What did Trump tap into?

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sringwal said:
Right. And therein lies the problem. For decades, democrats got criticized for being the dove party. Republicans are still the pro-military party, and folks in the military tend to run conservative. And yet, gtyellowjacket is claiming that too much military funding is, somehow, a reason that people are leaving the democrat party and voting for Trump. What in the ever-loving fuck?
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Trump is pitching the America first isolationist policy. People like that just like we did after Vietnam.

Then you look at Trump's actions like bombing a leading Iranian without a declaration of war and remember Trump doesn't really do what he says, but it doesn't change the fact that a lot of people are tired of US interventionism.
 
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It’s not even about where they are on the political spectrum. You want to convince democrats to put non-traditional candidates up? Great. But pick better examples. These are not serious people. Manchin probably is. The rest are not.

Serious Brian Cox GIF by SuccessionHBO
 
Paine said:
I think anyone who is committed to an ideology of religious extremism is pretty right wing. That was always her, even when she was a Dem in Congress.

She did an alright job of hiding it by pretending to be in favor of left wing causes. We now see that all of that has gone out the window, but her religious extremism has remained at the core of her ideology.
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Such as?
 
sringwal said:
It’s not even about where they are on the political spectrum. You want to convince democrats to put non-traditional candidates up? Great. But pick better examples. These are not serious people. Manchin probably is. The rest are not.

Serious Brian Cox GIF by SuccessionHBO
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Manchin is serious about what policies are best to enrich himself, his family, and the donor class.
 
gtyellowjacket said:
Trump is pitching the America first isolationist policy. People like that just like we were after Vietnam.

Then you look at Trump's actions like bombing a leading Iranian without a declaration of war and remember Trump doesn't really do what he says, but it doesn't change the fact that a lot of people are tired of US interventionism.
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This is because Trump is not a serious person either. He takes whatever position he can that will do the most damage to the Democratic Party. If dems moved more dove on this issue, he’d pivot to pro military and claim that dems hate defending America.

And his supporters would pivot with him.

We see this right now, with the position he has regarding the Israel/Palestine conflict vs his Russia/Ukraine rhetoric.

Democrats are simultaneously being criticized with defending Ukraine too much and paradoxically not defending Israel enough.

And his supporters eat both up. Double think at its finest.

And you repeat it here, even though you know this, because you ultimately understand that democrats live in self doubt, whereas the Republican Party is now the party of full stop. And you want to feed off of that self doubt. And what really pisses me off is that we on the left fall for it.

At which point you critique dems for not being a unified party - “dems in disarray” - all to distract from the clown show that the Republican Party has become.
 
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Paine said:
Such as what? I’m referring to Gabbard’s rabid Hindu extremism.

www.independent.co.uk

Tulsi Gabbard’s ties to secretive cult may explain her perplexing political journey

Dr Caroline Sinavaiana Gabbard toldThe Independent in an interview that her niece’s career is all about the pursuit of power
www.independent.co.uk www.independent.co.uk
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And that’s my point. It’s not about where she is on the political aisle. It never has been. Hell, her supposed views on a lot of things mirror my own. But, even if they 100% did, I still wouldn’t vote for her. Because, again, she is not a serious person.
 
sringwal said:
And that’s my point. It’s not about where she is on the political aisle. It never has been. Hell, her supposed views on a lot of things mirror my own. But, even if they 100% did, I still wouldn’t vote for her. Because, again, she is not a serious person.
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Same. I agree with several of her supposed views, like Medicare for All. Impossible to tell what her actual views are though besides the religious extremism.
 
Lando said:
"I don't think he'll be able to do the stuff he wants to do" has to be the absolute worst reason to support a politician.
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Well, it's better than "I am voting for him because I think he will do this evil stuff." But yes, if you're voting for someone whose platform you know to be wrong, you should probably rethink.
 
Lando said:
"I don't think he'll be able to do the stuff he wants to do" has to be the absolute worst reason to support a politician.
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Indeed. The rationalizations for Trump are something to behold. "Yes, he does threaten individuals and whole groups of people with imprisonment, deportation, and worse, but he's just talking trash and will never carry through on such threats. I don't know why you Democrats are so worked up about it. He doesn't really mean it, even though he says it over and over and he's surrounded himself with people who seem dead set on carrying out his threats. You guys just have TDS!"

Or, "yes, he's praised Project 2025 and he's surrounded by people who helped write it, and he's proposed insane stuff like raising extreme tariffs that would likely wreck the economy, but he'll never actually do it. I mean, other Republicans in office will surely stop him, even though they've never shown a spine in opposing him before." Just real head-in-the-sand thinking, or they just privately support everything he says and wants and refuse to admit it, because they know exactly how bad it looks and sounds.
 
And in this way, if in no other (although I would argue that there are others, particularly in terms of pathology), he is like a great many of the world’s despots, today and in the past.
 
sringwal said:
… and which party pushed that war, full stop, and accused people in the other party who were against the war of, and I quote, “supporting terrorist regimes”?
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Literally both of them pushed the wars. Which is why Tulsi moved away from the Democratic party. There was no place for her.
 
Paine said:
Such as what? I’m referring to Gabbard’s rabid Hindu extremism.

www.independent.co.uk

Tulsi Gabbard’s ties to secretive cult may explain her perplexing political journey

Dr Caroline Sinavaiana Gabbard toldThe Independent in an interview that her niece’s career is all about the pursuit of power
www.independent.co.uk www.independent.co.uk
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This is rabid hindu extremism? A yoga group that was an off shoot of the Hare Krishna's that she may or may not belong to? They are against homosexuality and Islam so I guess maybe extremist although many mainline Christian sex have similar views. When you said extremist, I was thinking of members bombing mosques or shooting up synagogues.
 
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gtyellowjacket said:
This is rabid hindu extremism? A yoga group that was an off shoot of the Hare Krishna's that she may or may not belong to? They are against homosexuality and Islam so I guess maybe extremist. When you said extremist, I was thinking bombing mosques or shooting up synagogues.
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Narendra Modi loves her. Are you familiar with Modi’s party in India?

theintercept.com

Tulsi Gabbard Is a Rising Progressive Star, Despite Her Support for Hindu Nationalists

As her national profile grows, Tulsi Gabbard has publicly cut ties with her right-wing Hindu supporters at least once, but still courts them in private.
theintercept.com theintercept.com
 
Paine said:
Narendra Modi loves her. Are you familiar with Modi’s party in India?

theintercept.com

Tulsi Gabbard Is a Rising Progressive Star, Despite Her Support for Hindu Nationalists

As her national profile grows, Tulsi Gabbard has publicly cut ties with her right-wing Hindu supporters at least once, but still courts them in private.
theintercept.com theintercept.com
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Okay. She's a prominent American Hindu politician. Of course he's going to love her.

She has disavowed Hindu nationalism. That doesn't sound like something a Hindu extremist would say.
 
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