Hot Stove: UNC Basketball

[stankeylegjones]

I think his wife has been shaving her legs with it.

My partner doesn't shave their legs.

 

[duluoz]

Maybe it's a problem getting deals for all the players. I don't know. Just odd that people have been saying NIL is the problem and RJ had the most NIL deals. Either way, no reason to attack anyone personally just for their opinions about the state of the basketball program.

Yeah that’s what I thought.

And I just explained why it’s not “odd” — how RJ and Bacot made money from NIL is not the same as how Cade Tyson made money from NIL. The former includes income that is actually image-based and more earned and owned in that sense. The latter is a bag of cash from boosters, and in most of those cases, people online or anywhere else don’t care who the hell a player like Cade Tyson is and aren’t scrambling to buy what he’s selling. With rare exceptions, nobody is lining up for t-shirts or jerseys of players like that, nor asking them to influence for this or that product. “Name and image” are nominal in that sense and the whole thing has now been devised or morphed into essentially a front for “pay-for-play.” These are different pools of cash under the same unwieldy, loosely defined, opaque umbrella and shouldn’t be conflated.

 

[duluoz]

Great timing for this article, exactly what I’m talking about. Real, legitimate NIL deals vs. the ones most players are now getting:

Houston basketball coach Kelvin Sampson recently inquired about a potential transfer and was told the price for one season would be $2.5 million, a stunningly high number and not reflective of the actual value of his name, image and likeness. Still, at least Sampson knew what he was dealing with.

Power schools will outsource enforcing NIL payments to athletes

Skeptics say cash to players for commercial endorsements often far exceeds the service's actual value.

www.espn.com

 

[gregh1]

Great timing for this article, exactly what I’m talking about. Real, legitimate NIL deals vs. the ones most players are now getting:

Houston basketball coach Kelvin Sampson recently inquired about a potential transfer and was told the price for one season would be $2.5 million, a stunningly high number and not reflective of the actual value of his name, image and likeness. Still, at least Sampson knew what he was dealing with.

Power schools will outsource enforcing NIL payments to athletes

Skeptics say cash to players for commercial endorsements often far exceeds the service's actual value.

www.espn.com

Folks can try to legitimize NIL, add "clearinghouses", etc, but there is market, i have trouble seeing the amount dropping a ton due to legitimacy reasons. If you do something drastic that market might suddenly become a blackmarket. "Boosters" are used to forking loads of cash + Players are used to receiving loads of cash = Bagmen gonna bagman one way or the other.

Though I could see the market normalizing at some point just due to the insanity or due to boosters/investors seeing how fickle the ROI is.

 

[stankeylegjones]

Great timing for this article, exactly what I’m talking about. Real, legitimate NIL deals vs. the ones most players are now getting:

Houston basketball coach Kelvin Sampson recently inquired about a potential transfer and was told the price for one season would be $2.5 million, a stunningly high number and not reflective of the actual value of his name, image and likeness. Still, at least Sampson knew what he was dealing with.

Power schools will outsource enforcing NIL payments to athletes

Skeptics say cash to players for commercial endorsements often far exceeds the service's actual value.

www.espn.com

Thanks for posting this.

 

[BluHevn]

Contracts, caps and buyouts like the pros would do wonders and help to stabilize things.

 

[superrific]

Regarding your first part, if that's the your belief, do you feel like UNC is shady?

Do you know if all of the folks involved have no ties to Delaware?

There's a difference between secrecy and not disclosing. Has UNC done anything to **prevent** discovery of their NIL sponsors?

The odds are very good that they don't live in Delaware unless they are bankers or attorneys. A tiny fraction of the population lives in Delaware and isn't in those industries, and Duke is not known for its presence in DE.

Obviously I don't know anything for sure. Maybe 9 out of 10 is an exaggeration but I'd definitely bet shady on even odds.

 

[TarSpiel]

9 times out of 10, secrecy means shady. That's my experience in corporate law, at least.

That's my gut feeling too. But hey, Scheyer told them not to bend the rules, so...

 

[superrific]

Uuh, no.

