GOP & Policies toward/treatment of Transgender & other LGBTQ Americans
- Thread starter nycfan
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If there were an increase in assault it would be when a trans wanted to go in the men's room and I suspect they would be the one assaulted.
Apparently, you never been quiet and innocuous enough to hear women talk. They are not the prudish sex in private.
MOUNTAINH33L
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Me thinks Calla doth protest too much.
He wants to be a provocateur but he doesn't even have the shreds of credibility it takes for that. It shows so badly when you don't even understand your own arguments and the only response to feedback is "scoreboard". I play because ,well,you know, but it's not much of a game. It would be interesting if he could make an argument that he actually had some real sources to support that was a little more neutral than Newsmax and the like.
ZenMode
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As I mentioned earlier, it's not necessarily the trans women I'm worried about. The numbers are too low to really matter.
My concern is opening the door to all males, trans or not, being permitted in women's showers, locker rooms and bathrooms, because I don't see how you can legally allow "only males who believe they are females".
lawtig02
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So let's flip that around. You're touring the Capitol and need to use the restroom, so you enter the men's room and see Sarah McBride coming out of a stall.
That's apparently where House leadership wants her to be. How do you think that makes her feel? How does it make you feel while you're standing at the urinal doing your business and she's washing her hands right behind you?
I understand the complexities of these situations. What I don't understand is how it could possibly make more sense to require Sarah to use the men's room, where there's not full privacy, as opposed to the women's room, where there is.
How about those under the treatment protocol for transitioning? Don't know much about it but my son had a friend who went through that some 30 years ago. I didn't know him well and really didn't care but I overheard enough to get that he had to live either a year or two years as a woman before any of the surgery and stuff would be considered. I don't know if that is true today but being under medical and/or psychological evaluation would move it well past a whim. I'd assume any sort of violation of the terms of treatment would affect the ability to proceed.
sringwal
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TangledUpInBlue06
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It sounds like most people are not concerned that trans women will be the ones causing problems in restrooms. It sounds like people are concerned about cis men either pretending to be trans women or just using some legal opening to waltz into women's restrooms.
Why punish trans women if the concern is cis men? Taking a page from Odessa's playbook in an earlier post, how about creating a private right of action for women that encounter cis men pretending to be trans in order to enter a women's room? Number 1, I imagine most women (other than the Nancy Mace types) would not bring such a suit if they did not feel threatened. Number 2, as a defense, I imagine an accused would possess and could rather easily present evidence of having lived as a trans woman for some reasonable period of time. It may not be perfect, but isn't that a solution more targeted to the problem? The trans community faces enough judgment and discrimination, they don't need to bear the burden of concerns over cis men's misbehavior too.
CallMeTyler
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These people have no understanding of logical fallacies, much less the introspection needed to acknowledge their use.
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Anyone posting on this thread with zero understanding of gender dysphoria (which would include anyone who thinks gender assigned at birth is definitive or "anyone with a penis is a man") needs to read a bit about the topic. It isn't as simple as your need for political expediency would have you believe.
This very brief overview from the Cleveland Clinic is a starting point.
This very brief overview from the Cleveland Clinic is a starting point.
ZenMode
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So, again, I'm not nearly as concerned about trans women specifically. The numbers are very small so there's little risk for negative impact to cis women. It's more opening the door to all males in women's restrooms, locker rooms and showers. I think many women will want, and should have, the ability to change and shower in privacy and safety.So let's flip that around. You're touring the Capitol and need to use the restroom, so you enter the men's room and see Sarah McBride coming out of a stall.
That's apparently where House leadership wants her to be. How do you think that makes her feel? How does it make you feel while you're standing at the urinal doing your business and she's washing her hands right behind you?
I understand the complexities of these situations. What I don't understand is how it could possibly make more sense to require Sarah to use the men's room, where there's not full privacy, as opposed to the women's room, where there is.
On the actual topic of where Sarah should go to use the restroom. It really comes down to whether you see feelings as the determiner or biology. Some say the former. Some say the latter. I don't see a way of reconciling that difference.
I guess if you're stuck in the naked bodies are sex, sex is evil and even God can't give me enough strength to resist temptation type, it could be a problem. Course, being that type of person is a bigger one. Separate stalls to dress and shower in aren't enough privacy? What does it take? That's at least as much protection and privacy as a bikini at the pool.
superrific
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That door is already open to all males. Generally speaking, there are no laws prohibiting people from using the other bathroom. It's a matter for the establishments to police (one reason that bars and restaurants often have single-occupancy unisex bathrooms).
And yet males generally speaking DO NOT go into women's bathrooms. They could. There's nothing stopping them. So no law is necessary.
Literally the only bathroom laws are these idiocies being pushed by right-wingers. They accomplish nothing at all. There is no epidemic of men in women's bathrooms, and that isn't going to change with or without laws or protections for trans people. There are many reasons for this, and they are too obvious for us to have to spend time on, but at least one reason is that anyone who wants to see things that happen in women's bathrooms can have their exact fetish met with porn.
Callatoroy
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There is full privacy in men's room.So let's flip that around. You're touring the Capitol and need to use the restroom, so you enter the men's room and see Sarah McBride coming out of a stall.
That's apparently where House leadership wants her to be. How do you think that makes her feel? How does it make you feel while you're standing at the urinal doing your business and she's washing her hands right behind you?
I understand the complexities of these situations. What I don't understand is how it could possibly make more sense to require Sarah to use the men's room, where there's not full privacy, as opposed to the women's room, where there is.
lawtig02
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I mean, sure, if you're one of those people who always uses a stall to pee.
WaynetheDrain
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Nancy is such a victim.