Israel reaches cease fire with Hezbollah, fighting shifts to Syria

[ZenMode]

100%
Especially when you add in the genocidal rhetoric by Netanyahu and his cronies. They aren’t hiding it. Palestinians in northern Gaza were just cleared out and as they exited, the soldiers told them that would be the last time they would step foot there.

It’s clear from the start that Netanyahu plans to clear out Gaza to build more settlements and to gain access to the natural gas that is below it. It was clear as day.

Below 2% is a really low bar. Obviously you can set it wherever you want, but I'd be curious where you draw the line.

 

[RaiGuy]

Below 2% is a really low bar. Obviously you can set it wherever you want, but I'd be curious where you draw the line.

Israel is the number one cause of children’s death in the world right now. That, by itself, should be a sign to anyone that they crossed the line.
Have you seen any of the raw footage after a bombing? It is very clear that they want to cause maximum damage and to scare people away. They want to make the area uninhabitable. In addition to killing people, they are purposefully destroying the architecture. Why would they demolish empty universities? Why would they destroy mosques, churches, schools, bakeries, markets, etc…? Why would they completely destroy roads? This goes far beyond targeting Hamas. They came in with the intention of wiping the area out to resettle it themselves. To do that, there needs to be no Palestinians left. So they either need to be killed or forced out and they will have nothing to return to.

The line was crossed a long time ago.

 

[ZenMode]

Israel is the number one cause of children’s death in the world right now. That, by itself, should be a sign to anyone that they crossed the line.

The problem is that you are looking at results and attributing intent without considering the circumstances. IF Israel truly had intent to kill civilians/children, they could have literally leveled Gaza and killed nearly the entire population long ago.

Hamas killed 1000 civilians in about 8 hours with only knives and hand-held guns. Why do you think, relative to Hamas, so few civilians have been killed in over a year, despite Israel having the capability to kill every person in Gaza by now?

Have you seen any of the raw footage after a bombing? It is very clear that they want to cause maximum damage and to scare people away. They want to make the area uninhabitable. In addition to killing people, they are purposefully destroying the architecture. Why would they demolish empty universities? Why would they destroy mosques, churches, schools, bakeries, markets, etc…? Why would they completely destroy roads? This goes far beyond targeting Hamas. They came in with the intention of wiping the area out to resettle it themselves. To do that, there needs to be no Palestinians left. So they either need to be killed or forced out and they will have nothing to return to.

The line was crossed a long time ago.

We know that Hamas built miles of tunnels under a civilian population, including all of the structures you mentioned. We also know that Hamas uses civilian structures as military locations. What would you suggest Israel do when they are fighting an enemy who doesn't follow accepted (any humane) rules of war?

 

[RaiGuy]

This doctor refused to evacuate the hospital because he didn’t want to leave his patients (including incubated babies), so Israel proceeds to kill his teenage son.

 

[RaiGuy]

 

[ZenMode]

This doctor refused to evacuate the hospital because he didn’t want to leave his patients (including incubated babies), so Israel proceeds to kill his teenage son.

It's great that he took time from being a doctor, helping people injured in the war, mourning the (alleged) loss of his son, etc to gather his friends to shoot a video for Twitter.

 

[RaiGuy]

It's great that he took time from being a doctor, helping people, mourning the (alleged) loss of his son, etc to gather his friends to shoot a video for Twitter.

Wtf are you talking about? What video did he shoot? Are you referring to the one where they’re doing the funeral prayers for his murdered son? Just another xenophobic comment by you, not surprising.

 

[ZenMode]

Wtf are you talking about? What video did he shoot? Are you referring to the one where they’re doing the funeral prayers for his murdered son? Just another xenophobic comment by you, not surprising.

Xenophobic? This has nothing to do with the race or nationality of the people in the video or shooting the video. It has to do with the actions.

