I do want conservatives on here

[TarSpiel]

I can't agree. One of the major political parties in the country has abandoned the notion of a shared reality and considers the antagonizing of the other side as preferable to policy or discourse.

What would you call a poster who did that?

1/3 of the country?

 

[ZenMode]

Of course Maga can care for their immediate family and pets. And they can empathize with them and their plights. But go beyond that. How empathetic are they towards the planet?

Empathetic but generally less so than Democrats.

Towards those who can’t help themselves?

Empathetic but generally less so than Democrats.

To innocent animals, plants, birds and bees… to Mother Nature as a whole?

Empathetic but generally less so than Democrats.

How about migrants in Central and Souh America fleeing their homelands and fleeing their own authoritarian dictators, fleeing for their very lives… headed towards the “land of the free, the home of the brave”… headed toward the Statue of Liberty… give us your tired your poor… How empathetic is Maga in that regard?

Empathetic but generally less so than Democrats.

Let’s not mince words here… let’s not conflate Maga with old school GOP conservatives like Colin Powell and John McCain.

Some Republicans are more empathetic than others, yes.

Don’t mix up Maga with the Conservatives on this board who see the light and have disavowed trump and Maga.

That doesn't mean those conservatives are going to be as empathetic as most Dems on most topics. Political views between parties are general a different of degrees, not extremes.

And let’s not think for a moment a dog on a short leash, kept out on a chain with a cheap plastic doghouse for it’s only shelter in the heat of the summer and in the dead of winter is owned by anything other than a Maga piece of shit for a human being.

I'd be surprised if mistreatment of animals is tied to one party. Dog fighting is brutal and probably not common among Republicans.

Sure, that Maga piece of shit may bemoan their “pet” at its passing. But let’s not think for a minute that Maga gives 2 shits about much of any other living creature, human or otherwise.

Unfounded hyperbole.

These sonsabitches think Nazis are good, slavery was ok, separate but equal was great!

{Visible confusion}

What does anyone think “Make America Great Again” actually means? For them it means to go back to they way it was before Civil Rights, Equal Rights, Women’s suffrage.

So, you believe MAGA wants to take away rights for women and minorities? Which rights? Do you actually believe they want to take away women's right to vote?

 

[Centerpiece]

This has been refuted at ad nauseum
These have been refuted at ad nauseum. You only make arguments like these because of liberalism failed ideologies. Until you quit boxing people into your worldview you'll always be stuck in your strawman arguments. You've probably around plenty of conservatives and had a good time and never felt threatened or harmed.

I figured you would weigh in on this one. Maga lacks the natural ability to empathize with the other. However, I won’t cross swords with you on this. You go ahead and draw your petty conclusions as I’ve drawn mine.

 

[StrangePackage]

1/3 of the country?

Nice dodge.

It's not over-used, it's an accurate description of a political movement. That it's a relatively popular one doesn't mean they aren't trolls.

 

[farce©]

1/3 of the country?

And you want more of them to come shit all over this board?

I don’t see you engaging the MAGA posters here in constructive dialogue. Why do you want more? So you can ignore them too?

 

[Centerpiece]

1/3 of the country?

Is it bad if 2/3rds of the country doesn't want to play in the same sandbox as the other 1/3rd?
The thing is, 2/3 is ok with the other 1/3 as long as the 1/3 don't shit in the sandbox.

The problem is, the 1/3 wants to dominate the sandbox while also shitting in it. At the same time , they want to rub the noses of the other 2/3s in the shit while sitting back and laughing. Eventually, something's got to give.

Now mind you, the right wingers will try to shift the blame and paint themselves as the "silent majority" - or the aforementioned 2/3s - while claiming the "libruls" are the 1/3 in the above scenario.

But we all know that's not the case.

The problem for the 2/3 - the "libruls" - is, they have a messaging problem. If you want to get everybody in the sandbox to play together - even those who shit the sandbox - how do you teach them all that that's not cool, without ostracizing them? It's the conundrum of the left. Big tent. All are welcome, just don't shit in here with out cleaning up after yourself. And if you do, oh well... we'll clean it up for you because that's who we are.

