Walz — Comer Opens Congressional Investigation of Walz trips to China

duluoz said:
It should be Shapiro. Every battleground state vote matters, and Shapiro pretty clearly does more for that calculus than Walz, IMO.

I have reservations about Shapiro hemorrhaging some votes (especially in MI) around his staunch pro-Israel/anti-protestor stance, but I'm convinced the benefits would outweigh the drawbacks. Any boost in PA would make a difference, and he's likely to deliver at least some boost. Plus, his stance is not as troubling as I'd first thought -- he supports a two-state solution and recognizes that Netanyahu needs to go. That will come to light and mitigate that sentiment.

Beyond that, he's younger and more vibrant, and a better speaker than Walz. The younger voters are so invigorated right now, and they are THE key demographic in this election, and the most persuadable. Relatively speaking, Shapiro keeps that ball rolling. Walz looks like just another white-haired white guy to them, and we all know that these kinds of optics matter way more than we'd prefer. That would slow or neutralize at least some of the current momentum among those voters.
Click to expand...
I actually think your 2nd paragraph contradicts your 3rd. My concern with shapiro is that his actual policy stance on Israel suppresses the youth vote

eta: I am fine with either, just think shapiro has a higher ceiling and lower floor and am playing devils advocate
 
CFordUNC said:
Yep. According to 538, over the last five 8 presidential elections, the VP pick has added on average 1.7% to the ticket in their home state.
Click to expand...
Can you link that for me? I read that piece, but went looking for it and oddly couldn't find it. I wanted to revisit the basis for that finding.
 


Highly recommend this read. It's not behind the Bulwark's paywall and I think that it should hopefully quell concern that folks have about a possible selection of Shapiro.

"For days there has been chatter on the progressive interwebs about how Josh Shapiro would “divide” the party. Extremely online politicos upset about his views on Israel or school vouchers or his Kosher Obama speaking style have asserted this dispositively. Deep inside the politics internet there has been a spate of retrospective complaints about how bad a “blitz primary” would have been as evinced by the aggressive and deranged online discourse that has supposedly tainted the purity of the “veepstakes.”

If you are involved in these online meme wars, I grant that it might feel as if things are very contentious. You might see yourself as being on one side of a battle that must be won, and that your activism is the tip of the spear that represents a broader coalition behind you out in the world. For example, if you are involved in progressive or anti-Zionist online activism it might seem as if everyone hates Josh and game theory requires him to be passed over. If you fancy yourself a political polling and data nerd, you might have come to the conclusion that anyone except for Josh would be idiocy. If you are a regular resistance activist your feed is exploding with Hot Walz content.

Even the unifying, thoughtful Bulwark Redditors have exploded in a #war between the Walz-pilled and the Shapiro-stans.

Here’s the problem with all of this.

This “war” that is purportedly happening within the party over the VP selection is all an illusion. It is taking place in a hermetically sealed bubble among political hobbyists who have extremely strong feelings about the ideological trajectory of the Democratic party . . . and nobody else. They are a fraction of a fraction of the party.

Rank-and-file Democrats are unburdened by the veepstakes discourse. They only have surface-level knowledge about the main contenders, according to polls. And the Democrats who live in each contender’s respective states overwhelmingly love their hometown boys.

The one supposedly “divisive” name being discussed, Shapiro, is viewed favorably by 90 percent of Pennsylvania Democrats. I guess the Keystone State progressives didn’t get the internet’s memo.

The reality is: Concerns about whether one of these DEI whites will salt the vibes are based on Twitter-brain alone."

Here is the link to the longer article: The Democrats Will Unite Behind Any VP Choice
 
superrific said:
Can you link that for me? I read that piece, but went looking for it and oddly couldn't find it. I wanted to revisit the basis for that finding.
Click to expand...
Shoot, now I'm having trouble finding it. I could have sworn that Josh Marshall linked it on Twitter over the weekend but I can't see it on his Twitter feed now. I'll keep looking!
 
lawtig02 said:
Shapiro is the high school teacher/college professor every Gen Zer wanted. Walz is the dad every Gen Zer wanted. Not sure which drives more votes.
Click to expand...
In my mind and from the GenZ'ers I talk to, they'll take the college prof 10 times out of 10. The excitement around Biden stepping down isn't just because they thought he specifically was too old to lead the country... it is because they are tired of old white guys running things, period.
 
