Israel Hamas War | Trump advocates “clean out” all Palestinians; New Constitutional Crisis in Israel

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RaiGuy said:
Yup, and Kushner has been talking with developers to build beachfront resorts in Gaza for months.
This was Israel’s goal from the start. Demolish and depopulate Gaza to build settlements and access the natural gas underneath it. I’ve been saying this from the start that it was never about eliminating Hamas.
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I'd say it was both for Israel and the Trump grift machine. Two birds, one stone.
 
RaiGuy said:
Those people did not affect the outcome nor were they the reason she lost. Even if all of them voted for Harris, she would have still lost.
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Their protests across dozens of college campuses did far more damage than their lost votes. Now they get to reap what they sowed and unfortunately, the Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank will bear the brunt of their foolishness.
 
BlooVooDoo said:
Their protests across dozens of college campuses did far more damage than their lost votes. Now they get to reap what they sowed and unfortunately, the Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank will bear the brunt of their foolishness.
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So they shouldn't have protested because the protests hurt democrats? is that your argument?
 
Calheel said:
So they shouldn't have protested because the protests hurt democrats? is that your argument?
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That is their argument, unfortunately. And why it’s not worth engaging anyone who tut-tuts college protestors. Why blame the Biden admin when you can blame a blue haired college kid?
 
BlooVooDoo said:
Their protests across dozens of college campuses did far more damage than their lost votes. Now they get to reap what they sowed and unfortunately, the Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank will bear the brunt of their foolishness.
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And they will the next time as well. At some point the palestinians are going to have to reject hamas. Don't take my comments to imply that israel is pure in this fight. But the status quo isn't an option and if the palestinians don't want another repeat, they will have to drive change on their side.
 
4thgenheel said:
yup. this is why i was and still am endlessly flabbergasted by the whole uncommitted movement.

things were always, always, always going to go the absolute worst way for palestine with trump in power.
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I don't necessarily disagree, but it was either going to go heavily in the palestinians way or heavily in israel's way. Going back to something similar was never going to be an option.
 
SnoopRob said:
They should have perhaps been more careful in how they protested because the repercussions of their protests harmed their cause far more than the protests helped it.
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I don’t see more strategic protesting happening. I think a far more likely solution is that they disengage completely.
 
Paine said:
That is their argument, unfortunately. And why it’s not worth engaging anyone who tut-tuts college protestors. Why blame the Biden admin when you can blame a blue haired college kid?
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I think it definitely hurt democrats. biden / harris suffered blame through association. As did the kids. I think the blame was directed at the universities who "brainwash the poor naive students" and of course they support biden / harris who were less than vocal in their "efforts" to calm the protests. It gets lumped into the "anti woke" push by conservative voters
 
Calheel said:
You could probably say that about most protests.
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Not necessarily. There is actually well thought out strategies regarding protests and how to best achieve one’s goals by using protest tactics.

The pro-Palestinian protests largely missed their mark due to poor strategy, but that doesn’t make protests a poor choice of action when used well.
 
SnoopRob said:
Not necessarily. There is actually well thought out strategies regarding protests and how to best achieve one’s goals by using protest tactics.

The pro-Palestinian protests largely missed their mark due to poor strategy, but that doesn’t make protests a poor choice of action when used well.
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Movements have strategies. Protests have emotion. The Gaza protests last year were not centrally coordinated and were not really strategic. You could say the same things about the 2020 George Floyd protests, too.

That doesn't mean there aren't organizers out there trying to capture the protest energy and redirect it into a movement. But by and large those organizers aren't calling the shots. It is simply a group zeitgeist (be it Tik Tok driven or not) that causes people to protest. They aren't making strategic political decisions. They are making emotional decisions.
 
Calheel said:
So they shouldn't have protested because the protests hurt democrats? is that your argument?
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Not at all, but what the fuck did they think a handful of college administrators were going to do to stop Israel? And once they started crossing the line from peaceful protests to vandalism and harassment, it was certain to become a campaign issue and most likely contributed to the red sweep. Anyone who genuinely cared about the Palestinians has to realize their situation is far, far worse now than it was when Biden was in office. FAFO.
 
BlooVooDoo said:
Not at all, but what the fuck did they think a handful of college administrators were going to do to stop Israel? And once they started crossing the line from peaceful protests to vandalism and harassment, it was certain to become a campaign issue and most likely contributed to the red sweep. Anyone who genuinely cared about the Palestinians has to realize their situation is far, far worse now than it was when Biden was in office. FAFO.
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Far worse? Less people are dying. Hostages are being released.

I think Trump will eventually be worse but Biden wasn't exactly locking things down by selling the Israelis all those bombs.
 
Callatoroy said:
I think it definitely hurt democrats. biden / harris suffered blame through association. As did the kids. I think the blame was directed at the universities who "brainwash the poor naive students" and of course they support biden / harris who were less than vocal in their "efforts" to calm the protests. It gets lumped into the "anti woke" push by conservative voters
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The administration’s Gaza policy hurt them much more, IMO.
 
BlooVooDoo said:
Not at all, but what the fuck did they think a handful of college administrators were going to do to stop Israel? And once they started crossing the line from peaceful protests to vandalism and harassment, it was certain to become a campaign issue and most likely contributed to the red sweep. Anyone who genuinely cared about the Palestinians has to realize their situation is far, far worse now than it was when Biden was in office. FAFO.
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I think Calheel is hitting the nail on the head. The protests were an expression of rage in the face of an administration that claimed to be of the left but continued killing children.

It reflects the dismal state of left politics in this country more than anything. There wasn’t any organizing principle behind the protests. See also: Occupy.
 
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