The hard-right wingers don't give 2 shits. They'll shit the bed, shoot your dog, eat your cow and then demand you clean it all up. Then they'll claim you can't play in the same sandbox with them anymore. You and your kind have to go sit in the smaller sandbox and drink out of a different water cooler.

The right will always win that game because they don't care about living in shit.

Drive around rural N. Carolina and look at the squalor - with those trump flags flying. Those rebel flags flying. Don't tread on me muthafucker! "And if you don't like Murikkka, then move!"

 

[BlooVooDoo]

My conservative friends who have pets regard them as family members; they’re as crushed when a pet passes as anyone else.

 

[BlooVooDoo]

Empathetic but generally less so than Democrats.

Empathetic but generally less so than Democrats.

Empathetic but generally less so than Democrats.

Empathetic but generally less so than Democrats.

Some Republicans are more empathetic than others, yes.

That doesn't mean those conservatives are going to be as empathetic as most Dems on most topics. Political views between parties are general a different of degrees, not extremes.

I'd be surprised if mistreatment of animals is tied to one party. Dog fighting is brutal and probably not common among Republicans.

Unfounded hyperbole.

{Visible confusion}


So, you believe MAGA wants to take away rights for women and minorities? Which rights? Do you actually believe they want to take away women's right to vote?

“The fundamental weakness of Western Civilization is empathy.”

 

[gtyellowjacket]

Not sure where to put this—if mods or anyone can think of a better thread, I’m all for moving it:

I just recently watched this documentary on Netflix. Strangely, despite having nothing explicitly to do with politics, this flick more than anything else encapsulates the problem with trying to communicate with MAGA folks.

https://www.netflix.com/title/81026438

Short synopsis of the flick is that a mob boss in Connecticut bought a minor league hockey team, brought them to New Haven, all for his 17-yr old son to manage.

Son (with mob bosses connections and blessing) fills the roster with goons, Slap Shot style. The team does well, and of course becomes infamous because of their goonery and violence.

The part that struck me most was how the blue-collar locals LOVED the team, loved the violence, loved the mobbed-up culture. They sold out every game. Every single fan interviewed in the doc was absolutely a MAGA supporter. They were angry with the league for enforcing penalties against the team and owners/managers.

MAGA folks root for the bad guys in movies. They love the attention they get by thumbing their noses at the rules and the “experts”. You can’t talk reason with them because they don’t give a shit about reasoning.

Are you sure they are all MAGA? Danbury, Connecticut leans Democrat and has voted Democrat for president the last 4 cycles. The mayor and the majority of the city council are Democrats. I guess that the fans could be exclusively Republican or that they only selected MAGA's for interviews but that seems unlikely. The odds are pretty good that at least some of the interviewed did not vote for Trump.

 

[ZenMode]

“The fundamental weakness of Western Civilization is empathy.”

Certainly Elon doesn't speak for the Republican Party or all Republicans. I don't think empathy is THE fundamental weakness, but it most certainly is A weakness.

 

[finesse]

Certainly Elon doesn't speak for the Republican Party or all Republicans. I don't think empathy is THE fundamental weakness, but it most certainly is A weakness.

Make your case. I don't think you can.

What's wrong with this?

the ability to understand and share the feelings of another.

 

[Kingpin]

Respectfully, I think what you are describing is an issue of class and not political affiliation. No one in my orbit has an outside dog on a short lease. Quite the opposite.

Those folks are on your team. And you are OK with that because you know you and your team can’t win elections without them. Same with Nazis, Racists, misogynists etc. You may not be any of those, but you are OK with them because you need them for reasons, eg taxes and regulation (the deficit be damned). Only deficits under Dems are bad.

 

[Ramrouser]

Those folks are on your team. And you are OK with that because you know you and your team can’t win elections without them. Same with Nazis, Racists, misogynists etc. You may not be any of those, but you are OK with them because you need them for reasons, eg taxes and regulation (the deficit be damned). Only deficits under Dems are bad.

Some of them, yes. Dems have their "team" as well that they need to win elections. Obviously, in a two party system a lot of people in your party are going to be less than ideal.

 

[Centerpiece]

“The fundamental weakness of Western Civilization is empathy.”

