Many Americans Say the Democratic Party Does Not Share Their Priorities

[Calheel]

Nobody on here said it wasn’t an effective ad or an effective line of attack. What we are saying is that it is the *Republican Party* who is bizarrely obsessed with transgender people, not the Democratic Party. Look at the couple of Trump voter posters we have here- it’s quite literally all a couple of them talk about.

And anyway once that ad came out, what on earth was Kamala supposed to say? “Actually no we don’t support sex change surgeries on prison inmates, oh and by the way it was actually under the Trump administration where this policy was put in place”? Yeah, I’m sure so many of the people who would believe the Trump ad would also believe the Kamala rebuttal.

Republicans win on the transgender issue because there’s literally no effective defense that can be mounted by the Democrats other than stone cold silence on it. But stone cold silence on the issue causes the Democrats to be in between a rock and a hard place; they either lose the election because they lose moderates, or they lose the election because they lose progressives AND don’t actually sway any moderate voters anyway.

Yeah, that's exactly what she should have said. In politics, flip-flopping is no longer an issue -- JD Vance proved that. Just say loudly that you don't support government funded sex change operations.

In general, I thought Kamala's biggest liability was being part of the administration. I really wanted Andy Beshear to run. But Biden made sure that wouldn't happen with whatever backroom deal he cut with Kamala. And apparently, Kamala thought that meant that she couldn't put any daylight between herself and Joe on just about any issue. In the end, I think it would have been very tough for any Democrat to convince the male Latino voters in PA, AZ and NV and the male Arab voters in MI that Democrats weren't responsible for inflation/Gaza, but Kamala's campaign strategy made that basically impossible. And not playing defense on the trans issue didn't help. You can't campaign scared.

 

[Centerpiece]

I do. Remember the election isn’t decided by what the majority of Trump voters want but what the majority of low-information swing voters want.

And for them, it is almost always the economy.

It’s always gonna be about the economy.
With that in mind, let’s see what the economy looks like in 2026 around the midterms… we shall see how the low-info swing voters feel then.
I think Elon’s stated goal was to tear down the country completely - including and most assuredly the economy. Let’s see who Joe Blow Low Info votes for then.

 

[lawtig02]

Kamala didn't respond because she didn't want to talk about that issue, which makes sense. I'm no political operative. I don't know whether "ignoring it was the worst strategy." I don't know that anyone knows that.

I just fail to see how Kamala disavowing that would have reached the low-info voters you say decided the election. And since the GOP campaign was truth-free, it's not as if anyone would accept the disavowal any way. And yeah, Kamala was struggling with the left because of Gaza, so she decided the best course of action was to refocus attention on where everyone agrees. It didn't work, because "threat to democracy" didn't resonate and the XX strategy playing on abortion rights turned out to be a dud.

If it were me, I would not have put so many eggs in the "women will vote for us because abortion" as that theory has never proven true. I said as much at the time. It's just not the most important issue for lots of women. But again, I'm no political operative, and it's easy as fuck to sit here on a message board and say, "they should do X, they should do Y"

In hindsight, I think it’s pretty obvious she should have responded. I’d have suggested an ad with Kamala saying something like this —

I’m sure you’ve seen my opponent’s ad saying that I want to use taxpayer money to fund sex change operations for prisoners. My opponent is a liar. And a hypocrite. He’s a liar because what I ACTUALLY want is to show respect to all Americans, and to follow the law. He’s a hypocrite because it was his own administration that said the law requires providing gender affirming care to inmates. I hope you’ll vote for me because I care about all of you, not just billionaires and cop beaters. And because unlike my opponent, I’ll tell you the truth.

 

[CFordUNC]

Yeah, that's exactly what she should have said. In politics, flip-flopping is no longer an issue -- JD Vance proved that. Just say loudly that you don't support government funded sex change operations.

In general, I thought Kamala's biggest liability was being part of the administration. I really wanted Andy Beshear to run. But Biden made sure that wouldn't happen with whatever backroom deal he cut with Kamala. And apparently, Kamala thought that meant that she couldn't put any daylight between herself and Joe on just about any issue. In the end, I think it would have been very tough for any Democrat to convince the male Latino voters in PA, AZ and NV and the male Arab voters in MI that Democrats weren't responsible for inflation/Gaza, but Kamala's campaign strategy made that basically impossible. And not playing defense on the trans issue didn't help. You can't campaign scared.

I hear you. And my contention remains that attempting to play defense on the transgender issue would have had zero impact on the outcome of the election (but that’s not to say she shouldn’t have tried, I suppose)

 

[TullyHeel]

None of this should be more important than a person using common sense and saying someone like Trump shouldn't be President unless they are okay with a fascist country for only straight white Christian nationalists.

 

[Zoo_View]

This fellow HY12 is a poster child for the decline of the University of North Carolina. It used to be a world class institution, until the GA started packing it with DEI applicants from rural areas.

