Hot Stove: UNC Basketball

[Carolina Fever]

 

[nycfan]

So, any actual non-premium news floating about? My Braves are off to a horrific 0-fer start and just lost Profar for 80 games and the playoffs (if the Braves make the playoffs anyway). The entire lineup is batting about .150 so far this first week.

I need some positive sports news, dammit. Throw me a bone here. Let me pretend we will land someone good from the portal?

 

[superrific]

Again, I DOUBT your 6 year-old was draining “shot-after-shot” from the elbow day-after-day……even if the “elbow” was 3-feet from the rim. He’s 6.

Doubt whatever you want. You're drunk all the time anyway.

6 year olds can be really good at a lot of things if trained properly. He inherited extremely strong thighs and hips from his mom. That's also why he could throw a baseball or football better than kids three or four years older.

You also have no clue about youth sports. Not only could my son hit three foot shots, he could do it with both hands. I trained him to always use his left hand when going left, and right hand when going right. Today he shoots floaters with both hands. He could also do a reverse layup with his strong hand when he was 6. I told him not to try a reverse layup with his off-hand until he was older -- when he was 8, he did it with his left just to show me. It was older.

He also had crazy handles. He could dribble two balls at once, staggered. He could do crossovers with them. With a single ball, he could use a behind-the-back dribble in lieu of a crossover to get by a defender with good hands (or a dad teaching him). AND he wasn't the best player on his travel team. Because there was another kid who had all the same skills (a bit less shooting, a bit better defense) but was a bit taller with more athleticism. That was the kid whose dad had played in the NBA. He's playing DI now, btw.

As for my son, he's only 6'1" now. I'm almost 6'5" and the hoop dreams for my son involved him being a 6'3" PG with tight handles, a good shot, and a high basketball IQ. That's one reason there's a thousand and one ways to lose with the shoes. You can't control how tall you end up, and that can put a real damper on a childhood devoted to balling. If you've seen Hoop Dreams you know what I'm talking about.

 

[superrific]

So, any actual non-premium news floating about? My Braves are off to a horrific 0-fer start and just lost Profar for 80 games and the playoffs (if the Braves make the playoffs anyway). The entire lineup is batting about .150 so far this first week.

I need some positive sports news, dammit. Throw me a bone here. Let me pretend we will land someone good from the portal?

I got a bad feeling about the Braves this season. I'm not sure exactly why, but it just seems like the roster has been held together with spit and glue for a couple of years now. I don't buy Ozuna as the DH -- I think he careered last season and there might be PEDs involved there. Who knows how Acuna will play when returning from injury, but he'll have to do better than he did last year. Olson is feast or famine, and he's not young. And the pitching staff is -- well, I don't know what to make of it.

The PG from BYU who I'm informed is almost a sure fire UNC player is good. Former 4 star recruit, played 17 mpg on a tourney team. Sounds like the profile of one Harrison Ingram. Maybe not quite as lauded in high school, and a year behind, but I don't mind that guy at all.

 

[Zoo_View]

Doubt whatever you want. You're drunk all the time anyway.

6 year olds can be really good at a lot of things if trained properly. He inherited extremely strong thighs and hips from his mom. That's also why he could throw a baseball or football better than kids three or four years older.

You also have no clue about youth sports. Not only could my son hit three foot shots, he could do it with both hands. I trained him to always use his left hand when going left, and right hand when going right. Today he shoots floaters with both hands. He could also do a reverse layup with his strong hand when he was 6. I told him not to try a reverse layup with his off-hand until he was older -- when he was 8, he did it with his left just to show me. It was older.

He also had crazy handles. He could dribble two balls at once, staggered. He could do crossovers with them. With a single ball, he could use a behind-the-back dribble in lieu of a crossover to get by a defender with good hands (or a dad teaching him). AND he wasn't the best player on his travel team. Because there was another kid who had all the same skills (a bit less shooting, a bit better defense) but was a bit taller with more athleticism. That was the kid whose dad had played in the NBA. He's playing DI now, btw.

