Israel reaches cease fire with Hezbollah, fighting shifts to Syria

[ZenMode]

You went to a funeral in the middle of a genocide? This video was from a local journalist filming it. They are capturing the grief of a father that had his child killed as punishment for him not leaving his patients. Your comments are xenophobic because they push along the Israeli narrative that dehumanizes Palestinians. You’re claiming he faked the story of his son being killed and then filming a video for show. That’s just sick.

What's sick is allowing a reporter to post footage of a funeral on Twitter. As much as you want to make this about xenophobia or racism, it's not.

Let me ask you a question... What is Israel supposed to do in the situation where they are living next door to people who have publicly proclaim their desire to wipe them off the face of the Earth and continue to try to do so?

 

[RaiGuy]

What's sick is allowing a reporter to post footage of a funeral on Twitter. As much as you want to make this about xenophobia or racism, it's not.

Let me ask you a question... What is Israel supposed to do in the situation where they are living next door to people who have publicly proclaim their desire to wipe them off the face of the Earth and continue to try to do so?

So, if there was a cartel in Monterrey that said it wanted to wipe out the US, you would be fine if the US wiped out that whole region instead?

But again, that metaphor doesn’t completely work because the US isn’t occupying Mexico and there isn’t a system of apartheid there as well. But you’re fine with it because the victims are dehumanized anyways. You make it sound like Israel’s only option for safety is one where Palestinians aren’t safe. You show more with every post that you really don’t know the history and you don’t try to learn it.

 

[TarSpiel]

they are living next door to people...

That's rich.

Israel evicted them out of their own house, moved in to it themselves, and then put them in a shithole ghetto.

 

[ZenMode]

So, if there was a cartel in Monterrey that said it wanted to wipe out the US, you would be fine if the US wiped out that whole region instead?

But again, that metaphor doesn’t completely work because the US isn’t occupying Mexico and there isn’t a system of apartheid there as well. But you’re fine with it because the victims are dehumanized anyways. You make it sound like Israel’s only option for safety is one where Palestinians aren’t safe. You show more with every post that you really don’t know the history and you don’t try to learn it.

It's not just Muslim extremists in Gaza that have publicly expressed their desire to eradicate Israel and all Jews therein.

Israel isn't occupying anything. Jews were indigenous to Iran Syria, Turkey, Iran and Yemen to name a few. Jews were driven from all of those countries by Muslims, yet you never hear cries from the world to return any of those countries to the Jews, do you? Pakistan came into existence in the same year as Israel. Why aren't they being forced to justify their existence?

 

[TarSpiel]

Jews were indigenous to Iran Syria, Turkey, Iran and Yemen to name a few. Jews were driven from all of those countries by Muslims

Bullshit. You don't know what you're talking about, do you?

You might be mistaking Syria, Turkey, Iran and Yemen for Britain, Italy, France, and Germany, who *did* evict Jews (many times) over the course of their histories.

The countries you mentioned, except Iran, were a part of the Ottoman Empire for many centuries, and the Ottomans never evicted Jews...just the opposite, in fact. When the Spaniards kicked Jews out at the end of the Reconquista, the Ottomans sent boats over to pick them up.

Under Muslim rule, Jews and Christians both are allowed to practice their religion if they pay a certain tax (which is only modestly more than the tax levied through Shariah law on Muslims).

 

[ZenMode]

Bullshit. You don't know what you're talking about, do you?

You might be mistaking Syria, Turkey, Iran and Yemen for Britain, Italy, France, and Germany, who *did* evict Jews (many times) over the course of their histories.

The countries you mentioned, except Iran, were a part of the Ottoman Empire for many centuries, and the Ottomans never evicted Jews...just the opposite, in fact. When the Spaniards kicked Jews out at the end of the Reconquista, the Ottomans sent boats over to pick them up.

Under Muslim rule, Jews and Christians both are allowed to practice their religion if they pay a certain tax (which is only modestly more than the tax levied through Shariah law on Muslims).

I didn't say Jews were evicted by the Ottoman empire. I said they were indigenous to the area that now makes up the countries I mentioned. Jews have been in that area for thousands of years.

 

[finesse]

It's not just Muslim extremists in Gaza that have publicly expressed their desire to eradicate Israel and all Jews therein.

Israel isn't occupying anything. Jews were indigenous to Iran Syria, Turkey, Iran and Yemen to name a few. Jews were driven from all of those countries by Muslims, yet you never hear cries from the world to return any of those countries to the Jews, do you? Pakistan came into existence in the same year as Israel. Why aren't they being forced to justify their existence?

Partly because, in 1948 ,only 35 % of Jews in Israel were born there. I also think that your driven out was an exaggeration. Jews were almost invariably treated better in Muslim countries than Christian ones throughout history until the middle of the 20th century. If they left after that, it was more to go to Israel than being forced out.

Don't know that much about their history but the Partition Wars with India were terrible and settling on what was whose went on for a while between East Pakistan and West Pakistan and Bangladesh. I'd still bet that the % of native born was substantially higher than 35%. Fwiw, the UK was to blame with a lot of problems here as well as in Palestine. It's also not clear that they've had less or that we've heard less considering the American affinity for Israel as representing the Holy Land. Nonsensical to me for that to matter but that doesn't mean that it doesn't.

