Mass Deportation and Immigration Catch-All | CIA using drones to spy on Mexican drug cartels

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ZenMode said:
There seems to be confusion here. Your response sounds like you believe I want to get rid of birthright citizenship completely. I definitely don't.

While I realize that the drafters of the 14th amendment discussed and debated most every aspect that they could, it's just not possible for them to be able to see into the future. They don't know what they don't know. There are just simply things that they could not have foreseen. For example, the ease with which we are able to travel from continent to continent. If it took weeks or months to get here, there would be no concern about pregnant women coming here to give birth. It would be too time consuming and probably too dangerous. They probably also couldn't have foreseen our current relationship with Mexico, Central and South America which compels pregnant women to risk their lives to get a few hundred yards into the US to have a child in the middle of the desert.
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1. There's no half way position. Birthright citizenship is all or nothing. If it's a half-measure, then it's not birthright.
2. Plenty of women came to the US and gave birth right when they got here. It wasn't particularly unusual.
3. The point that you seem to be unable to understand, and I will try to make this simple for you, is THEY DIDN'T CARE. This hysteria about "oh, no, women are coming here to give birth" did not bother them AT ALL because they understood that more Americans = a stronger America.
4. Do you really think pregnant women are walking into the desert to give birth? REALLY? How does that work? Woman shows up at a ranger station with a newborn and says, "I just gave birth to this child at this longitude/latitude so can I have a birth certificate please"?
 
Badbehavior1015 said:
Great, but thats not what was expected by many, including many right here on this board. There are some on this board that said Trump and Homon were going to start deporting anyone they could find. That is not what is happening. Deporting extremely violent illegal immigrants was the point of the raids and will continue to be their targets.

If some around here had their way, those immigrants would still be on the loose, committing crime after crime. Just more scare tactics in an attempt to paralyze them with fear. And to knowingly participate in this type of rhetoric is disturbing and intellectually dishonest.

That's a lie and their actions so far prove it. Stop being a chicken little. Regardless of how horrible you think the US is, the line to get in gets longer and the line to leave doesn't exist.

Thats all a lie but carry on with the scare tactics. It was not ICE, you buffoon. The crow is ready for your consumption. Yall want something horrible to happen SOOOOO bad so yall can scream at the top of your lungs how awful Trump and his administration is.
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1. They are deporting anyone they find. Did you read about the Newark raid?
2. It's been six days. It's pretty sad that you're so fucking insecure about your guy that you feel the need to somehow "debunk" something after 6 fucking days. I get that Trump has already broken pretty much the whole government, but that doesn't mean he's finished.
 
Badbehavior1015 said:
Great, but thats not what was expected by many, including many right here on this board. There are some on this board that said Trump and Homon were going to start deporting anyone they could find. That is not what is happening. Deporting extremely violent illegal immigrants was the point of the raids and will continue to be their targets.

If some around here had their way, those immigrants would still be on the loose, committing crime after crime. Just more scare tactics in an attempt to paralyze them with fear. And to knowingly participate in this type of rhetoric is disturbing and intellectually dishonest.

That's a lie and their actions so far prove it. Stop being a chicken little. Regardless of how horrible you think the US is, the line to get in gets longer and the line to leave doesn't exist.

Thats all a lie but carry on with the scare tactics. It was not ICE, you buffoon. The crow is ready for your consumption. Yall want something horrible to happen SOOOOO bad so yall can scream at the top of your lungs how awful Trump and his administration is.
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Lol. The entire world could be frozen in time this moment and libraries could be filled with the awful things Trump and his minions have done.
 
nycfan said:


DHS? Federalized local LEO? Vigilantes? Liberal False flag?
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Be kind of funny if the whole Post stor
Badbehavior1015 said:
Great, but thats not what was expected by many, including many right here on this board. There are some on this board that said Trump and Homon were going to start deporting anyone they could find. That is not what is happening. Deporting extremely violent illegal immigrants was the point of the raids and will continue to be their targets.