As for my son, he's only 6'1" now. I'm almost 6'5" and the hoop dreams for my son involved him being a 6'3" PG with tight handles, a good shot, and a high basketball IQ. That's one reason there's a thousand and one ways to lose with the shoes. You can't control how tall you end up, and that can put a real damper on a childhood devoted to balling. If you've seen Hoop Dreams you know what I'm talking about.

The next Bronny James!

 

[TarSpiel]

So, any actual non-premium news floating about? My Braves are off to a horrific 0-fer start and just lost Profar for 80 games and the playoffs (if the Braves make the playoffs anyway). The entire lineup is batting about .150 so far this first week.

I need some positive sports news, dammit. Throw me a bone here. Let me pretend we will land someone good from the portal?

FWIW, I really like the names we're targeting right now in the portal...if we can land those guys, our roster will start to fill out nicely (providing we can retain Ian or Drake or both), with room to break the bank on a real stud.

 

[dukeman92]

I got a bad feeling about the Braves this season. I'm not sure exactly why, but it just seems like the roster has been held together with spit and glue for a couple of years now. I don't buy Ozuna as the DH -- I think he careered last season and there might be PEDs involved there. Who knows how Acuna will play when returning from injury, but he'll have to do better than he did last year. Olson is feast or famine, and he's not young. And the pitching staff is -- well, I don't know what to make of it.

Not to derail this topic but I said the same thing BEFORE the season started. The Braves have some nice pieces but they have holes too. Strider and Acuna returning from injury, the reliance on Chris Sale to remain healthy again... and Ozuna to repeat last year isn't likely.

 

[superrific]

The next Bronny James!

Yep, still drunk I see.

This ain't 1975 any more, man. Youth sports is nuts. There are so many good instructional videos out there that any dad who has the time and inclination can be a great skills coach for young kids. I mean, people choose spouses in order to breed athletic superstars. I can think of multiple examples of that (per the parents' own account).

Anyway, if you don't think 6 year olds can play, watch this video:



My son used to do some of those ballhandling drills, but not the one at the 1:00 mark. Check that out. Damn. How many people can do that as adults?

 

[superrific]

Not to derail this topic but I said the same thing BEFORE the season started. The Braves have some nice pieces but they have holes too. Strider and Acuna returning from injury, the reliance on Chris Sale to remain healthy again... and Ozuna to repeat last year isn't likely.

It's the same analysis now. We are agreeing. If I thought the Braves were sure to be good, the start would mean nothing. I'm just worried that it won't hang together this year.

 

[UNCMSinLS]

So, any actual non-premium news floating about? My Braves are off to a horrific 0-fer start and just lost Profar for 80 games and the playoffs (if the Braves make the playoffs anyway). The entire lineup is batting about .150 so far this first week.

I need some positive sports news, dammit. Throw me a bone here. Let me pretend we will land someone good from the portal?

 

[wmheel1287]

What's the deal with the "non-premium" reference? Those fucks at IC ran us off, not the other way around.

 

[hedge]

That's actually a good point...

 

[TarSpiel]

What's the deal with the "non-premium" reference? Those fucks at IC ran us off, not the other way around.

I mean, I sort of agree with you, but at the same time they did have some hard choices to make.

I still think that as a matter of principle it's bad form to take their info and post it here. Rell feeds his family off that stuff.

 

[rodoheel]

FWIW, I really like the names we're targeting right now in the portal...if we can land those guys, our roster will start to fill out nicely (providing we can retain Ian or Drake or both), with room to break the bank on a real stud.

I like the big guy we're supposedly targeting. Not sold on the guard/wing targets being good enough to get us where we need to go.

 

[hedge]

"I mean, I sort of agree with you, but at the same time they did have some hard choices to make.

I still think that as a matter of principle it's bad form to take their info and post it here. Rell feeds his family off that stuff."