I've gone to funerals for deceased friends and relatives. There is not a chance in the world I would allow somebody to a shoot video of it or be posted on social media. Of course, I don't use funerals to try to win PR battles around the world, either.

 

[RaiGuy]

Xenophobic? This has nothing to do with the race or nationality of the people in the video or shooting the video. It has to do with the actions.

I've gone to funerals for deceased friends and relatives. There is not a chance in the world I would allow somebody to a shoot video of it or be posted on social media. Of course, I don't use funerals to try to win PR battles around the world, either.

You went to a funeral in the middle of a genocide? This video was from a local journalist filming it. They are capturing the grief of a father that had his child killed as punishment for him not leaving his patients. Your comments are xenophobic because they push along the Israeli narrative that dehumanizes Palestinians. You’re claiming he faked the story of his son being killed and then filming a video for show. That’s just sick.

 

[ZenMode]

You went to a funeral in the middle of a genocide? This video was from a local journalist filming it. They are capturing the grief of a father that had his child killed as punishment for him not leaving his patients. Your comments are xenophobic because they push along the Israeli narrative that dehumanizes Palestinians. You’re claiming he faked the story of his son being killed and then filming a video for show. That’s just sick.

What's sick is allowing a reporter to post footage of a funeral on Twitter. As much as you want to make this about xenophobia or racism, it's not.

Let me ask you a question... What is Israel supposed to do in the situation where they are living next door to people who have publicly proclaim their desire to wipe them off the face of the Earth and continue to try to do so?

 

[RaiGuy]

What's sick is allowing a reporter to post footage of a funeral on Twitter. As much as you want to make this about xenophobia or racism, it's not.

Let me ask you a question... What is Israel supposed to do in the situation where they are living next door to people who have publicly proclaim their desire to wipe them off the face of the Earth and continue to try to do so?

So, if there was a cartel in Monterrey that said it wanted to wipe out the US, you would be fine if the US wiped out that whole region instead?

But again, that metaphor doesn’t completely work because the US isn’t occupying Mexico and there isn’t a system of apartheid there as well. But you’re fine with it because the victims are dehumanized anyways. You make it sound like Israel’s only option for safety is one where Palestinians aren’t safe. You show more with every post that you really don’t know the history and you don’t try to learn it.

 

[TarSpiel]

they are living next door to people...

That's rich.

Israel evicted them out of their own house, moved in to it themselves, and then put them in a shithole ghetto.

 

[ZenMode]

So, if there was a cartel in Monterrey that said it wanted to wipe out the US, you would be fine if the US wiped out that whole region instead?

But again, that metaphor doesn’t completely work because the US isn’t occupying Mexico and there isn’t a system of apartheid there as well. But you’re fine with it because the victims are dehumanized anyways. You make it sound like Israel’s only option for safety is one where Palestinians aren’t safe. You show more with every post that you really don’t know the history and you don’t try to learn it.

It's not just Muslim extremists in Gaza that have publicly expressed their desire to eradicate Israel and all Jews therein.

Israel isn't occupying anything. Jews were indigenous to Iran Syria, Turkey, Iran and Yemen to name a few. Jews were driven from all of those countries by Muslims, yet you never hear cries from the world to return any of those countries to the Jews, do you? Pakistan came into existence in the same year as Israel. Why aren't they being forced to justify their existence?

 

[TarSpiel]

Jews were indigenous to Iran Syria, Turkey, Iran and Yemen to name a few. Jews were driven from all of those countries by Muslims

Bullshit. You don't know what you're talking about, do you?

You might be mistaking Syria, Turkey, Iran and Yemen for Britain, Italy, France, and Germany, who *did* evict Jews (many times) over the course of their histories.

The countries you mentioned, except Iran, were a part of the Ottoman Empire for many centuries, and the Ottomans never evicted Jews...just the opposite, in fact. When the Spaniards kicked Jews out at the end of the Reconquista, the Ottomans sent boats over to pick them up.

