on it. But even assuming you're being honest -- it's a fucking MS Access database. It's not real life. It's not a production environment. It's not remotely comparable in scope or scale to a large purchasing system, especially not the federal government's purchasing system.

3. You want me -- no, you're desparate for me -- to affirm your experience here as if it's remotely comparable. I have no need to poop on what you've done, except that you are literally trying to tell a professional how the world works on the basis of your goofing off. And it's not just me. Another poster with actual professional experience chimed in, saying exactly what I've been saying.

How do you expect me to treat you in this circumstance? "Oh, opinions differ?" Where does that end? Do you argue with cosmologists about general relativity? What about your physicians? Hey, maybe you should read something about a medication side effect and then lecture the doctor about it! This is precisely the mentality that has created Trump. It's not liberals being rude. It's people like you who think you can understand everything about the world from your armchair. So he promises the world, says things that don't make sense -- and when we tell you that it's all bullshit, you argue with us.

So you find out the hard way. Unfortunately, you sink the whole ship in the process, and we all drown.

"You played around with MS Access. Even this is doubtful because you probably would have mentioned it earlier in the conversation"

<sarcasm>First, let me say I am shocked..... shocked I tell you, that you would distrust a claim that would allow someone to credibly question your beliefs.</sarcasm>

Second, what I said about the social security system/database (which you can read starting at post 93) is that it is inaccurate, which it clearly is, it's ridiculous that it's inaccurate, which is an opinion statement that you are welcome to disagree with, and I said:

Two separate topics. It can be true that the right people are getting paid and, at the same time, it can be true that the system/data/reporting can have something wrong with it.

I said nothing about incorrect payments going out. I said nothing about risks of fixing the issue.

So, what specifically are you disagreeing with?

 

[superrific]

"You played around with MS Access. Even this is doubtful because you probably would have mentioned it earlier in the conversation"

<sarcasm>First, let me say I am shocked..... shocked I tell you, that you would distrust a claim that would allow someone to credibly question your beliefs.</sarcasm>

Second, what I said about the social security system/database (which you can read starting at post 93) is that it is inaccurate, which it clearly is, it's ridiculous that it's inaccurate, which is an opinion statement that you are welcome to disagree with, and I said:

Two separate topics. It can be true that the right people are getting paid and, at the same time, it can be true that the system/data/reporting can have something wrong with it.

I said nothing about incorrect payments going out. I said nothing about risks of fixing the issue.

So, what specifically are you disagreeing with?

If you think you dabbling in MS Access is a challenge to my beliefs, you're even sillier than I thought.

I'm not talking about this any more. It's irrelevant. Either you can learn from someone who knows what they are talking about, or you can do your Cliff Clavin schtick until the end of time. It is not ridiculous since it's best practice and every sizeable database, save possibly those created in the past 10 or 15 years (which I wouldn't know about as I haven't seen them), has the same property. Oh, right, you reserve the right to call the entire world ridiculous to cover up the fact that you don't know what you're talking about.

Bye.

 

[ZenMode]

If you think you dabbling in MS Access is a challenge to my beliefs, you're even sillier than I thought.

I'm not talking about this any more. It's irrelevant. Either you can learn from someone who knows what they are talking about, or you can do your Cliff Clavin schtick until the end of time. It is not ridiculous since it's best practice and every sizeable database, save possibly those created in the past 10 or 15 years (which I wouldn't know about as I haven't seen them), has the same property. Oh, right, you reserve the right to call the entire world ridiculous to cover up the fact that you don't know what you're talking about.

Bye.

Right. So let me know when you can, without incorporating your assumptions, specifically dispute something that I said.

 

[Mulberry Heel]

Again, it is crystal clear that their strategy is to try and convince their base that there is such massive fraud in Social Security and Medicare that they need to be cut and/or drastically "reformed" (privatized). In this case I'm not sure it's going to work, as so many older Trumpers need SS and Medicare that they will likely be very wary and skittish of any serious changes that might affect them. If Musk & Trump were smart - and they're not - they would instead try to sell Trumpers on the idea of keeping benefits for those who are 55 or older (or maybe 50 or older) and then greatly reducing or cutting it for everyone below that. But it seems clear that they've decided to go for broke, so to speak, and cut even current SS and Medicare holders benefits. And even with the cult I'm not sure that's going to work for them. But I do suspect it's the only way they're going to pay for massive tax cuts and those ridiculous promises of $5,000 checks for everybody (which I still seriously doubt will ever happen). The pushback the GA GOP Congressman got from a mostly Republican audience in what was supposed to be a friendly town hall meeting in a heavily GOP district shows the risk they're running.

 

[DougDaBroadcasta]

 

[Mulberry Heel]

I definitely think there is growing concern and even fear among some Trumpers about what is happening. I just saw this post on a local TV news station facebook page article discussing Trump and Elon saying that they will give $5,000 checks to everybody. It's hard to feel sympathy for her, but her post does express that even some Trumpers are beginning to realize that government programs they count on and probably took for granted are now in danger. And that in turn should be a warning sign for Trump, Congressional Republicans, and especially Musk. Of those three Musk is the most expendable, although I suspect that he's clueless to that fact.

"I voted for him to get rid of all the illegals that are leaching off of our government I did not vote for him to lay people off of their jobs. Why you don’t think you pay for unemployment taxes and he don’t need to be given the rich tax cuts by taking it from poor people sorry that that’s the way I feel I’m glad you have so much money that you don’t need no medical or anything. Kudos for you, lady, but the rest of America is not that fortunate we need our Social Security benefits and our Medicaid and Medicare for poor children before the rich gets a tax break."