Trump Addresses The Nation

Callatoroy said:
You are getting side tracked into a single issue of individual journalists or network vs another. Ask yourself why you felt compelled to make the comment about Fox because I have offered no defense of fox and have characterized it as no better. It seemingly was a reflexive and defensive comment rooted in a "team" mentality. My comments are intended to talk about news media as a whole. I even stated that. I have no desire to debate those two vs any other individuals. Do you not think it messed up that we have news sources that cater to the left and right? Shouldn't news be fact based and politically neutral? If it does cater one way or another, don't you think that news presentation is manipulated to appeal to one side or the other? How do they manipulate it, and thus the population? Do you not believe that plays a huge part in creating division? The media has not only been able to create a "team" environment of democrat vs. republican, but has also has us arguing in a "team" manner about the sources of news. That is extremely harmful to the country, but very profitable for the media. Also, please don't take any of that personally as I'm not trying to criticize you in any way. I was the biggest "team" homer of them all and it would be very hypocritical of me to not acknowledge how I played in that arena.
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no worries...

I did not take your posts personally. I was only taking issue with your contention that liberal political opinion shows addressing the political events of the day are just the same as conservative political opinion shows.

I'm old enough to remember when Walter Cronkite, Chet Huntley and David Brinkley reported the factually based politically neutral news. That was a time when there was consensus in America what was factual reality.

Unfortunately, I also remember even back then that many conservatives whined that those factually based politically neutral news shows were too liberal and biased.

It was a case of the facts having a liberal bias back then just as it is today.

I appreciate the discussion, and I appreciate you sticking with the board to offer a thoughtful conservative perspective.
 
Callatoroy said:
I wasn't aware I gave an indictment of msnbc.
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C

Politics Post in thread 'Trump Addresses The Nation'

heelinhell said:
I watch Nicole Wallace and Chris Hayes every night. Not once have I seen them being factually misleading or peddling false narratives so I have to respectfully call you out.
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Nicolle Wallace
  • Apology for Inaccurate Statement: In August 2019, Wallace issued an apology for mistakenly stating on her show that President Donald Trump was "talking about exterminating Latinos." She corrected her statement, clarifying it was an unintentional error, but maintained that Trump's language regarding immigration was intentional and constant.
  • Russiagate Coverage: Media critics...
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Callatoroy said:
OK, your questions provide some nuance. No policy is likely to be a slam dunk with no downside. I would be interested in where you disagree with my views and why.

Immigration: This will give you some idea of my general opinions on immigration. Obviously it is very general and doesn't address all immigration variables.

1. I 100% support closing the border, full stop. I believe to my core that we are not a nation without borders and I believe most of the countries in the world believe that too. Just look how restrictive other country's immigration requirements are compared to the US (in general)

2. I fully support deportation for any and all illegal aliens. Whether that means self deportation or assisted deportation, I'm against any immigration that doesn't follow the laws of the country and doesn't allow for vetting who comes in.

3. Where I fault and disagree with trump and his posse is in the execution of the deportations. I believe (in general) most of them could be done in a humane way and with a degree of compassion. However, I question the media's portrayal of the deportations as I believe there are far more circumstances and context to what is happening than what the media is providing (remember it was reported the border patrol agents were whipping people crossing the river when in fact they weren't). That doesn't mean that I believe there is no abuse taking place hence my comment about being done in a humane way.

4. Every person coming in has to be vetted. We need skilled and unskilled labor. Maybe we do it now, but some type of analysis needs to be done yearly that identifies the quantity and type of migrant labor needed. Employers who violate or try to circumvent OSHA laws or any type of employment laws, or any laws designed to prevent exploitation should face severe penalties.

5. I don't believe non citizens should receive any type of g'ment benefits that require citizenship or green card type status. Citizenship matters.

6. I believe our immigration laws are broken and need to be modernized. The path to citizenship should be made to take less time and should cost significantly less to obtain. I believe very strongly citizenship should be merit based and require some degree of assimilation, including the ability to speak english. I also believe there needs to be stronger penalties in place for people who violate the immigration laws. In other words, strong enough to deter repeat offenders. I have friends with job skills that have been trying to obtain citizenship for 8 yrs and have paid out thousands in legal fees. As such, I'm very much opposed to those who came illegally gaining any type of preference or advantage over them if they are here illegally.

7. I don't believe in trump's manner of changing birthright citizenship. I do think it needs to change but done so according to the law. The SC's ruling on the constitutionality of trump's EO will be interesting.
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I appreciate your thoughtful response. We agree that non-citizens should not receive the same benefits as citizens and legal residents, and I believe that is largely the case now.

We also agree that reformation of the path to citizenship and vetting of people coming into our country is needed.

Where we disagree is on the term open borders, which is an invented term by conservative media. I have never heard a politician, no matter how progressive, ever advocating for open borders.

We also disagree that Republicans are the party enforcing deportations. I've seen data that shows that both Biden and Obama deported at the same rate as Trump, just without the cruelty and promotion.

I have been extremely troubled by the start of this administration. Unfortunately, it was entirely predictable. I just hope we'll have free and fair elections moving forward.
 
bridgetender said:
I appreciate your thoughtful response. We agree that non-citizens should not receive the same benefits as citizens and legal residents, and I believe that is largely the case now.

We also agree that reformation of the path to citizenship and vetting of people coming into our country is needed.

Where we disagree is on the term open borders, which is an invented term by conservative media. I have never heard a politician, no matter how progressive, ever advocating for open borders.

We also disagree that Republicans are the party enforcing deportations. I've seen data that shows that both Biden and Obama deported at the same rate as Trump, just without the cruelty and promotion.

I have been extremely troubled by the start of this administration. Unfortunately, it was entirely predictable. I just hope we'll have free and fair elections moving forward.
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Other than some very basic restriction, we had open borders for the first 110 years. This doesn't mean I want to go back to then but the history of our immigration laws are mostly loathsome and racist so there's nothing ,imo, that's not worth reconsidering. I'd even include some limited asylum for felons until such time as they are proven felons by our laws. There are several other things to consider. I feel like we'd need some seriously mitigating circumstances to admit someone unsponsored and unlikely to be able to support themselves.
 
bridgetender said:
I appreciate your thoughtful response. We agree that non-citizens should not receive the same benefits as citizens and legal residents, and I believe that is largely the case now.

We also agree that reformation of the path to citizenship and vetting of people coming into our country is needed.

Where we disagree is on the term open borders, which is an invented term by conservative media. I have never heard a politician, no matter how progressive, ever advocating for open borders.

We also disagree that Republicans are the party enforcing deportations. I've seen data that shows that both Biden and Obama deported at the same rate as Trump, just without the cruelty and promotion.

I have been extremely troubled by the start of this administration. Unfortunately, it was entirely predictable. I just hope we'll have free and fair elections moving forward.
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It isn’t just deportations that matter. If you allow millions to come in you can deport a lot and still be going backwards. Deportations alone don’t tell the whole story
 
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