Harris/Walz Catch-All | Kamala blitz in closing stretch

[bridgetender]

There are some Democratic positions/policies that, I believe, drive people to Trump. One good example is the perception/fact that some Democrats are soft on crime. Some things are made up by the Right. The claim that the mobs robbing jewelry stores in California are doing so without consequence. That's simply not true, but the Right-wing media has implied that it is. Other things are true. NY's policy of "catch and release" has resulted in suspects/criminals committing more crimes. Police stood by, in at least one Democrat run city, while rioters looted businesses during the George Floyd riots. The Minneapolis City Council President saying that a fear of not being able to call the police, when someone is breaking into your house, "comes from a place of privilege". Just my opinion, but that last position, that being able to call police for help when your home is being broken into, is the beginning of where the Democratic Party goes to die.

It's a ridiculous viewpoint, especially when you realize that Republicans nominated a convicted felon and insurrectionist as their presidential nominee. Republicans being the party of law and order is just talk and wishful thinking by conservative media.

 

[ZenMode]

1. It wasn't just me. Basically nobody agreed with you. So you had to invent a political angle to explain why everyone else was wrong.
2. That particular discussion is a tiny subset of things about which you are wrong.

Well, no shit! The people who didn't agree with me were a) liberal and b) often making an emotional argument because it's "mean" to refer to homosexuals as abnormal.

 

[superrific]

Well, no shit! The people who didn't agree with me were a) liberal and b) often making an emotional argument because it's "mean" to refer to homosexuals as abnormal.

As I said, you had to invent a political angle. And that's why our country is such a mess. Because millions of people like you think that grievance is an acceptable substitute for knowledge. Sometime in Obama's presidency, that became normalized.

 

[ChileG]

Do I believe that the things you mentioned are why people voted for Trump? No, I don't, and given what we know about Trump (and knew as early as 2016) it does not justify voting for Trump over Hillary. You can argue that the crime issue somehow made the difference for Trump, my argument is that those people would have voted for Trump anyway, and if not for the "soft on crime" issue they would simply have found another reason to vote for him. And that doesn't explain how Democrats are responsible for Trump's election. The people who are responsible for Trump's election are Republican voters for nominating him and then voting for him, twice. It's not the Democratic Party's fault that Trump was elected in 2016, or that he nearly won again four years later.

Kamala’s a Marxist! Kamala controls hurricane’s! Kamala caused inflation! Kamala wants open borders so immigrants can eat your pets! Democrats eat babies and drink their blood!
But yeah, people will vote for a criminal over a former DA because democrats are soft on crime. Sure.

 

[mynameisbond]

I wholly disagree with this. I think it's very important we not make cartoon characters out of a group of people, that's an early step in dehumanizing them.

I would say they think that Trump cares about them more than Dems care about them. Trump has clearly heard them and what they are seeking from the government. And he promises them those things. You and I know he's full of shit with the vast majority of those promises, but in their mind it's better than nothing. He also followed through on some of those promises...such as appointing SCOTUS justices to overturn RvW, taking drastic steps at the border, trying to keep the folks they want to be second-class citizens as second-class citizens, and enacting tariffs to protect American manufacturing. While not nearly enough to make a difference in their day-to-day lives, it is more than they feel the Dems offer them.

The other thing that Trump does better than Dems or other Pubs is making MAGA folks feel special. He continually points to them as "Real Americans" and holds them up as the "best" or "true" part of America. Now, these folks aren't so stupid that they don't realize that things aren't going their way. They know that many of their communities aren't doing well and that a lot of rural red areas aren't thriving. But Trump not only tells them it's not their fault, but that they shouldn't have to do anything to address these issues. He tells them that America owes them and that the country should be the one to fix the issues facing their areas. You and I know that there is almost no chance of this happening on a grand scale, but they respond to it by preferring Trump's promises to other potential solutions.

