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BTW, one of my hobbies is going to last games in various MLB stadiums. I've been to Tiger, Yankee, Comiskey (last season game), Cleveland (last season game), Shea, County, Busch, Candlestick, Memorial (last season game), Astrodome (last season game), Jack Murphy (last season game), Veterans, Riverfront, Fulton County (last regular season game), Three Rivers, Metrodome (last regular season game), Globe Life, Kingdome, Arlington, Metropolitan (my first MLB game - a doubleheader in 1970), Turner Field, Pro Player, and RFK.

Coming next month - Oakland-Alameda County Coliseum. I've been to this stadium before but this trip is for the last series & game. If any Cali fans on the board want to get together and break bread while I'm in your state, give me a shoutout.

Signed,

"The Closer"
 
Sheetsfaced said:
He’s undeniably great. However his home OPS is 1.174 and his road OPS is .856 so that article is asinine. However the answer to the best player in baseball is Shohei Ohtani. Being both one of the best hitters and the best pitchers in the game makes it undeniable.

Now, he’s obviously not pitching this season so if you’re asking this specific season you’ve got an argument. But even then, Aaron Judge has a higher WAR and is likely to win the MVP this season.

But to your last question, given Bobby Witt’s age and the fact he’s locked up for the next decade he very well may be the answer. Although that contract isn’t cheap.
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Before his latest injury, I'd have taken Acuna over Witt for the next decade. At their peaks Acuna is better but there's no telling if he will come back 100%.

Skenes is something else. You don't want to build around a pitcher because of injuries, but if he stays healthy he very well could be the best player after Ohtani's reign is done.
 
It's hard for me to accept a pitcher as "best player" because they only play every five days. If I'm building a team from the ground up I'm starting with an everyday player.
 
farce said:
It's hard for me to accept a pitcher as "best player" because they only play every five days. If I'm building a team from the ground up I'm starting with an everyday player.
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Pedro Martinez led the AL in WAR two years in a row in 99 and 00. By a substantial margin (almost 2 WAR both seasons). He also led the NL in WAR in 1997. Nobody else even approached his WAR numbers for those four seasons (in 98, he had merely a 7.3 WAR which is usually good enough for top 3 MVP consideration).

He was the best player in baseball at the time. I understand your point and normally you're not wrong, but I think there are a few superlative pitchers who are so dominant that you can't ignore them.
 
WAR for pitcher is not an apples to apples comparison with WAR for everyday players. Starting pitchers only play 30 games a year.
 
farce said:
It's hard for me to accept a pitcher as "best player" because they only play every five days. If I'm building a team from the ground up I'm starting with an everyday player.
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Agreed. Plus a great defense behind a pitcher can make all the difference in the world when it comes to a pitcher's numbers.

Btw. Witt is/was leading the majors in defense runs saved.
 
milom98 said:
Agreed. Plus a great defense behind a pitcher can make all the difference in the world when it comes to a pitcher's numbers.

Btw. Witt is/was leading the majors in defense runs saved.
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FanGraphs uses FIP in their calculation of WAR for pitchers, but it's still kind of shaky. You rarely hear folks discussing WAR as a meaningful stat for pitchers.

I would probably pick Witt first if I were drafting a team from scratch, but his age is a big part of that choice. I reserve the right to change that selection as I see more of Jackson Holliday!
 
Bigs23 said:
I think they should play out the 10th then start the ghost runner in the 11th.
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But I would like to see the following method...

10th inning - Ghost runner on first
11th inning - Ghost runner on second
12th inning - Ghost runner on third
13th inning - Ghost runners on second and third
14th inning and after - Ghost runners on first, second, and third

I think it dampens the impact of the ghost runner in the 10th and ramps up the impact as the innings go along.
 
UNCMSinLS said:
BTW, one of my hobbies is going to last games in various MLB stadiums. I've been to Tiger, Yankee, Comiskey (last season game), Cleveland (last season game), Shea, County, Busch, Candlestick, Memorial (last season game), Astrodome (last season game), Jack Murphy (last season game), Veterans, Riverfront, Fulton County (last regular season game), Three Rivers, Metrodome (last regular season game), Globe Life, Kingdome, Arlington, Metropolitan (my first MLB game - a doubleheader in 1970), Turner Field, Pro Player, and RFK.