If some around here had their way, those immigrants would still be on the loose, committing crime after crime. Just more scare tactics in an attempt to paralyze them with fear. And to knowingly participate in this type of rhetoric is disturbing and intellectually dishonest.

That's a lie and their actions so far prove it. Stop being a chicken little. Regardless of how horrible you think the US is, the line to get in gets longer and the line to leave doesn't exist.

Thats all a lie but carry on with the scare tactics. It was not ICE, you buffoon. The crow is ready for your consumption. Yall want something horrible to happen SOOOOO bad so yall can scream at the top of your lungs how awful Trump and his administration is.
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steve carrell anchorman GIF by FirstAndMonday
 
superrific said:
1. There's no half way position. Birthright citizenship is all or nothing. If it's a half-measure, then it's not birthright.
2. Plenty of women came to the US and gave birth right when they got here. It wasn't particularly unusual.
3. The point that you seem to be unable to understand, and I will try to make this simple for you, is THEY DIDN'T CARE. This hysteria about "oh, no, women are coming here to give birth" did not bother them AT ALL because they understood that more Americans = a stronger America.
4. Do you really think pregnant women are walking into the desert to give birth? REALLY? How does that work? Woman shows up at a ranger station with a newborn and says, "I just gave birth to this child at this longitude/latitude so can I have a birth certificate please"?
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3. They didn't care then, just as we handed out citizenship to anyone who reached out shores, so it didn't matter of they gave birth. The people giving birth were immigrating here, and already getting citizenship, not just vacationing.

We also had a population of less than 40 million.
 
Turd Ferguson said:
The problem is Trump and MAGA make it out like every immigrant is like this, when they only make up a small fraction of the crimes committed here. It's playing on irrational fear and racism.
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"That's a lie and their actions so far prove it. Stop being a chicken little. Regardless of how horrible you think the US is, the line to get in gets longer and the line to leave doesn't exist." -@Badbehavior1015

Well, actually, it's a not a lie.

nij.ojp.gov

Undocumented Immigrant Offending Rate Lower Than U.S.-Born Citizen Rate

An NIJ-funded study examining data from the Texas Department of Public Safety estimated the rate at which undocumented immigrants are arrested for committing crimes. The study found that undocumented immigrants are arrested at less than half the rate of native-born U.S. citizens for violent and...
nij.ojp.gov nij.ojp.gov
 
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ZenMode said:
3. They didn't care then, just as we handed out citizenship to anyone who reached out shores, so it didn't matter of they gave birth. The people giving birth were immigrating here, and already getting citizenship,
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That's right. So why did you write this:

"It's just not possible for them to be able to see into the future. They don't know what they don't know. There are just simply things that they could not have foreseen."

The 14th Amendment was an intentional choice to confer citizenship upon everyone who was born here, other than diplomats. If you don't like that choice, then you're free to advocate for changing the amendment. Personally, I think there are many, many changes to the constitution that are of much higher priority. If you want to focus on weird hypotheticals of pregnant women wandering the desert, go ahead. It's your right, just as it's my right to draw the conclusions that inevitably follow.
 
ZenMode said:
3. They didn't care then, just as we handed out citizenship to anyone who reached out shores, so it didn't matter of they gave birth. The people giving birth were immigrating here, and already getting citizenship, not just vacationing.

We also had a population of less than 40 million.
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Yeah, what Super said.

You are simply arguing for a constitutional amendment. If you think birther tourism is a huge issue (and a better example is probably Chinese nationals taking birth vacations in Hacienda Heights, CA) then advocate for an amendment.

But you can't just rewrite the express language of the 14th amendment because the world has changed - especially when you aren't dealing with a nebulous concept like "due process" or "cruel and unusual punishment." Birthright citizenship is a very black and white issue. You can't rewrite it via Executive Order.
 