That is a fair and accurate summary of the MAGA movement as a whole, IMHO. Trump gives the illusion of being a champion of the little guy. Someone who cares about protecting citizens from the "deep state", elitists, intellectuals, the media, and other people who perceive the world differently than them. He gives them scapegoats for all of the perceived ills and unfairness they hold dear, and hearkens them back to an idyllic yesteryear that never existed. A time when the USA was free from racial unrest, high crime, inflation, unwanted immigrants, scientific warnings of climate change, dependence on imported oil, and all manner of other worries. He's a populist entertainer who will say whatever his audience wants to hear, without regard to truth or logic.

 

[finesse]

Not exactly. I am liberal but you're using a term much more typically used in a clinical setting to describe a trait or condition than a person. You do it in framework where your dualistic view driven by your superstitions suggest that something is wrong inherently when you have repeatedly failed to make that case. You conflate biology with emotion , including making the asinine statement that gays are abnormal because they don't breed when they can and do.

 

[ZenMode]

I do think those things have something to do with the rise of Trump.

As Dems worked to address additional types of discrimination against and marginalization of minority groups in the US, Republicans chose to double down on bigotry and chose a very public bigot for their standard bearer.

But as I said, the Dems did nothing to make the Pubs choose that path and to double down on the worst of their bigotries was a choice Pubs completely own.

There's so much to talk about when talking about the rise of Trump. It would take 100 pages to cover it all. Social media played a big role, but I'm not going to get into that.

In general, I think people saw things happening that scared them. If you were concerned about illegal border crossings, you're a labeled a racist. If you are against affirmative action, you're a racist. As part of wokeness, people were losing their jobs for what was essentially thought crimes or because they were white and dressed up as a black celebrity 20 years ago. There were censorship and free speech concerns and there was no faith in the current Republican party or it's politicians to address the issue. We had just come off of the Romney/Obama election... two guys who were, politically, about as close to being the same as any two politicians ever in the Presidential race.

Along come Trump. He doesn't talk like politicians. He talks like "we" talk. He doesn't sugar coat it. He talks straight about the things that worry people.... and so it began.

In the eyes of Republican, and many undecided voters, things haven't gotten any better. Wokeness and cancel culture are largely gone, but in its place is drag queen story hour, DEI, people losing their jobs for saying "all lives matter", cops standing by while businesses are looted. Minnesota politicians calling it a "priviledge" to be able to call the police for help when their house is being robbed and calling or the complete elemination of police. CNN broadcasters standing in front of burning buildings saying idiotic things like "It's a fiery but otherwise peaceful protest". In some cases, people being fired from their job because of something their spouse posted on line. Then there's the lie of a stolen election that consumed the country. Now, you have the economy and inflation and gas prices combined with a very, IMO, underwhelming Kamala Harris.

Again, there's a significant underlying social media influence here.

 

[finesse]

There's so much to talk about when talking about the rise of Trump. It would take 100 pages to cover it all. Social media played a big role, but I'm not going to get into that.

In general, I think people saw things happening that scared them. If you were concerned about illegal border crossings, you're a labeled a racist. If you are against affirmative action, you're a racist. As part of wokeness, people were losing their jobs for what was essentially thought crimes or because they were white and dressed up as a black celebrity 20 years ago. There were censorship and free speech concerns and there was no faith in the current Republican party or it's politicians to address the issue. We had just come off of the Romney/Obama election... two guys who were, politically, about as close to being the same as any two politicians ever in the Presidential race.

Along come Trump. He doesn't talk like politicians. He talks like "we" talk. He doesn't sugar coat it. He talks straight about the things that worry people.... and so it began.

