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UNC ONLY BASKETBALL 2024-25 SEASON

  • Thread starter Thread starter nycfan
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  • UNC Sports 
In my lifetime I can only remember one other game against dook where I felt we had no chance. This sort of sucks. Especially with all that's going wrong in the world.
 
I don’t know anything but I feel like it’s split. The ones ready to move on are people who didn’t like the hire in the first place(me included). I think he gets another year. After the Clemson game the schedule eases up again until the second dook game. State, UVa, Miami at home and VT, FSU on the road. I would’ve said two weeks ago we shouldn’t lose to any of those teams. But this team feels like it is starting to possibly spiral so nothing would surprise me.
 
I feel like if UNC decides to keep Coach Davis hiring a top notch GM for the basketball program is a must - and perhaps requiring an upgrade among the assistant coaches?
 
GoHeelsweeeehoooo said:
I feel like if UNC decides to keep Coach Davis hiring a top notch GM for the basketball program is a must - and perhaps requiring an upgrade among the assistant coaches?
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I think people see the GM idea and equate it with the way that role functions in the NBA or NFL.

Yes, UNC having a GM would definitely help with the administrative side of things in terms of working out NIL details and making up lost ground on that front. It would also probably help with scouting. At the end of the day at the college level though, all of the personnel evaluations and decisions run through the head coach. If Hubert struggles with roster construction now, hiring a GM isn’t a silver bullet fix for that.
 
Peppers49 said:
I think people see the GM idea and equate it with the way that role functions in the NBA or NFL.

Yes, UNC having a GM would definitely help with the administrative side of things in terms of working out NIL details and making up lost ground on that front. It would also probably help with scouting. At the end of the day at the college level though, all of the personnel evaluations and decisions run through the head coach. If Hubert struggles with roster construction now, hiring a GM isn’t a silver bullet fix for that.
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This is a good point, but there can still be a use for a GM. First, as you say, organizing the NIL expenses. Planning for the future. Things that coaches aren't good at and don't have time for.

The second thing a GM can do is help assess players. It doesn't have to be the case that all evaluations run through the head coach. If we had a GM, maybe the GM says, "I don't think Cade Tyson is that good. Maybe we shouldn't break the bank for him, and if we miss because someone else wants to overpay, I'm OK with that."

I don't know. Your point is good but that doesn't mean the GM position has to be useless. I say this as someone with no ideas how front offices and coaching staffs work together in pro leagues, and no idea as to how it might work on the college level.
 
superrific said:
This is a good point, but there can still be a use for a GM. First, as you say, organizing the NIL expenses. Planning for the future. Things that coaches aren't good at and don't have time for.

The second thing a GM can do is help assess players. It doesn't have to be the case that all evaluations run through the head coach. If we had a GM, maybe the GM says, "I don't think Cade Tyson is that good. Maybe we shouldn't break the bank for him, and if we miss because someone else wants to overpay, I'm OK with that."

I don't know. Your point is good but that doesn't mean the GM position has to be useless. I say this as someone with no ideas how front offices and coaching staffs work together in pro leagues, and no idea as to how it might work on the college level.
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The GMs/personnel departments at the pro level are usually pretty separated from the HC/coaching staff, have the ultimate authority when it comes to personnel decisions, and they outrank the coaching staff in the organizational hierarchy (there are exceptions). Colleges have started to improve and build out their personnel departments to help with roster construction in the NIL/transfer portal era, but the HCs at that level are still essentially the CEOs that have full autonomy over the roster.

Don’t get me wrong, I definitely think UNC needs a GM (and probably multiple people to support that person in a new personnel department within the program) regardless of who the coach is next season. I just don’t think that it’s a silver bullet that will fix our roster issues overnight.
 
What kind of GM can we get with a coach who is looking at a make or break year? Is anyone who is actually in demand going to sign up for a job that could be gone in one year unless the team has a good season? Maybe the GM is separate from the coaching decisions and they could stay on even if Davis is fired, but I would think any new coach is going to want input into who his GM might be.
 
If a guy like Mitch Kupchak were the GM, I'm sure he'd have some good insights on personnel and roster construction, and I'd bet Coach Davis would want to work together with him on that.
 