There's this perception out there that somehow he can do better, but I'm just not sure that's true. None of these assclowns can keep more than one idea in their head at once, and so all rationality goes out the window as soon as someone shows them something they don't like.

No.

He’s a poster child for why college undergraduates should not be able to major in business, engineering, and similar majors while foregoing a Liberal Arts education.

HY2012 is highly credential and limited in education.

 

[superrific]

Ironically I first heard the "stop digging " phrase when John Kerry used it against W in the 2004 campaign. You're the poster child for the frantic "sky is falling" partisan. The country is literally burning?? Seriously? Maybe part of a county in LA..
I'm done with you.

I used literally in the colloquial sense of "obviously and indisputably." That's not the actual meaning of the word, and it's a usage that I normally disfavor. So I'll take that back.

I'm really not a "sky is falling" partisan. I'm the guy who says the future is unknowable. But the present is not, and there's no way to defend what is happening and you're not even trying. Trump has made enemies of our allies. He's trying to take the Canal and Greenland as part of an imperialist vanity project. It's a month in, and he's threatened war with our NATO allies. Elon Musk is fucking around with the federal payments system, in clear violation of the law. They've got OPM. They are trying to disband a government agency, which they are not permitted to do. The worst people possible are being appointed to lead agencies.

The IRS is broken. Federal disbursements are in limbo. Trump appears to be angling for a constitutional crisis. He's releasing water into farms thinking that he's doing something about fires. The Transportation secretary is saying that the plane/copter crash was because people are trying to replace the word cockpit with flight deck. Tiktok is still here despite a federal law to the contrary. Trump is pardoning anyone he thinks is on his side, and accepting bribes.

In what way is this something other than "the sky is falling." What will it take for you to admit you've been fucking up for the past 10 years as a MAGA? Will thermonuclear war do it? What about mass detention camps? I'm trying to figure out what your standard for "not that bad" could possibly be.

 

[Zoo_View]

"The opinion of 10,000 men
is of no value if none of
them knows anything
about the subject."


- Marcus Aurelius

Unfortunately, in modern America (and Europe), he’s WRONG.

 

[superrific]

I should add that ignoring me does not make the Trump stench go away. It's standard MAGA to lash out at the messenger instead of taking responsibility for their own actions.

 

[Zoo_View]

Yeah, that's exactly what she should have said. In politics, flip-flopping is no longer an issue -- JD Vance proved that. Just say loudly that you don't support government funded sex change operations.

In general, I thought Kamala's biggest liability was being part of the administration. I really wanted Andy Beshear to run. But Biden made sure that wouldn't happen with whatever backroom deal he cut with Kamala. And apparently, Kamala thought that meant that she couldn't put any daylight between herself and Joe on just about any issue. In the end, I think it would have been very tough for any Democrat to convince the male Latino voters in PA, AZ and NV and the male Arab voters in MI that Democrats weren't responsible for inflation/Gaza, but Kamala's campaign strategy made that basically impossible. And not playing defense on the trans issue didn't help. You can't campaign scared.

You seriously think some backroom deal was cut between Biden and Harris? And it didn’t leak?

Really?

 

[superrific]

You seriously think some backroom deal was cut between Biden and Harris? And it didn’t leak?

Really?

Kamala got the nod because she was the only candidate who everyone could rally around in a short period of time, and the only one who would have access to the cash. If you go with "she's the VP, she should replace him" then we could move on with the campaign. Once you open it up to other candidates, floodgates.

 

[Calheel]

I don't know if we are talking about the same things. I'm not only talking about the 2024 election, but even there I don't think you're right.

There's no reason that the MAGA idiots had to back Trump. They could have stayed at home like a lot of Dem constituencies. Instead they ran to the polls with glee to smear their poop around the whole world.

Or to put it differently: if 5% of the MAGAs had any fucking common sense at all, Trump would have lost.

I was watching the new PBS documentary on the 1898 Wilmington Coup -- the one in which our very own William Rand Kenan, Sr. played a key role with his machine gun mowing down black people on the streets of Wilmington.

The mentality of the white supremacists in Wilmington, who used force to intimidate black voters from registering in 1898 and then used force to kick the "fusionists" out of office in Wilmington a few days later, remains a central part of Southern and NC politics. There are so many parallels between what happened in 1898 and what is even happening today with the NC Supreme Court election and gerrymandering. The MAGA mentality, which is the heir to the Jim Crow mentality, believes that the country can only function when ruled by white Christians. So, it has very little to do with common sense for those people, but racial superiority.

That said, the MAGA crowd is not what decides elections. Those people aren't a majority of the electorate. It is the low information voters of every race and creed that decide elections. And if the economy is poop for the next four years, they will come racing back to the Democrats in 2026-2028, no matter what image problem HeelYeah and the NY Times think Democrats have.

 

[Calheel]

Kamala got the nod because she was the only candidate who everyone could rally around in a short period of time, and the only one who would have access to the cash. If you go with "she's the VP, she should replace him" then we could move on with the campaign. Once you open it up to other candidates, floodgates.