In the eyes of Republican, and many undecided voters, things haven't gotten any better. Wokeness and cancel culture are largely gone, but in its place is drag queen story hour, DEI, people losing their jobs for saying "all lives matter", cops standing by while businesses are looted. Minnesota politicians calling it a "priviledge" to be able to call the police for help when their house is being robbed and calling or the complete elemination of police. CNN broadcasters standing in front of burning buildings saying idiotic things like "It's a fiery but otherwise peaceful protest". In some cases, people being fired from their job because of something their spouse posted on line. Then there's the lie of a stolen election that consumed the country. Now, you have the economy and inflation and gas prices combined with a very, IMO, underwhelming Kamala Harris.

Again, there's a significant underlying social media influence here.

So how do you think Republicans will handle it when they discover that all their worries were a pack of lies and that they sold their birthright for a metaphorical bowl of porridge?

 

[05C40]

To the extent that this has already been covered, I apologize. But, I have to believe that given how long Tim Walz was a public school teacher, the RNC, the Trump organization, or entities working at their behest have searched high and low for some student with a grudge against Tim Walz to make an allegation that Tim Walz was somehow sexually inappropriate with him or her. But given how sketchy such an allegation would probably be, I would guess that "Today's GOP" is holding it until there is not enough time to vet or refute it.

 

[UNCatTech]

No...

No, there is no possible way the party of free speech would demand censorship. This cannot be true.

 

[superrific]

If you were concerned about illegal border crossings, you're a labeled a racist.

That's probably because it is almost definitionally racist. Migrants don't harm the country. Scapegoating brown people for ills they have nothing to do with is racism. Full stop.

There is no reasonable argument that "the border" is among the policies that most affect Americans' lives. And yet MAGAs consider it the #1 priority. Hmm. I wonder why? And no issue attracts quite so many lies, and such despicable ones, as this precisely because the entire commotion is invented.

Climate change does way, way, way more damage to Americans than migrants. And yet MAGAs aren't interested in it. They deny it even exists. Gee, I wonder why. Education quality hurts Americans way, way, way more than migrants. And yet. Corporate consolidation? Way more harmful. Crypto? Way more harmful. And yet.

Sam Bankman-Fried, Robert Allen Stanford and Bernie Madoff cost Americans more than migrants do. The financial crisis of 2008 was orders of magnitude more destructive. So are hurricanes. And yet the focus is on the poor brown people. I'm sorry, but that's almost definitionally racist. And Trump's claims about "bad genes" ARE definitionally racist and yet nobody from Team Red dares step forward to say anything.

See, the problem here is that conservatives aren't nearly as good as they think they are at hiding their racial animus. Liberals see it. Then conservatives get angry that they are exposed and MAGA is the result. At this point, MAGA is little more than ritualized anger and resentment. Liberals didn't do that. No liberal policy did that. It's on the GOP.

 

[EyeballKid]

There's so much to talk about when talking about the rise of Trump. It would take 100 pages to cover it all. Social media played a big role, but I'm not going to get into that.

In general, I think people saw things happening that scared them. If you were concerned about illegal border crossings, you're a labeled a racist. If you are against affirmative action, you're a racist. As part of wokeness, people were losing their jobs for what was essentially thought crimes or because they were white and dressed up as a black celebrity 20 years ago. There were censorship and free speech concerns and there was no faith in the current Republican party or it's politicians to address the issue. We had just come off of the Romney/Obama election... two guys who were, politically, about as close to being the same as any two politicians ever in the Presidential race.

Along come Trump. He doesn't talk like politicians. He talks like "we" talk. He doesn't sugar coat it. He talks straight about the things that worry people.... and so it began.

In the eyes of Republican, and many undecided voters, things haven't gotten any better. Wokeness and cancel culture are largely gone, but in its place is drag queen story hour, DEI, people losing their jobs for saying "all lives matter", cops standing by while businesses are looted. Minnesota politicians calling it a "priviledge" to be able to call the police for help when their house is being robbed and calling or the complete elemination of police. CNN broadcasters standing in front of burning buildings saying idiotic things like "It's a fiery but otherwise peaceful protest". In some cases, people being fired from their job because of something their spouse posted on line. Then there's the lie of a stolen election that consumed the country. Now, you have the economy and inflation and gas prices combined with a very, IMO, underwhelming Kamala Harris.