TarSpiel said:
If a guy like Mitch Kupchak were the GM, I'm sure he'd have some good insights on personnel and roster construction, and I'd bet Coach Davis would want to work together with him on that.
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He didn’t seem to “have some good insights on personnel and roster construction” during his tenure with the Hornets. The Lakers got rid of Mitch for a reason.
 
You know guys, KY has 2 7 Ft Graduate student centers.

This is probably the most puzzling thing to me. It's the why behind us not getting a center. Was it because HD over shot on J Wash? Was it NIL? I mean everyone in the country felt that we needed a center and the player would get playing time from the start of the season. So what was it?

If it is poor talent evaluation, that's a hit on the coaching staff. If it was money, then we are in trouble no matter who the coach is.

By the way, next year is going to be a test for KY.
This year they have:
3- Freshman
1- Sophmores
3- Juniors
1- Seniors
5-grad students
1- Fifth year.

So, 7 players are guaranteed to be gone. And only 1 returning player is over 6'5".

This also means that we will be completing with them for big men, as we will with every other team in the country.
 
… the bit about getting new Asst.coaches
Maybe get a GM and a boat load of NIL money; keep the coach - but only if he fires some assistants and gets new ones.
Or fire Davis too, who knows?

He’s certainly on a hot seat… and on a fence in terms of track record. 1.5 good seasons and the rest total crapola.

The remainder of this season tells us which side of the fence he will fall. If he falls on the wrong side, in that hot seat, he’s probably a goner.

If he can eek out some wins or luck up in the ACCT and make the dance, and thereby fall on the good side of that fence, he stands a chance to hang around, but the PTB need to go to him and demand he shakes some things up. Axe a couple of coaches…

I can see some folks not wanting to fire the coach of the year last year and only one season away from 29-8 and an ACCReg championship
 
Centerpiece said:
… the bit about getting new Asst.coaches
Maybe get a GM and a boat load of NIL money; keep the coach - but only if he fires some assistants and gets new ones.
Or fire Davis too, who knows?

He’s certainly on a hot seat… and on a fence in terms of track record. 1.5 good seasons and the rest total crapola.

The remainder of this season tells us which side of the fence he will fall. If he falls on the wrong side, in that hot seat, he’s probably a goner.

If he can eek out some wins or luck up in the ACCT and make the dance, and thereby fall on the good side of that fence, he stands a chance to hang around, but the PTB need to go to him and demand he shakes some things up. Axe a couple of coaches…

I can see some folks not wanting to fire the coach of the year last year and only one season away from 29-8 and an ACCReg championship
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His first season wasn't even a good one for half the season. It was good for 4 weeks, and only because Manek got hot and Caleb Love was hitting some ridiculous shots. They were on the bubble before they beat dook at Cameron. The offense they were running is still the same one they have now relying on 3s and mostly 1 on 1 shots off the dribble.
 
UNCatTech said:
This is probably the most puzzling thing to me. It's the why behind us not getting a center. Was it because HD over shot on J Wash? Was it NIL? I mean everyone in the country felt that we needed a center and the player would get playing time from the start of the season. So what was it?

If it is poor talent evaluation, that's a hit on the coaching staff. If it was money, then we are in trouble no matter who the coach is.
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I don't think anyone has a real answer for "why we didn't get a quality center" in this off-season.

Here's what we know about players in the transfer portal, they're looking to get (a) paid via NIL, (b) playing time, (c) featured for the NBA, and (d) a team that can have success. I won't say in what order most players are seeking these 4 things or that every player is even seeking all four. The most we can surmise is that none of the top-quality centers (or even inside-heavy PFs) chose Carolina and likely due to some combination of these reasons.

The reasons that players may have chosen other programs...

1) NIL deals elsewhere were better
2) Didn't like Hubert in off-the-court manner
3) Didn't believe Carolina was likely to have team success this season
4) Believe that Hubert's offense or defense doesn't feature bigs enough
5) Didn't believe that Hubert is a coach to help them improve for NBA
6) Didn't believe there was sufficient (guaranteed) playing time
7) Didn't believe they would get featured enough vis-a-vis other bigs
8) Afraid that a transfer big at Carolina would get placed in the post and not be able to show outside skills
9) Players entering the portal had already agreed to attend other schools and weren't really available.

I've heard nothing to suggest that 2 is the issue. Everything I've ever hard about Hubert as a person is that people love him. So we can likely exclude that one.

Given that we started the season as a ranked team without a inside-heavy big, it's also hard to imagine that 3 was the issue.

