Tyreek Hill and Scottie Scheffler

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2ManyBlueCups said:
It is also 100% relevant to this discussion that cops are shot, shot at, or killed on traffic stops with startling frequency in this country, and being an asshole, not following instructions and attempting to hide behind darkly tinted windows is going to put a cop on edge and escalate a situation further than it has to be.
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Aren't you the guy who said kids shouldn't worry about school shootings because it's extremely unlikely they will be a victim of one? What percentage of traffic stops do you think result in cops being shot at or killed? I mean if you are being consistent.

Look, I appreciate police officers and they have to put up with some stupid crap in their job, but that's part of the responsibility of being a cop. De-escalation needs to be part and parcel of the job. And nobody can seriously believe this cop felt scared in this situation. This was 100% about him feeling disrespected and wanting to show that he has authority.
 
2ManyBlueCups said:
It is also 100% relevant to this discussion that cops are shot, shot at, or killed on traffic stops with startling frequency in this country, and being an asshole, not following instructions and attempting to hide behind darkly tinted windows is going to put a cop on edge and escalate a situation further than it has to be.
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If the cop is scared he should go back to his car and run the paperwork.
2ManyBlueCups said:
The goalposts have moved completely. First it was "look at them hitting him." Then it was "look at them kicking him". Then it was "well they actually didn't do any of that but they yelled at him."

Hill's mistake was thinking that because he is famous and wealthy that he gets to control the situation. "Don't tell me what to do." Yeah, that's not a line you can use on a cop when you just committed a crime.

Take the ticket and move on with your day.
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Nope.

Regardless of whether he was kicked the cops actions were excessive and unnecessary. You’re getting hung up on the kick, not getting kicked doesn’t equal not getting handled inappropriately.
 
2ManyBlueCups said:
It is also 100% relevant to this discussion that cops are shot, shot at, or killed on traffic stops with startling frequency in this country, and being an asshole, not following instructions and attempting to hide behind darkly tinted windows is going to put a cop on edge and escalate a situation further than it has to be.
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The cops knew this was Tyreek Hill. Before meathead even approached the car one of the other officers called out to him “It’s Tyreek Hill.” Tyreek Hill is not going to shoot a cop on his way to play in an NFL game. They knew there was no personal danger to themselves. They’re just meatheads who get their jollies off on pushing around civilians.
 
Enigma94 said:
Aren't you the guy who said kids shouldn't worry about school shootings because it's extremely unlikely they will be a victim of one? What percentage of traffic stops do you think results in cops being shot at or killed? I mean if you are being consistent.

Look, I appreciate police officers and they have to put up with some stupid crap in their job, but that's part of the responsibility of being a cop. De-escalation needs to be part and parcel of the job. And nobody can seriously believe this cop felt scared in this situation. This was 100% about him feeling disrespected and wanting to show that he has authority.
Click to expand...

My argument there and now was to acknowledge risk but to place it in context, take the appropriate precautions, and move on. Appropriate precautions for someone who is refusing to cooperate on a traffic stop and hiding behind dark tinted windows would be to get him out of the car, which they did. If you don't want to end up on the ground, don't disregard lawful orders and don't be a dick to the cops when they catch you committing a crime.
 
Enigma94 said:
Explain why the officer needed the window down after he got the documents and all that was left to do was write the ticket. If you say safety you are full of shit
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It does not matter why or if the officer "needed" to ask Hill to put his window down, he asked him to do so while Hill was being detained. Hill was required to comply while detained. Again, the officer had every right under the law to go as far as making Hill get out of his car and go stand on the sidewalk or in a police cruiser. No "why" has to be used or justified. Asking him to roll down the window waa far less intrusive, and Hill had to comply.

I imagine almost all of the most dangerous and threatening stops begin with exactly this type of disrespect, non-compliance, and baiting by the accused.

Bur I think more video will show these cops were way too amped up and went to far, especially after he was restrained. The video part put out already shows the start of that after he was cuffed, and how they treated teammates arriving at the scene.

But this is not a Hill a want to die on. I watched most of the Floyd trial very closely, and wanted that cop to be found guilty and face the toughest sentence possible. I recorded and watched most of the black teen jogger in Georgia, that walked into a house be8ng built. Vigilanty redneck racists hunted him down and shot him. I wanted those guys guilty and locked up, they were. There are so many more that never get caught because there is no cell footage or national attention, and they get away with it. It is shameful.

But I do not want cops to he stripped of their rights to perform their jobs under the law. And they did so at first when a detained Hill did not comply as he is required to do under the law. Beyond that I am not defending anything the cops did. So I will not keep repeating myself and the actual law (facts).

As has been said on this board many, many times, you can not argue against facts with feelings.
 
Bigs23 said:
If the cop is scared he should go back to his car and run the paperwork.

Nope.