CFordUNC said:


Highly recommend this read. It's not behind the Bulwark's paywall and I think that it should hopefully quell concern that folks have about a possible selection of Shapiro.

"For days there has been chatter on the progressive interwebs about how Josh Shapiro would “divide” the party. Extremely online politicos upset about his views on Israel or school vouchers or his Kosher Obama speaking style have asserted this dispositively. Deep inside the politics internet there has been a spate of retrospective complaints about how bad a “blitz primary” would have been as evinced by the aggressive and deranged online discourse that has supposedly tainted the purity of the “veepstakes.”

If you are involved in these online meme wars, I grant that it might feel as if things are very contentious. You might see yourself as being on one side of a battle that must be won, and that your activism is the tip of the spear that represents a broader coalition behind you out in the world. For example, if you are involved in progressive or anti-Zionist online activism it might seem as if everyone hates Josh and game theory requires him to be passed over. If you fancy yourself a political polling and data nerd, you might have come to the conclusion that anyone except for Josh would be idiocy. If you are a regular resistance activist your feed is exploding with Hot Walz content.

Even the unifying, thoughtful Bulwark Redditors have exploded in a #war between the Walz-pilled and the Shapiro-stans.

Here’s the problem with all of this.

This “war” that is purportedly happening within the party over the VP selection is all an illusion. It is taking place in a hermetically sealed bubble among political hobbyists who have extremely strong feelings about the ideological trajectory of the Democratic party . . . and nobody else. They are a fraction of a fraction of the party.

Rank-and-file Democrats are unburdened by the veepstakes discourse. They only have surface-level knowledge about the main contenders, according to polls. And the Democrats who live in each contender’s respective states overwhelmingly love their hometown boys.

The one supposedly “divisive” name being discussed, Shapiro, is viewed favorably by 90 percent of Pennsylvania Democrats. I guess the Keystone State progressives didn’t get the internet’s memo.

The reality is: Concerns about whether one of these DEI whites will salt the vibes are based on Twitter-brain alone."

Here is the link to the longer article: The Democrats Will Unite Behind Any VP Choice
Click to expand...

I am extremely optimistic that the majority of this country is f’ing sick and tired of having the minority act like it’s the majority, and is therefore willing to do whatever it takes to put a stake in the heart of MAGA and its anti-American authoritarian agenda. If I’m right about that, Shapiro or Walz will be a home run. My desperate, bordering on pathetic, request is that the far left STF UP and let us win this existential election. Please, we’re on last lap of the 1500. Let’s just bring it home.
 
lawtig02 said:
I am extremely optimistic that the majority of this country is f’ing sick and tired of having the minority act like it’s the majority, and is therefore willing to do whatever it takes to put a stake in the heart of MAGA and its anti-American authoritarian agenda. If I’m right about that, Shapiro or Walz will be a home run. My desperate, bordering on pathetic, request is that the far left STFU UP and let us win this existential election. Please, we’re on last lap of the 1500km. Let’s just bring it home.
Click to expand...
Couldn’t agree more with everything you said. Perfectly stated. Pick either Shapiro or Walz and let’s ride. I think with either one, our ticket is going to kick the shit out of MAGA in November.
 
CarolinaFever said:
Should go to the popular vote if it is tied. It is sad if Trump wins again and doesn't win the popular vote. But it shouldn't even be that close. The racists, bigots and idiots in the south and rural areas of the other states just want to go back to the 1950s and there are still way too many of them.
Click to expand...
Those Boomers need to die on off... and I say that as a Boomer
 
RockyMtnHoo said:
Yes, that would definitely suck, but with our crappy system that would technically be a fair Trump win.

My nightmare scenario would be Harris actually winning by a razor-thin EC margin, states that Harris won get contested and it somehow ends up in front of the Trump SCOTUS.
Click to expand...
Hanging chads anyone?
 
uncjhodges said:
If it’s Walz, it means one of 2 things (and maybe both)
1. Harris feels good about PA or
2. Shapiro was a big damper in Michigan
Click to expand...
Agreed. My guess is it is 1. Even if Shapiro were to be a little bit of an electoral liability among the Arab population in Michigan, I think that the ticket’s strength with UAW and unions would more than make up for it.
 
If it is Walz, there is no real downside other than name recognition, but that will be quickly remedied.

Shapiro has a higher ceiling, but he does come with some baggage that will have to be worked through.

Pennsylvania is the key. We’ve gotta win Pennsylvania.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top