Again, there's a significant underlying social media influence here.

This is such a load of horseshit.

As I attempted to explain WRT your initial crappy example of liberals supposedly being “weak on crime”…all of these things—immigration, race relations/racism, taxes, abortion, etc—are vastly complex issues.

The Republican platform has long appealed to the portion of Americans who lack critical thinking skills and view the world in black-and-white rather than shades of gray. Trumpism is simply the most potent distillation of that platform.

—America = good. Flag = America. Bible = America. Republicans = America.

—Democrats = bad. Democrats = UnAmerican. Democrats = Marxist/commie. Democrats = satanic cult that eats babies.

—lgbtq people = unnatural, unworthy, sick, bad.

—immigrants = dangerous, dirty, criminal, job-takers, freeloaders.

You’re trying so damn hard to blame Dems for the longstanding moral failures and lack of critical thinking skills of Republican leaders and voters that inevitably led to Trumpism.

 

[UNCatTech]

To the extent that this has already been covered, I apologize. But, I have to believe that given how long Tim Walz was a public school teacher, the RNC, the Trump organization, or entities working at their behest have searched high and low for some student with a grudge against Tim Walz to make an allegation that Tim Walz was somehow sexually inappropriate with him or her. But given how sketchy such an allegation would probably be, I would guess that "Today's GOP" is holding it until there is not enough time to vet or refute it.

Or, maybe he's so squeaky clean that they gave up looking and hope that not recalling an exact date, 35 years ago, of his trip to China.

 

[lightbluenc]

There's so much to talk about when talking about the rise of Trump. It would take 100 pages to cover it all. Social media played a big role, but I'm not going to get into that.

In general, I think people saw things happening that scared them. If you were concerned about illegal border crossings, you're a labeled a racist. If you are against affirmative action, you're a racist. As part of wokeness, people were losing their jobs for what was essentially thought crimes or because they were white and dressed up as a black celebrity 20 years ago. There were censorship and free speech concerns and there was no faith in the current Republican party or it's politicians to address the issue. We had just come off of the Romney/Obama election... two guys who were, politically, about as close to being the same as any two politicians ever in the Presidential race.

Along come Trump. He doesn't talk like politicians. He talks like "we" talk. He doesn't sugar coat it. He talks straight about the things that worry people.... and so it began.

In the eyes of Republican, and many undecided voters, things haven't gotten any better. Wokeness and cancel culture are largely gone, but in its place is drag queen story hour, DEI, people losing their jobs for saying "all lives matter", cops standing by while businesses are looted. Minnesota politicians calling it a "priviledge" to be able to call the police for help when their house is being robbed and calling or the complete elemination of police. CNN broadcasters standing in front of burning buildings saying idiotic things like "It's a fiery but otherwise peaceful protest". In some cases, people being fired from their job because of something their spouse posted on line. Then there's the lie of a stolen election that consumed the country. Now, you have the economy and inflation and gas prices combined with a very, IMO, underwhelming Kamala Harris.

Again, there's a significant underlying social media influence here.

So how do republicans "fix":
- drag queen story hour (a business can have whatever story time it wants - how the hell is this even an issue? No one cares)
- DEI (a business can hire whoever it wants)
- people losing their jobs for saying "all lives matter" (a business can fire whoever it wants)
- people being fired from their job because of something their spouse posted on line (a business can fire whoever it wants)

These are all things that private businesses control. So do these Republicans want to not allow private business to make their own decisions or should the government decide what they can or cant do?

 

[superrific]

So how do republicans "fix":
- people losing their jobs for saying "all lives matter" (a business can fire whoever it wants)
- people being fired from their job because of something their spouse posted on line (a business can fire whoever it wants)

Plus most of that shit never happened.

