Many Americans Say the Democratic Party Does Not Share Their Priorities

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I should add that ignoring me does not make the Trump stench go away. It's standard MAGA to lash out at the messenger instead of taking responsibility for their own actions.
 
Calheel said:
Yeah, that's exactly what she should have said. In politics, flip-flopping is no longer an issue -- JD Vance proved that. Just say loudly that you don't support government funded sex change operations.

In general, I thought Kamala's biggest liability was being part of the administration. I really wanted Andy Beshear to run. But Biden made sure that wouldn't happen with whatever backroom deal he cut with Kamala. And apparently, Kamala thought that meant that she couldn't put any daylight between herself and Joe on just about any issue. In the end, I think it would have been very tough for any Democrat to convince the male Latino voters in PA, AZ and NV and the male Arab voters in MI that Democrats weren't responsible for inflation/Gaza, but Kamala's campaign strategy made that basically impossible. And not playing defense on the trans issue didn't help. You can't campaign scared.
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You seriously think some backroom deal was cut between Biden and Harris? And it didn’t leak?

Really?
 
Zoo_View said:
You seriously think some backroom deal was cut between Biden and Harris? And it didn’t leak?

Really?
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Kamala got the nod because she was the only candidate who everyone could rally around in a short period of time, and the only one who would have access to the cash. If you go with "she's the VP, she should replace him" then we could move on with the campaign. Once you open it up to other candidates, floodgates.
 
superrific said:
I don't know if we are talking about the same things. I'm not only talking about the 2024 election, but even there I don't think you're right.

There's no reason that the MAGA idiots had to back Trump. They could have stayed at home like a lot of Dem constituencies. Instead they ran to the polls with glee to smear their poop around the whole world.

Or to put it differently: if 5% of the MAGAs had any fucking common sense at all, Trump would have lost.
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I was watching the new PBS documentary on the 1898 Wilmington Coup -- the one in which our very own William Rand Kenan, Sr. played a key role with his machine gun mowing down black people on the streets of Wilmington.

The mentality of the white supremacists in Wilmington, who used force to intimidate black voters from registering in 1898 and then used force to kick the "fusionists" out of office in Wilmington a few days later, remains a central part of Southern and NC politics. There are so many parallels between what happened in 1898 and what is even happening today with the NC Supreme Court election and gerrymandering. The MAGA mentality, which is the heir to the Jim Crow mentality, believes that the country can only function when ruled by white Christians. So, it has very little to do with common sense for those people, but racial superiority.

That said, the MAGA crowd is not what decides elections. Those people aren't a majority of the electorate. It is the low information voters of every race and creed that decide elections. And if the economy is poop for the next four years, they will come racing back to the Democrats in 2026-2028, no matter what image problem HeelYeah and the NY Times think Democrats have.
 
superrific said:
Kamala got the nod because she was the only candidate who everyone could rally around in a short period of time, and the only one who would have access to the cash. If you go with "she's the VP, she should replace him" then we could move on with the campaign. Once you open it up to other candidates, floodgates.
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Anyone could have had the cash. Was Biden going to prosecute for FEC violations?
 
Zoo_View said:
You seriously think some backroom deal was cut between Biden and Harris? And it didn’t leak?

Really?
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I don't mean something written in blood. I mean a conversation and agreement.

There is no way Biden endorses Kamala right away without an understanding of how she intended to run her campaign if he stepped aside. That endorsement gave Kamala the nomination (over Nancy's and Obama's objection). And it came basically 24 hours after he stepped aside. I am sure there were talks between the two.
 
Calheel said:
I was watching the new PBS documentary on the 1898 Wilmington Coup -- the one in which our very own William Rand Kenan, Sr. played a key role with his machine gun mowing down black people on the streets of Wilmington.

The mentality of the white supremacists in Wilmington, who used force to intimidate black voters from registering in 1898 and then used force to kick the "fusionists" out of office in Wilmington a few days later, remains a central part of Southern and NC politics. There are so many parallels between what happened in 1898 and what is even happening today with the NC Supreme Court election and gerrymandering. The MAGA mentality, which is the heir to the Jim Crow mentality, believes that the country can only function when ruled by white Christians. So, it has very little to do with common sense for those people, but racial superiority.

That said, the MAGA crowd is not what decides elections. Those people aren't a majority of the electorate. It is the low information voters of every race and creed that decide elections. And if the economy is poop for the next four years, they will come racing back to the Democrats in 2026-2028, no matter what image problem HeelYeah and the NY Times think Democrats have.
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You know I agree with most of this, most especially about how it's a question of racial superiority. That's not inconsistent with lamenting the lack of common sense, but I get your point. I just don't want us to start letting MAGA off the hook, which is one possible outcome (down the road) of this way of thinking.
 
Calheel said:
Anyone could have had the cash. Was Biden going to prosecute for FEC violations?
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No, but it's harder to run against the convicted felon if you're doing felonies. And if the Dem candidate lost, prosecutions could be possible. You know this.

I think you're making a decent point but stretching a little bit in application. Obviously Biden had some input but I don't think there were any other realistic options. And if we're positing that breaking the law would be OK, what would stop Kamala from just reneging on any promise to Biden.

I think Biden wanted, more than anything, to beat Trump. Like a lot of old people, it was hard for him to accept that he wasn't the guy to do that, especially given that there were objectively valid reasons to stay with the incumbent if possible. I doubt he tried to hamstring her campaign in any way.
 
superrific said:
No, but it's harder to run against the convicted felon if you're doing felonies. And if the Dem candidate lost, prosecutions could be possible. You know this.