Bobfripp said:
"That's a lie and their actions so far prove it. Stop being a chicken little. Regardless of how horrible you think the US is, the line to get in gets longer and the line to leave doesn't exist." -@Badbehavior1015

Well, actually, it's a not a lie.

nij.ojp.gov

Undocumented Immigrant Offending Rate Lower Than U.S.-Born Citizen Rate

An NIJ-funded study examining data from the Texas Department of Public Safety estimated the rate at which undocumented immigrants are arrested for committing crimes. The study found that undocumented immigrants are arrested at less than half the rate of native-born U.S. citizens for violent and...
nij.ojp.gov nij.ojp.gov
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Well, yes it is. This article was written 5 months ago, well before Trump and Homon took over.

Buffoons gonna keep buffooning.
 
ZenMode said:
3. They didn't care then, just as we handed out citizenship to anyone who reached out shores, so it didn't matter of they gave birth. The people giving birth were immigrating here, and already getting citizenship, not just vacationing.

We also had a population of less than 40 million.
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And? We're scarcely overcrowded now.
 
superrific said:
That's right. So why did you write this:

"It's just not possible for them to be able to see into the future. They don't know what they don't know. There are just simply things that they could not have foreseen."

The 14th Amendment was an intentional choice to confer citizenship upon everyone who was born here, other than diplomats. If you don't like that choice, then you're free to advocate for changing the amendment. Personally, I think there are many, many changes to the constitution that are of much higher priority. If you want to focus on weird hypotheticals of pregnant women wandering the desert, go ahead. It's your right, just as it's my right to draw the conclusions that inevitably follow.
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By saying "They don't know what they don't know" means they couldn't have foreseen the changes in our ability to travel via airplane, making birth tourism possible.

What I hope, a think, will eventually happen is there there will be a debate about the spirit of the 14th Amendment. It seems to me that BRC was intended for those who desired to migrate here permanently, not fly here for "vacation", waddle across the border at the 11th hour just to have a kid or were temporarily living here for work (diplomats).

That debate will surely include a reconsidering of what "under jurisdiction of" means.
 
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Eliminating birthright citizenship aims to take away what is attracting immigrants to the US, but it's really not addressing. MAGA likes this because they want to punish the immigrant (and not affect the white man). Thing is the real magnet is jobs. The enforcement on the persons hiring illegals is lax as heck, but that's an inconvenient action for the MAGA crowd.
 
ZenMode said:
By saying "They don't know what they don't know" means they could have foreseen the changes in our ability to travel via airplane, making birth tourism possible.

What I hope, a think, will eventually happen is there there will be a debate about the spirit of the 14th Amendment. It seems to me that BRC was intended for those who desired to migrate here permanently, not fly here for "vacation", waddle across the border at the 11th hour just to have a kid or were temporarily living here for work (diplomats).

That debate will surely include a reconsidering of what "under jurisdiction of" means.
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If immigrants, documented or not, aren't under the jurisdiction of the United States, how come we can charge them with Federal crimes?
 
StrangePackage said:
If immigrants, documented or not, aren't under the jurisdiction of the United States, how come we can charge them with Federal crimes?
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In addition to the fact that the language of the 14th is not even remotely ambiguous, that’s a big reason SCOTUS settled this issue definitively 127 years ago. No idea why people like Zen are still determined to argue it.
 
ZenMode said:
By saying "They don't know what they don't know" means they could have foreseen the changes in our ability to travel via airplane, making birth tourism possible.

What I hope, a think, will eventually happen is there there will be a debate about the spirit of the 14th Amendment. It seems to me that BRC was intended for those who desired to migrate here permanently, not fly here for "vacation", waddle across the border at the 11th hour just to have a kid or were temporarily living here for work (diplomats).

That debate will surely include a reconsidering of what "under jurisdiction of" means.
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I'll ask this again. Do you believe this debate about the "spirit" of the Amendment should happen with the entire Constitution?
 
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