Hubert Davis Catch-all

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UNCBAdookJD said:
It’s a consistent problem for Hubert coached teams to blow huge leads and lose. Hubert now owns the largest blown leads in the history of the first round and the championship game.
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And IIRC we were up 28 vs. Baylor in 2022 before they eventually forced OT. Thankfully we somehow prevailed in OT.
 
rodoheel said:
this sort of pedantic sniping.
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BTW I don't think it's "pedantic." What happens in these conversations is always the same -- it's becomes a massive pile-on because people pull out useless stats and questionable-at-best ideas to present the same issues in 100 different garbs. People build on each other until we get shit like, "this is the worst coached high-major team in the country."

The problem isn't that we lose too many leads. I'd be confident that if someone pulled out the game logs and analyzed them, they'd find that we lose leads at about the same rate as everyone else, when you adjust for overall record or team quality.

The problem isn't that we start too slowly. There's nothing special about the first five minutes of the game.

The problem isn't that we lose too many close games. The problem isn't that we've had the worst two-year NCAA-tournament-making doublet in school history. The problem isn't that we blew the biggest lead in the championship game when it was a minor miracle to be there and up by that much.

The problem is that we lose too much.

All the other shit is just derivative of this one problem. The team has been losing too much. There's no need to pile on with a million ways of saying the same thing.
 
SnoopRob said:
It's amazing how bad he is at dealing with the press.

Given that he came to coach at Carolina from the sports media, it's absolutely astounding.
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Another gem

Did you sense that your team got a little tired toward the end of the game?

Hubert Davis: “I did not. I didn’t.”

Why did you choose to go to a six-man rotation in the second half?

“Because that was my decision.”
 
UNCBAdookJD said:
It’s a consistent problem for Hubert coached teams to blow huge leads and lose. Hubert now owns the largest blown leads in the history of the first round and the championship game.
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I'm quite confident that Hubert coached teams do not blow huge leads and lose more than other teams. It's just that we're not used to losing that much.

It's also unclear why losing a big lead is worse than just trailing a bit by the whole game, or getting way down to start and then come back but not quite all the way.
 
SnoopRob said:
Always the coach? No.

But it is here.
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I’m a believer that, in most cases, the coach fully owns the results at the college level. It’s different compared to pro sports where the coach is strictly in charge of Xs and Os and you have an entire front office that controls personnel decisions independently.

Every program has its own ceiling though. Sometimes a good coach maxes out the potential of the program for a stretch, then when the results inevitably slightly tail off, the fans, donors, admins, etc. start to get angsty. The coach might not necessarily be doing a bad job, but the people that care about the program got a taste of how good it can be when everything falls into place, so they’re eventually forced to make a coaching change just for the sake of rejuvenating interest.

I think that is clearly not the situation with UNC right now though lol.
 
superrific said:
BTW I don't think it's "pedantic." What happens in these conversations is always the same -- it's becomes a massive pile-on because people pull out useless stats and questionable-at-best ideas to present the same issues in 100 different garbs. People build on each other until we get shit like, "this is the worst coached high-major team in the country."

The problem isn't that we lose too many leads. I'd be confident that if someone pulled out the game logs and analyzed them, they'd find that we lose leads at about the same rate as everyone else, when you adjust for overall record or team quality.

The problem isn't that we start too slowly. There's nothing special about the first five minutes of the game.

The problem isn't that we lose too many close games. The problem isn't that we've had the worst two-year NCAA-tournament-making doublet in school history. The problem isn't that we blew the biggest lead in the championship game when it was a minor miracle to be there and up by that much.

The problem is that we lose too much.

All the other shit is just derivative of this one problem. The team has been losing too much. There's no need to pile on with a million ways of saying the same thing.
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You are the Zen of basketball threads
 
rodoheel said:
To ignore the effect that fatigue can have on performance, no matter how well-conditioned you are, is simply foolish, as I said. Playing 6 guys the whole second half was foolish.

Why doesn't every coach just play their starters every minute if their players can maintain the same level of performance the whole way?
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Why ever take a baseball pitcher out of the game? Why worry about 3 and outs tiring your defense in football?
 
superrific said:
BTW I don't think it's "pedantic." What happens in these conversations is always the same -- it's becomes a massive pile-on because people pull out useless stats and questionable-at-best ideas to present the same issues in 100 different garbs. People build on each other until we get shit like, "this is the worst coached high-major team in the country."

The problem isn't that we lose too many leads. I'd be confident that if someone pulled out the game logs and analyzed them, they'd find that we lose leads at about the same rate as everyone else, when you adjust for overall record or team quality.

The problem isn't that we start too slowly. There's nothing special about the first five minutes of the game.

The problem isn't that we lose too many close games. The problem isn't that we've had the worst two-year NCAA-tournament-making doublet in school history. The problem isn't that we blew the biggest lead in the championship game when it was a minor miracle to be there and up by that much.

The problem is that we lose too much.

All the other shit is just derivative of this one problem. The team has been losing too much. There's no need to pile on with a million ways of saying the same thing.
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This is true. Close loss, blowout loss, blow a big lead, start slow, it doesn't really matter. Over the long haul you'll be measured mostly by how much you win. Hubert's been about 10% less successful in that regard than he needs to be.
 
Bigs23 said:
So it's always the coach? Can it ever be something else?
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With the resources UNC pumps into basketball, yes it’s the coach. We have enough money for NIL, recruiting, facilities, and staff. The problems have to be some combination of talent evaluation, roster build/synergy, or straight up X’s and O’s. All of which are the head coach’s responsibility.
 
Icky Mettle said:
And IIRC we were up 28 vs. Baylor in 2022 before they eventually forced OT. Thankfully we somehow prevailed in OT.
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Yeah, but that was a legit screw-job by the refs. I rarely say that as an excuse, but that game was ridick. Brady getting ejected, Caleb fouling out on ticky-tack calls, Sochan mauling our guys, etc.
 
UNCBAdookJD said:
With the resources UNC pumps into basketball, yes it’s the coach. We have enough money for NIL, recruiting, facilities, and staff. The problems have to be some combination of talent evaluation, roster build/synergy, or straight up X’s and O’s. All of which are the head coach’s responsibility.
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So what about football?
 
superrific said:
I'm quite confident that Hubert coached teams do not blow huge leads and lose more than other teams. It's just that we're not used to losing that much.

It's also unclear why losing a big lead is worse than just trailing a bit by the whole game, or getting way down to start and then come back but not quite all the way.
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Because losing a huge lead is indicative of being the better team on paper but making mistakes/losing focus to let the other team get back in it. Those are coaching issues.
 
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