I think you're making a decent point but stretching a little bit in application. Obviously Biden had some input but I don't think there were any other realistic options. And if we're positing that breaking the law would be OK, what would stop Kamala from just reneging on any promise to Biden.

I think Biden wanted, more than anything, to beat Trump. Like a lot of old people, it was hard for him to accept that he wasn't the guy to do that, especially given that there were objectively valid reasons to stay with the incumbent if possible. I doubt he tried to hamstring her campaign in any way.
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At the time, the scuttlebutt was that Nancy and Barack wanted an open primary process and were very concerned about Kamala. It is possible that Biden supported Kamala as a final FU to them. But I also believe there was a discussion between the two.

I am sure books will be written about the campaign in the next year and maybe we will get the true scoop then.
 
I suspect that when the full economic costs of his insane policies hits the middle class full-force in a few months that all we'll hear from the usual suspects will be "well, I might have voted Democratic if only they had given me a choice. But they didn't and so I had to vote for Trump. So I'm not really to blame for any of this, it's really on the Democrats for not giving me an alternative!" I suspect that's how this is going to go.
 
Calheel said:
At the time, the scuttlebutt was that Nancy and Barack wanted an open primary process and were very concerned about Kamala. It is possible that Biden supported Kamala as a final FU to them. But I also believe there was a discussion between the two.

I am sure books will be written about the campaign in the next year and maybe we will get the true scoop then.
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I always figured that Biden did not want to alienate the people that brought him into office, eg Clyburn and the black (particularly female) vote. It seemed like a bit of a no-win situation. How do you NOT push forward Kamala, the acting Vice President, without insinuating she wasn’t up to the job of President? And then what does that say about either a) not supporting the black electorate or b) her being a “DEI hire?” The optics would have been pretty terrible. Basically I’m still pissed that Biden’s ego got in the way of a regular primary. I doubt he’ll ever admit to himself the colossal mistake he made. I generally like the guy but he has some significant blind spots.
 
Calheel said:
She needed to respond. Ignoring it was the worst strategy. And HY may be right that the reason Kamala didn’t respond is because she didn’t want to ruffle any feathers on the left.
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Yep - the big question everyone needs to be asking, since we know that ad was the most effective ad of the political cycle on the margins among swing voters, is this: “Why did the Democrats let that ad sink them? And why would it ruffle so many feathers on the left to denounce it?”
 
HeelYeah2012 said:
Yep - the big question everyone needs to be asking, since we know that ad was the most effective ad of the political cycle on the martins among swing voters, is this: “Why did the Democrats let that ad sink them? And why would it ruffle so many feathers on the left to denounce it?”
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Do you have so many people here on ignore that you just don’t see all of the comments answering your questions before you even ask them? I mean, this has been discussed AT LENGTH already.
 
HeelYeah2012 said:
Yep - the big question everyone needs to be asking, since we know that ad was the most effective ad of the political cycle on the martins among swing voters, is this: “Why did the Democrats let that ad sink them? And why would it ruffle so many feathers on the left to denounce it?”
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No. The big question that everyone needs to be asking is about the shit-show going on in DC. Don't try to change the subject. That ad matters not at all.

If Trump tanks the economy and launches a constitutional crisis and starts trying to invade other countries, it will not matter. It's hard to do predictions, but if Trump continues what he is doing for another year, we could be looking at 60+ Dem Senators and close to 2/3 in the House.
 
lawtig02 said:
Do you have so many people here on ignore that you just don’t see all of the comments answering your questions before you even ask them? I mean, this has been discussed AT LENGTH already.
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I don’t have anyone on ignore but I definitely scroll past certain posters and focus more on the ones I know typically engage with me in good faith. Calheel and I hardly ever agree on things but we do have mostly respectful dialogue.

And since Calheel agrees with me here, I’m more concerned with giving him a response (to further our alignment on this and push that convo forward) than I am with reading every single response on the whole thread.
 
lawtig02 said:
Do you have so many people here on ignore that you just don’t see all of the comments answering your questions before you even ask them? I mean, this has been discussed AT LENGTH already.
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He appears obsessed with the transgender issue, that's for sure.
 
superrific said:
No. The big question that everyone needs to be asking is about the shit-show going on in DC. Don't try to change the subject. That ad matters not at all.

If Trump tanks the economy and launches a constitutional crisis and starts trying to invade other countries, it will not matter. It's hard to do predictions, but if Trump continues what he is doing for another year, we could be looking at 60+ Dem Senators and close to 2/3 in the House.
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If Trump really does stuff between now and the midterms that is so bad it results in 60 Dem senators in 2026, it’ll be fine with me if the power flips. That’s the way our system is designed to work. I am not nearly as concerned with the Republicans keeping the power as you probably think I am. I dislike both parties, but just happen to dislike Democrats more.

I also happen to enjoy it in general when the power is split, so that the two parties are either forced to compromise or we just get status quo. Especially in NC, which has been thriving under the leadership of a blue governor + red legislature now for years.

I know y’all always think I’m lying or whatever but I say this win or lose: I don’t care that much who wins. I do enjoy following the elections and debating the issues. And I’m particularly fascinated by this place because it’s such an echo chamber, basically 100 posters who all hate Trump. I do think most people here are a little heavy on the TDS, but I also know the average person here is smart so I enjoy staying connected here to see what the left is saying, as I’ve explained 100 times in the past.

But I don’t look to either party to make my life better and I generally think politicians almost always get in the way more than they help anything. I vote for what I think is best for our collective future but I also know that most people I encounter in daily life are good, people on both sides of the aisle.
 
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