Under Muslim rule, Jews and Christians both are allowed to practice their religion if they pay a certain tax (which is only modestly more than the tax levied through Shariah law on Muslims).

 

[ZenMode]

Bullshit. You don't know what you're talking about, do you?

You might be mistaking Syria, Turkey, Iran and Yemen for Britain, Italy, France, and Germany, who *did* evict Jews (many times) over the course of their histories.

The countries you mentioned, except Iran, were a part of the Ottoman Empire for many centuries, and the Ottomans never evicted Jews...just the opposite, in fact. When the Spaniards kicked Jews out at the end of the Reconquista, the Ottomans sent boats over to pick them up.

Under Muslim rule, Jews and Christians both are allowed to practice their religion if they pay a certain tax (which is only modestly more than the tax levied through Shariah law on Muslims).

I didn't say Jews were evicted by the Ottoman empire. I said they were indigenous to the area that now makes up the countries I mentioned. Jews have been in that area for thousands of years.

 

[finesse]

It's not just Muslim extremists in Gaza that have publicly expressed their desire to eradicate Israel and all Jews therein.

Israel isn't occupying anything. Jews were indigenous to Iran Syria, Turkey, Iran and Yemen to name a few. Jews were driven from all of those countries by Muslims, yet you never hear cries from the world to return any of those countries to the Jews, do you? Pakistan came into existence in the same year as Israel. Why aren't they being forced to justify their existence?

Partly because, in 1948 ,only 35 % of Jews in Israel were born there. I also think that your driven out was an exaggeration. Jews were almost invariably treated better in Muslim countries than Christian ones throughout history until the middle of the 20th century. If they left after that, it was more to go to Israel than being forced out.

Don't know that much about their history but the Partition Wars with India were terrible and settling on what was whose went on for a while between East Pakistan and West Pakistan and Bangladesh. I'd still bet that the % of native born was substantially higher than 35%. Fwiw, the UK was to blame with a lot of problems here as well as in Palestine. It's also not clear that they've had less or that we've heard less considering the American affinity for Israel as representing the Holy Land. Nonsensical to me for that to matter but that doesn't mean that it doesn't.

 

[TarSpiel]

I didn't say Jews were evicted by the Ottoman empire. I said they were indigenous to the area that now makes up the countries I mentioned. Jews have been in that area for thousands of years.

You said they were evicted by Muslims. If they're "indigenous" to those areas, then Muslims didn't "evict" them during the Umayyad Caliphate, the Abbasid Caliphate, or the Ottoman Empire. That's like 1,300 years of Muslims not evicting them, and allowing them to continue practicing their religion.

 

[wmheel1287]

No, I don’t think the Israelis will. I think the Saudis, and the oil barons in Dubai, and the Americans, and the Germans, and a lot of other people will, though. And I think the Israelis will go along with it, even reluctantly, because they know that is their best option moving forward.

Then you are absolutely delusional. The Israelis will not stop until there are no Palentinian lands. The Israelis will settle all of Gaza with people they pick and choose. They will further thumb their nose at every nation of the world in doing so...especially their vicious lapdog, the United States.

 

[TarSpiel]

The Israelis will not stop until there are no Palentinian lands.

Well, the right-wing Israelis anyway.

Lets not forget that there are lots of Jews in Israel who support Palestinian rights, and who despise their current apartheid government.

 

[ZenMode]

You said they were evicted by Muslims. If they're "indigenous" to those areas, then Muslims didn't "evict" them during the Umayyad Caliphate, the Abbasid Caliphate, or the Ottoman Empire. That's like 1,300 years of Muslims not evicting them, and allowing them to continue practicing their religion.

I don't know exact numbers, but do you think it's a coincidence that there are very few, if any, Jews in the Muslim countries I mentioned, despite the fact that Jews were in that region 2,000 years ago and that it's only Jews who have to justify their existence in their own country?

Is anyone, especially at the UN, concerned about Jews "right of return" to the countries I mentioned?