 

[Zoo_View]

I mean, I sort of agree with you, but at the same time they did have some hard choices to make.

I still think that as a matter of principle it's bad form to take their info and post it here. Rell feeds his family off that stuff.

I appreciate the work they do.

I find it funny that people pay money to learn minor tidbits about a college sports team……tidbits that the public will know SOON (3-12 hours)…….tidbits worth betting on???? 2-3 minutes, tops.

 

[nycfan]

FWIW, I really like the names we're targeting right now in the portal...if we can land those guys, our roster will start to fill out nicely (providing we can retain Ian or Drake or both), with room to break the bank on a real stud.

 

[SnoopRob]

It was a throwaway comment at the end of recollection about what George Lynch observed watching him practice. The fact that you want to focus on that and call me a liar and a "lazy dumbass" because of it is...well, I dunno.

Yes, he improved, but defenses still disrespected him as a shooter, and so we had to compensate for that in other ways. *That* was the main point. And the main inference in the context of the back-and-forth of the conversation we were having was that if he himself had been better, he wouldn't have needed to call out his teammates like a puerile dickhead.

But you don't seem to have been able to follow that train of thought. Let me know if you need me to spoon feed you more of it.

Oh look, it's the "if he didn't want to be treated poorly, he should have just played better" defense. Speaking of lazy takes...

He was largely good enough from 3 last year that defenses had to account for him. His 3pt shooting wasn't a focal point of the defense, but defenses could no longer just sag off of him. Of course, he could have been better, but his 3pt shooting wasn't in the 20 biggest problems of the team last year.

I certainly followed your train of thought, the problem is that the train is on the wrong track and might as well derail for any usefulness that it has to a good discussion. And please don't feed me information in any style, getting basketball info from you would be like getting political info from Fox News...full of alternative facts and BS and I'd end up worse off for the experience.

 

[SnoopRob]

There's a big gap between "huge three point threat" and "not a liability." Just as there's a big gap in being taken seriously like nobody bothers to get within 5 feet of him, and taken seriously like a guy who you have to D up. Maybe not distort your whole defense but more than staying within a few feet of him.

The game is also so much different today. One reason that KM wasn't shooting so much is that he was throwing to Zeller, Henson and Barnes. And a lot of those catches were traditional back to the basket plays because that was still a viable system back then.

In today's world, lots of teams play no post threats, and nobody plays two post threats on the court at the same time (unless they are also threats from everywhere, in which case they are just really good).

A better measure of three point facility than % on a small sample is the opposing defense's strategies. They know everything we know plus more.

EC is a guy you have to D up, but much more as a driver than an outside shooter. And, yes, there's a big gap between "huge three point threat" and "not a liablity", but the truth is that EC improved enough last season that he went beyond "not a liability" and into "useful outside shooter on a low number of attempts" territory.

No one is stating that EC from 3 put the fear of god into opposing defenses, but he was at least competent enough that defenses could no longer leave him wide open. That was significant improvement and my point was that, if you want to be accurate in a discussion about EC, you have to note that improvement.

 

[SnoopRob]

I think two things are true:

1. EC made a real and significant improvement as a shooter from his first to second year

2. He was still enough of a liability as a shooter that it consistently warped the way teams defended him, and us as a whole, because even with that improvement they were still more than willing to not only go under screens, but often largely disregard him as a perimeter threat

I think your second point is not quite contextually correct. Teams didn't "largely disregard him as a perimeter threat" as much as he was a much larger threat as a driver and so they "chose their poison" to go under screens and risk him shooting a 3 rather than giving him the opportunity to use the screen to get a clear lane to the basket.

I didn't see teams giving him the Alabama treatment last year. Stopping EC from shooting 3s wasn't a focal point of the other team's defensive strategy, but they also weren't ignoring him behind the line, either. He was a competent 3pt shooter on a low number of attempts who defenses focused on not allowing to drive to the basket.