That was called an "example." You calling me a liar and a lazy dumbass whose opinion on basketball is equivalent to Fox's news programs are some more examples.

They all seem just really disproportionate to the conversation that's going on. It feels personal, and like I said, I really have no idea why.

It's probably not. Why not just let it go and chalk it up to someone being a dick about basketball. I mean, that never happens, right?

 

[stankeylegjones]

Contracts, caps and buyouts like the pros would do wonders and help to stabilize things.

That is what the "rev shares" will do, but it doesn't address the NIL issues.

 

[TarSpiel]

It's probably not. Why not just let it go and chalk it up to someone being a dick about basketball. I mean, that never happens, right?

Yea, you're right.

 

[stankeylegjones]

There's a difference between secrecy and not disclosing. Has UNC done anything to **prevent** discovery of their NIL sponsors?

The odds are very good that they don't live in Delaware unless they are bankers or attorneys. A tiny fraction of the population lives in Delaware and isn't in those industries, and Duke is not known for its presence in DE.

Obviously I don't know anything for sure. Maybe 9 out of 10 is an exaggeration but I'd definitely bet shady on even odds.

I have no clue either, that is for sure.

I don't know if UNC has deflected on any questions regarding donors. I haven't seen anything, one way or the other.

 

[finesse]

There's a difference between secrecy and not disclosing. Has UNC done anything to **prevent** discovery of their NIL sponsors?

The odds are very good that they don't live in Delaware unless they are bankers or attorneys. A tiny fraction of the population lives in Delaware and isn't in those industries, and Duke is not known for its presence in DE.

Obviously I don't know anything for sure. Maybe 9 out of 10 is an exaggeration but I'd definitely bet shady on even odds.

Not actually following this but there's a difference in what public and private schools can say or do. FOIA requests don't mean anything to private schools. Don't know that it means anything here but it seems to when the NCAA rolls around.

 

[4thgenheel]

Maybe it's a problem getting deals for all the players. I don't know. Just odd that people have been saying NIL is the problem and RJ had the most NIL deals. Either way, no reason to attack anyone personally just for their opinions about the state of the basketball program.

the significant Name, Image and Likeness deals with various entities who wish to have players endorse their goods/services are going to the kids who are actually recognizable to a lot of people. that isn't that many kids. how many CBB players are nationally recognizable names? very few. how many are regionally recognizable? a few more. how many are recognizable to just the fans in your schools fanbase? or your rivals? or your conference? a few more. how many are pretty damn anonymous to the average fan? a whole lot of them.

if you aren't one of those recognizable players, NIL = piles of cash from the school's war chest.

 

[UNCatTech]

My partner doesn't shave their legs.

Somewhere between this statement and your user name there's a joke.

 

[UNCatTech]

It's probably not. Why not just let it go and chalk it up to someone being a dick about basketball. I mean, that never happens, right?

We can all be dicks at times. I know, I'm a professional...

 

[SnoopRob]

Address it with a downvote?

I gave you an upvote for a good idea.

 

[SnoopRob]

It's probably not. Why not just let it go and chalk it up to someone being a dick about basketball. I mean, that never happens, right?

To be fair. I can be a dick about more than basketball.

 

[Centerpiece]

So you’re not trying to say, passive aggressively, “See — NIL deals aren’t a problem for UNC, so this shows that HD is the actual cause of recruiting failures, since this article shows he had the resources to land players…”?

Because I’d bet my bottom dollar that my read on that is spot-on. But if not, my sincerest apologies.

No need to apologize- we all know that’s exactly what CF meant. After all CF gotta CF.

 

[SnoopRob]

So you read that WSJ article and came away thinking it’s greatly overblown that UNC is behind (at least) dook? Or Kentucky? Or all the SEC football schools you same posters are whining that UNC is falling behind?

I don’t have a peek behind the curtain but Occam’s razor would certainly disagree.

The word on the street is that, prior to this year, we were estimated to be somewhere in the top 15-25 in basketball NIL.

Our bump this year supposedly gets us closer to the top 10.

So we’re almost certainly not in the dook/UK/St John’s orbit, but we’re also not Little Sisters of the Poor, either.