Zen is trying too hard here….
My conclusions are:
Yes - Dems, liberals, progressives are WAY MORE empathetic than Pubs, Cons, Maga and Tea Party.
Yes - I believe Maga-types are WAY MORE apt to attend dog fights, cock fights, keep their dogs on a short chain out in the cold of winter.
Yes - I believe Maga wants to “Make America Great Again” by moving the country back to the early 1950’s if not the 1850’s. And by that they mean to take away the rights of women and minorities.
Yes - I know Trump doesn’t like animals. Yes - I know Trump’s kids go hunt big game animals for sport. Yes - they have no empathy for animals of any kind, human or otherwise.
Yes - I believe the majority of those who support the mob-led thug hockey team in Connecticut are Republican Magas. I have no doubt whatsoever.

Quit trying so hard Zen.

Finally, I like Tarspiel’s idea of including conservatives on this board - but only the kind who have disavowed trump and Maga. I want to hear their stories of why they think their fellow Republicans have fallen hook, line and sinker for tea-party, Maga B.S.. I want to hear what it was that persuaded them to not go that way and why they think their conservative neighbors actually support white South Africans; why they support the Alt right in Germany; why they think Orban in Hungary gets it right; why they think our life-long enemy in Putin and Russia are now our friends and allies; why did they fall for trump’s grift and con game? How can they be that stupid?

 

[Centerpiece]

Those folks are on your team. And you are OK with that because you know you and your team can’t win elections without them. Same with Nazis, Racists, misogynists etc. You may not be any of those, but you are OK with them because you need them for reasons, eg taxes and regulation (the deficit be damned). Only deficits under Dems are bad.

Ram has to go outside more often. His immediate neighbor may not keep his dog outside 100% of the time. His neighbor is probably one of the rich Maga who has a house, yard and compound which is gated and totally fenced in. Those type Pubs can let their dog run around the yard and then let them in the garage during the cold winter. Maybe even let them into the house itself.

But Ram needs to drive around rural NC, rural America. He needs to see the trailers and run down old mill houses with cars up on blocks in the front yard… with the Trump 2020 flags still flying next to the rebel flags. Ram needs to take a close look, because in the back yard of those dwellings he will see that poor old hound dog on that short chain, or in a small dog pen with one of those cheap plastic doghouses.

Ram needs to own it. He and his rich pub friends who voted for trump and the tax cuts have to realize that their Maga brethren Simply do not have it in their DNA to empathize with “the other”. They’re pea brains aren’t wired that way.

 

[Kingpin]

Some of them, yes. Dems have their "team" as well that they need to win elections. Obviously, in a two party system a lot of people in your party are going to be less than ideal.

I disagree with policies of some on my “team”, but Pubs have a corner on the market for Nazis, Racists and misogynists (deplorable human beings). You disagree with Dems on policy- I get that. Who are the deplorables on the Dem side? No Dem would align themselves politically with those deplorables on your team.

 

[Ramrouser]

I regularly travel through rural Georgia on my way to the coast. I obviously see what you describe but you're painting these folks with waaay too broad of a brush. Being poor doesn't mean you have bad character or morals. Lot's of decent poor people in the South.

I still see Rebel flags in rural Georgia but they are A LOT less common than 10 - 20 years ago.

 

[UNCatTech]

Respectfully, I think what you are describing is an issue of class and not political affiliation. No one in my orbit has an outside dog on a short lease. Quite the opposite.

In Georgia there are laws regarding leashes. Not sure if state wide or county, but my previous neighbor was fined for having a dog outside on a leash. The requirement was a fence or inside, no leashes.

I actually agree that this isn't a political issue. I'm sure treatment of animals is a spectrum on both sides of the political divide and I'm confident that they are fairly equal.

 

[UNCatTech]

Every group has outliers.

She's clearly a nut, but I'm not sure she can be considered the norm for how people treat animals.

 

[UNCatTech]

Some of them, yes. Dems have their "team" as well that they need to win elections. Obviously, in a two party system a lot of people in your party are going to be less than ideal.

I really wish we would lose the team analogy. This isn't sport, it's much more important.

The things our government does isn't limited to your team or mine, it impacts us all.