1 is certainly the perspective of the basketball program. We know that Hubert spoke about NIL in a meeting in October and we've certainly heard from former players that they believe NIL caused us not to get the players they wanted. IC has reported that we've been competitive in NIL in many recruitments, but no one really seems to know for sure the exact details here.

The last 6 are possibilities, but no one really knows across all potential transfers. 9 is likely true for some of the players, but unlikely true for all the guys we pursued. We don't know what kind of guarantees Hubert was willing to make regarding playing time, but we know that Roy wouldn't make guarantees and so we can perhaps surmise that Hubert doesn't? We also don't know how much of an impact Washington and Withers being on the roster might have made, perhaps players were concerned they'd wouldn't get as much playing time as they wanted or wouldn't be featured the way they wanted or would be given a role they didn't exactly want?

Unless you can get someone close to the players who didn't come to Carolina to speak candidly, I don't know if we'll ever know. And, sadly, not knowing leads to a lot of different opinions and different strategies to solve the problems going forward.
 
TarSpiel said:
If a guy like Mitch Kupchak were the GM, I'm sure he'd have some good insights on personnel and roster construction, and I'd bet Coach Davis would want to work together with him on that.
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Kupchak was a great GM back in the day with the Lakers, but his best days are behind him. I think he's not well suited for this modern era of NIL. Think he can be valuable as an adviser to the process.
 
SnoopRob said:
I don't think anyone has a real answer for "why we didn't get a quality center" in this off-season.

Here's what we know about players in the transfer portal, they're looking to get (a) paid via NIL, (b) playing time, (c) featured for the NBA, and (d) a team that can have success. I won't say in what order most players are seeking these 4 things or that every player is even seeking all four. The most we can surmise is that none of the top-quality centers (or even inside-heavy PFs) chose Carolina and likely due to some combination of these reasons.

The reasons that players may have chosen other programs...

1) NIL deals elsewhere were better
2) Didn't like Hubert in off-the-court manner
3) Didn't believe Carolina was likely to have team success this season
4) Believe that Hubert's offense or defense doesn't feature bigs enough
5) Didn't believe that Hubert is a coach to help them improve for NBA
6) Didn't believe there was sufficient (guaranteed) playing time
7) Didn't believe they would get featured enough vis-a-vis other bigs
8) Afraid that a transfer big at Carolina would get placed in the post and not be able to show outside skills
9) Players entering the portal had already agreed to attend other schools and weren't really available.

I've heard nothing to suggest that 2 is the issue. Everything I've ever hard about Hubert as a person is that people love him. So we can likely exclude that one.

Given that we started the season as a ranked team without a inside-heavy big, it's also hard to imagine that 3 was the issue.

1 is certainly the perspective of the basketball program. We know that Hubert spoke about NIL in a meeting in October and we've certainly heard from former players that they believe NIL caused us not to get the players they wanted. IC has reported that we've been competitive in NIL in many recruitments, but no one really seems to know for sure the exact details here.

The last 6 are possibilities, but no one really knows across all potential transfers. 9 is likely true for some of the players, but unlikely true for all the guys we pursued. We don't know what kind of guarantees Hubert was willing to make regarding playing time, but we know that Roy wouldn't make guarantees and so we can perhaps surmise that Hubert doesn't? We also don't know how much of an impact Washington and Withers being on the roster might have made, perhaps players were concerned they'd wouldn't get as much playing time as they wanted or wouldn't be featured the way they wanted or would be given a role they didn't exactly want?

Unless you can get someone close to the players who didn't come to Carolina to speak candidly, I don't know if we'll ever know. And, sadly, not knowing leads to a lot of different opinions and different strategies to solve the problems going forward.
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Have heard some people in recruiting circles speculate about #2. More than likability, there is a feeling that he relates well to certain type of recruits/families (been suggested families strong in the faith). Don't know how much stock to put in that.
 
farce© said:
He didn’t seem to “have some good insights on personnel and roster construction” during his tenure with the Hornets. The Lakers got rid of Mitch for a reason.
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I disagree. I think Mitch did a good job with the draft picks he had to work with. Luring a quality free agent to Charlotte is a daunting task. I can’t get on him for that. But he did do a lot to improve the Hornets roster. One of the problems has been that they have struggled to stay healthy and/or to not commit acts of domestic violence.
 
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