Regardless of whether he was kicked the cops actions were excessive and unnecessary. You’re getting hung up on the kick, not getting kicked doesn’t equal not getting handled inappropriately.
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That's not how this works. Hill isn't in charge of the traffic stop. The police are. Being rich doesn't mean that you just get to tell the cops what to do....or, it shouldn't mean that.
 
UNCBAdookJD said:
The cops knew this was Tyreek Hill. Before meathead even approached the car one of the other officers called out to him “It’s Tyreek Hill.” Tyreek Hill is not going to shoot a cop on his way to play in an NFL game. They knew there was no personal danger to themselves. They’re just meatheads who get their jollies off on pushing around civilians.
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Yeah, NFL players would never harm anyone. Just look at Aaron Hernandez. And it isn't like there have been multiple allegations of violent behavior at Hill against women and children over the years or anything....
 
2ManyBlueCups said:
That's not how this works. Hill isn't in charge of the traffic stop. The police are. Being rich doesn't mean that you just get to tell the cops what to do....or, it shouldn't mean that.
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They had what they needed.
Do your job and keep it moving.

You are the ultimate apologist.
 
2ManyBlueCups said:
My argument there and now was to acknowledge risk but to place it in context, take the appropriate precautions, and move on. Appropriate precautions for someone who is refusing to cooperate on a traffic stop and hiding behind dark tinted windows would be to get him out of the car, which they did. If you don't want to end up on the ground, don't disregard lawful orders and don't be a dick to the cops when they catch you committing a crime.
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Sure Hill shouldn't be a dick, but that doesn't give the cop the right to escalate the situation resulting in a physical confrontation and handcuffs. And gtfo with committing a crime. It's a traffic violation. You keep insinuating that the cop was scared of this situation - do you actually believe he was in fear of being shot?
 
Enigma94 said:
Sure Hill shouldn't be a dick, but that doesn't give the cop the right to escalate the situation resulting in a physical confrontation and handcuffs. And gtfo with committing a crime. It's a traffic violation. You keep insinuating that the cop was scared of this situation - do you actually believe he was in fear of being shot?
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I think bo was scared for him.
 
Enigma94 said:
Sure Hill shouldn't be a dick, but that doesn't give the cop the right to escalate the situation resulting in a physical confrontation and handcuffs. And gtfo with committing a crime. It's a traffic violation. You keep insinuating that the cop was scared of this situation - do you actually believe he was in fear of being shot?
Click to expand...

I think the cop was following standard protocol for a traffic stop in which the driver refuses to comply with lawful instructions and hides behind darkly tinted windows, which would be getting the driver out of the car and in plain sight. Could he have given Hill more time to get out of the car? Sure. Would Hill have actually gotten out of the car? Guess we'll never know.
 
Kraftyheel89 said:
It does not matter why or if the officer "needed" to ask Hill to put his window down, he asked him to do so while Hill was being detained. Hill was required to comply while detained. Again, the officer had every right under the law to go as far as making Hill get out of his car and go stand on the sidewalk or in a police cruiser. No "why" has to be used or justified. Asking him to roll down the window waa far less intrusive, and Hill had to comply.

I imagine almost all of the most dangerous and threatening stops begin with exactly this type of disrespect, non-compliance, and baiting by the accused.

Bur I think more video will show these cops were way too amped up and went to far, especially after he was restrained. The video part put out already shows the start of that after he was cuffed, and how they treated teammates arriving at the scene.

But this is not a Hill a want to die on. I watched most of the Floyd trial very closely, and wanted that cop to be found guilty and face the toughest sentence possible. I recorded and watched most of the black teen jogger in Georgia, that walked into a house be8ng built. Vigilanty redneck racists hunted him down and shot him. I wanted those guys guilty and locked up, they were. There are so many more that never get caught because there is no cell footage or national attention, and they get away with it. It is shameful.

But I do not want cops to he stripped of their rights to perform their jobs under the law. And they did so at first when a detained Hill did not comply as he is required to do under the law. Beyond that I am not defending anything the cops did. So I will not keep repeating myself and the actual law (facts).

As has been said on this board many, many times, you can not argue against facts with feelings.
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There does need to be a reason for him to require Hill to do more than provide his documentation. And the fact that he felt disrespected isn't one. I certainly agree that Hill was a dick and I don't exactly feel sorry for him, but an officer with that attitude is just asking for trouble. i mean if you think the cop was legitimately scared for his life so he felt it was needed to have the window down just say so. I think that's ludicrous but whatever.
 
2ManyBlueCups said:
Did they have what they needed? What if Hill had a dead body in the passenger seat?
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what a ridiculous hypothetical for this scenario. Dude is an NFL star driving a $400,000 car in the parking lot of an NFL stadium. He had rolled his window down and provided required documentation. If the cops wanted to see if he had a dead body in the car that was their chance. A routine traffic stop is not an invitation or even probable cause to search the vehicle.
 
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