 

[05C40]

Or, maybe he's so squeaky clean that they gave up looking and hope that not recalling an exact date, 35 years ago, of his trip to China.

I hope that is the case. But given who it is who ordered the "looking," I have to believe that they are under orders to keep looking. Because those currently in charge of the GOP have such despicable behavior in their own pasts that they just assume it's the same for everyone.

 

[UNCatTech]

There's so much to talk about when talking about the rise of Trump. It would take 100 pages to cover it all. Social media played a big role, but I'm not going to get into that.

In general, I think people saw things happening that scared them. If you were concerned about illegal border crossings, you're a labeled a racist. If you are against affirmative action, you're a racist. As part of wokeness, people were losing their jobs for what was essentially thought crimes or because they were white and dressed up as a black celebrity 20 years ago. There were censorship and free speech concerns and there was no faith in the current Republican party or it's politicians to address the issue. We had just come off of the Romney/Obama election... two guys who were, politically, about as close to being the same as any two politicians ever in the Presidential race.

Along come Trump. He doesn't talk like politicians. He talks like "we" talk. He doesn't sugar coat it. He talks straight about the things that worry people.... and so it began.

In the eyes of Republican, and many undecided voters, things haven't gotten any better. Wokeness and cancel culture are largely gone, but in its place is drag queen story hour, DEI, people losing their jobs for saying "all lives matter", cops standing by while businesses are looted. Minnesota politicians calling it a "priviledge" to be able to call the police for help when their house is being robbed and calling or the complete elemination of police. CNN broadcasters standing in front of burning buildings saying idiotic things like "It's a fiery but otherwise peaceful protest". In some cases, people being fired from their job because of something their spouse posted on line. Then there's the lie of a stolen election that consumed the country. Now, you have the economy and inflation and gas prices combined with a very, IMO, underwhelming Kamala Harris.

Again, there's a significant underlying social media influence here.

You believe trump talks like we talk?

He talks nothing like me or any of my friends.

We don't stand in front of people and mock the disabled, we don't disrespect our military, we don't constantly lie.

I will agree that there is something unnerving about political talk from career politicians. But trump isn't the answer. He's not better, different, yes, better, unequivocally no. He is far worse.

 

[mynameisbond]

So how do you think Republicans will handle it when they discover that all their worries were a pack of lies and that they sold their birthright for a metaphorical bowl of porridge?

By then it will be too late, if Trump wins. He gets to stay out of jail and brings the country closer to a totalitarian state, then rides off into the sunset to enjoy his tax breaks.

 

[BlooVooDoo]

That is a fair and accurate summary of the MAGA movement as a whole, IMHO. Trump gives the illusion of being a champion of the little guy. Someone who cares about protecting citizens from the "deep state", elitists, intellectuals, the media, and other people who perceive the world differently than them. He gives them scapegoats for all of the perceived ills and unfairness they hold dear, and hearkens them back to an idyllic yesteryear that never existed. A time when the USA was free from racial unrest, high crime, inflation, unwanted immigrants, scientific warnings of climate change, dependence on imported oil, and all manner of other worries. He's a populist entertainer who will say whatever his audience wants to hear, without regard to truth or logic.

The persistence of this illusion suggests the marks want to be conned, so long as it provides cover for their base emotions.

 

[UNCatTech]

I'm not saying that at all. Obviously there are racists in the country, but not 72 million... or however many votes Trump got last election. I also don't think, at all, that everyone that voted from Trump in 2016 was racist.

I believe the majority of trump voters in 2016 consisted of people that believed in the expected elevated position of white men.

That manifest in many ways.
Hating that a black man had been elected.
Being a flat out racist.
Believing women shouldn't be leaders.
Believing men are above women in general.
Believing that there was an active movement to equalize others with that perceived exalted status of the white man.

I'm sure not all fell into this category. But the fact that they didn't call out their fellow Republicans that did is almost as damning as being in the racist and misogynistic group.