Anyone could have had the cash. Was Biden going to prosecute for FEC violations?

 

[Calheel]

You seriously think some backroom deal was cut between Biden and Harris? And it didn’t leak?

Really?

I don't mean something written in blood. I mean a conversation and agreement.

There is no way Biden endorses Kamala right away without an understanding of how she intended to run her campaign if he stepped aside. That endorsement gave Kamala the nomination (over Nancy's and Obama's objection). And it came basically 24 hours after he stepped aside. I am sure there were talks between the two.

 

[superrific]

I was watching the new PBS documentary on the 1898 Wilmington Coup -- the one in which our very own William Rand Kenan, Sr. played a key role with his machine gun mowing down black people on the streets of Wilmington.

The mentality of the white supremacists in Wilmington, who used force to intimidate black voters from registering in 1898 and then used force to kick the "fusionists" out of office in Wilmington a few days later, remains a central part of Southern and NC politics. There are so many parallels between what happened in 1898 and what is even happening today with the NC Supreme Court election and gerrymandering. The MAGA mentality, which is the heir to the Jim Crow mentality, believes that the country can only function when ruled by white Christians. So, it has very little to do with common sense for those people, but racial superiority.

That said, the MAGA crowd is not what decides elections. Those people aren't a majority of the electorate. It is the low information voters of every race and creed that decide elections. And if the economy is poop for the next four years, they will come racing back to the Democrats in 2026-2028, no matter what image problem HeelYeah and the NY Times think Democrats have.

You know I agree with most of this, most especially about how it's a question of racial superiority. That's not inconsistent with lamenting the lack of common sense, but I get your point. I just don't want us to start letting MAGA off the hook, which is one possible outcome (down the road) of this way of thinking.

 

[superrific]

Anyone could have had the cash. Was Biden going to prosecute for FEC violations?

No, but it's harder to run against the convicted felon if you're doing felonies. And if the Dem candidate lost, prosecutions could be possible. You know this.

I think you're making a decent point but stretching a little bit in application. Obviously Biden had some input but I don't think there were any other realistic options. And if we're positing that breaking the law would be OK, what would stop Kamala from just reneging on any promise to Biden.

I think Biden wanted, more than anything, to beat Trump. Like a lot of old people, it was hard for him to accept that he wasn't the guy to do that, especially given that there were objectively valid reasons to stay with the incumbent if possible. I doubt he tried to hamstring her campaign in any way.

 

[Calheel]

No, but it's harder to run against the convicted felon if you're doing felonies. And if the Dem candidate lost, prosecutions could be possible. You know this.

I think you're making a decent point but stretching a little bit in application. Obviously Biden had some input but I don't think there were any other realistic options. And if we're positing that breaking the law would be OK, what would stop Kamala from just reneging on any promise to Biden.

I think Biden wanted, more than anything, to beat Trump. Like a lot of old people, it was hard for him to accept that he wasn't the guy to do that, especially given that there were objectively valid reasons to stay with the incumbent if possible. I doubt he tried to hamstring her campaign in any way.

At the time, the scuttlebutt was that Nancy and Barack wanted an open primary process and were very concerned about Kamala. It is possible that Biden supported Kamala as a final FU to them. But I also believe there was a discussion between the two.

I am sure books will be written about the campaign in the next year and maybe we will get the true scoop then.

 

[Mulberry Heel]

I suspect that when the full economic costs of his insane policies hits the middle class full-force in a few months that all we'll hear from the usual suspects will be "well, I might have voted Democratic if only they had given me a choice. But they didn't and so I had to vote for Trump. So I'm not really to blame for any of this, it's really on the Democrats for not giving me an alternative!" I suspect that's how this is going to go.

 

[tallheel95]

At the time, the scuttlebutt was that Nancy and Barack wanted an open primary process and were very concerned about Kamala. It is possible that Biden supported Kamala as a final FU to them. But I also believe there was a discussion between the two.

I am sure books will be written about the campaign in the next year and maybe we will get the true scoop then.

I always figured that Biden did not want to alienate the people that brought him into office, eg Clyburn and the black (particularly female) vote. It seemed like a bit of a no-win situation. How do you NOT push forward Kamala, the acting Vice President, without insinuating she wasn’t up to the job of President? And then what does that say about either a) not supporting the black electorate or b) her being a “DEI hire?” The optics would have been pretty terrible. Basically I’m still pissed that Biden’s ego got in the way of a regular primary. I doubt he’ll ever admit to himself the colossal mistake he made. I generally like the guy but he has some significant blind spots.

 

[HeelYeah2012]

She needed to respond. Ignoring it was the worst strategy. And HY may be right that the reason Kamala didn’t respond is because she didn’t want to ruffle any feathers on the left.

Yep - the big question everyone needs to be asking, since we know that ad was the most effective ad of the political cycle on the margins among swing voters, is this: “Why did the Democrats let that ad sink them? And why would it ruffle so many feathers on the left to denounce it?”