 

[TarSpiel]

I didn't say Jews were evicted by the Ottoman empire. I said they were indigenous to the area that now makes up the countries I mentioned. Jews have been in that area for thousands of years.

You said they were evicted by Muslims. If they're "indigenous" to those areas, then Muslims didn't "evict" them during the Umayyad Caliphate, the Abbasid Caliphate, or the Ottoman Empire. That's like 1,300 years of Muslims not evicting them, and allowing them to continue practicing their religion.

 

[wmheel1287]

No, I don’t think the Israelis will. I think the Saudis, and the oil barons in Dubai, and the Americans, and the Germans, and a lot of other people will, though. And I think the Israelis will go along with it, even reluctantly, because they know that is their best option moving forward.

Then you are absolutely delusional. The Israelis will not stop until there are no Palentinian lands. The Israelis will settle all of Gaza with people they pick and choose. They will further thumb their nose at every nation of the world in doing so...especially their vicious lapdog, the United States.

 

[TarSpiel]

The Israelis will not stop until there are no Palentinian lands.

Well, the right-wing Israelis anyway.

Lets not forget that there are lots of Jews in Israel who support Palestinian rights, and who despise their current apartheid government.

 

[ZenMode]

You said they were evicted by Muslims. If they're "indigenous" to those areas, then Muslims didn't "evict" them during the Umayyad Caliphate, the Abbasid Caliphate, or the Ottoman Empire. That's like 1,300 years of Muslims not evicting them, and allowing them to continue practicing their religion.

I don't know exact numbers, but do you think it's a coincidence that there are very few, if any, Jews in the Muslim countries I mentioned, despite the fact that Jews were in that region 2,000 years ago and that it's only Jews who have to justify their existence in their own country?

Is anyone, especially at the UN, concerned about Jews "right of return" to the countries I mentioned?

 

[TarSpiel]

I don't know exact numbers, but do you think it's a coincidence that there are very few, if any, Jews in the Muslim countries I mentioned, despite the fact that Jews were in that region 2,000 years ago and that it's only Jews who have to justify their existence in their own country?

They lived there unmolested until 1948, when they all moved to Israel. This isn't a mystery.

Muslims did not persecute Jews, nor did they kick them out.

European Christians, on the other hand, evicted them constantly, and eventually tried to commit genocide against them. Which is why they got a guilty conscience and stole land from innocent Palestinians to compensate for their own abysmal moral failings.

Here's a map that understates the case, by a lot, but is still hellpful"

 

[finesse]

Numbers I'm seeing is that about 900,000 left after 1948. Some were forced out and some left on their own. A little over 70% ended up in Israel. Like I said, there wasn't a problem between Jews and Muslims as much as between Israel and Muslims.

 

[superrific]

I don't know exact numbers, but do you think it's a coincidence that there are very few, if any, Jews in the Muslim countries I mentioned, despite the fact that Jews were in that region 2,000 years ago and that it's only Jews who have to justify their existence in their own country?

Is anyone, especially at the UN, concerned about Jews "right of return" to the countries I mentioned?

There are also very few Magyars in the Ural Mountain areas, even though they were in that region 1000 years ago. Funny how things can change over two millenia.

There's no such thing as a 2,000 year old claim to land. That's just stupidity. The Romans were also there in Palestine 2000 years ago. Why doesn't Italy claim the land for its people?

 

[finesse]

Just out of curiosity, does anyone know how long Jews were actually the dominant power in Israel and not a vassal or captive nation?

 

[ZenMode]

There are also very few Magyars in the Ural Mountain areas, even though they were in that region 1000 years ago. Funny how things can change over two millenia.

There's no such thing as a 2,000 year old claim to land. That's just stupidity. The Romans were also there in Palestine 2000 years ago. Why doesn't Italy claim the land for its people?

Again, given the number of established Muslim countries, why is nobody calling for a right of return for Jews to that country and why are Jews constantly having to justify the existence of a country dedicated to them? Pakistan came into existence in the same year as Israel. Why is nobody questioning their existence?

 

[superrific]

Pakistan came into existence in the same year as Israel. Why is nobody questioning their existence?

You can't possibly be this stupid. What about South Sudan? It came into existence this century. Why is nobody questioning it?

I don't know if Jews would have a right to return to Yemen. There's no demand, is there?

 

[finesse]

Again, given the number of established Muslim countries, why is nobody calling for a right of return for Jews to that country and why are Jews constantly having to justify the existence of a country dedicated to them? Pakistan came into existence in the same year as Israel. Why is nobody questioning their existence?

Those have all been addressed. If you don't understand, then ask specifically about what you missed. If that is how you take in information, then you wouldn't be aware of someone questioning their existence.

 

[ZenMode]

You can't possibly be this stupid. What about South Sudan? It came into existence this century. Why is nobody questioning it?

I don't know if Jews would have a right to return to Yemen. There's no demand, is there?

"You can't possibly be this stupid."

When you want to not be a prick, let me know and I'll be happy to debate/discuss topics.

You're condescending responses and childish insults might work for some people, but I'm not one of them.

 

[hedge]

Of course, I don't use funerals to try to win PR battles around the world, either.

And evidently you're too much of an asshole to appreciate the fact that you don't need to...