Coming next month - Oakland-Alameda County Coliseum. I've been to this stadium before but this trip is for the last series & game. If any Cali fans on the board want to get together and break bread while I'm in your state, give me a shoutout.

Signed,

"The Closer"
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That’s super cool. May you never go to Wrigley.
 
HeelInTheOzarks said:
That’s super cool. May you never go to Wrigley.
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I have a college buddy who lives near Chicago. We went to a Cubs game back in the 1980s. I'll never forget Harry Carey's 7th-inning "Take Me Out to the Ball Game" serenade. We sat in the bleachers. It was a raucous group. Only Fenway's bleacher bums rivaled the experience ... and ... I LOVED IT!
 
Sheetsfaced said:
He’s undeniably great. However his home OPS is 1.174 and his road OPS is .856 so that article is asinine. However the answer to the best player in baseball is Shohei Ohtani. Being both one of the best hitters and the best pitchers in the game makes it undeniable.

Now, he’s obviously not pitching this season so if you’re asking this specific season you’ve got an argument. But even then, Aaron Judge has a higher WAR and is likely to win the MVP this season.

But to your last question, given Bobby Witt’s age and the fact he’s locked up for the next decade he very well may be the answer. Although that contract isn’t cheap.
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Is Kauffman Stadium going to cost Bobby Witt Jr. the MVP?​

Kauffman Stadium home run suppression is making it harder for Bobby Witt Jr. to make his case.​

www.royalsreview.com

Is Kauffman Stadium going to cost Bobby Witt Jr. the MVP?

Kauffman Stadium home run suppression is making it harder for Bobby Witt Jr. to make his case.
www.royalsreview.com www.royalsreview.com

Looks like Yankee Stadium isn't the friendliest of confines but Judge probably just hit no doubters.

baseballsavant.mlb.com

Statcast Home Run Tracking

Baseball Savant
baseballsavant.mlb.com baseballsavant.mlb.com
 
milom98 said:

Is Kauffman Stadium going to cost Bobby Witt Jr. the MVP?​

Kauffman Stadium home run suppression is making it harder for Bobby Witt Jr. to make his case.​

www.royalsreview.com

Is Kauffman Stadium going to cost Bobby Witt Jr. the MVP?

Kauffman Stadium home run suppression is making it harder for Bobby Witt Jr. to make his case.
www.royalsreview.com www.royalsreview.com

Looks like Yankee Stadium isn't the friendliest of confines but Judge probably just hit no doubters.

baseballsavant.mlb.com

Statcast Home Run Tracking

Baseball Savant
baseballsavant.mlb.com baseballsavant.mlb.com
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Thanks for sharing. Yeah, I'm sorry but the author is quite delusional. It's an all time homer take. Like I said earlier Witt Jr. is great. But let's take a look at the home and road splits (batting average, on base, slugging, OPS) for Witt Jr. and Judge:

Witt Jr. Home .401/.453/.721/1.174
Road .299/.346/.510/.856
He has 12 HR at home and 13 HR on the road

Judge Home .340/.492/.706/1.198
Road .324/.438/.701/1.139
He has 19 HR at home and 25 HR on the road

So when looking at those numbers Judge is supposed to be the one benefitting more from playing half his games at his home ball park? What?

The mental gymnastics the author used to try and make that argument is astounding. Witt has the 3rd best OPS in all of baseball. If you take just his road OPS he drops to 17th. Which is still really, really good. Not nearly MVP level, but very good. Judge has the best OPS in all of baseball and if you take just his road OPS he drops all the way to; wait no it's STILL the best in the league!

Obviously Witt Jr.'s value is far more than just hitting as he's great on the base paths and he plays a premium position and plays it very well. But that's not what the premise of the article is about. Judge plays a premium position too although not nearly as well.

Trying to make the argument that Witt would have a better chance of winning the MVP if he didn't have to play at Kaufman when looking at the above stats sure is something.
 
The Royals are starting a brutal 20 game stretch of baseball tonight that could make or break their season.

3v PHI
4@ CLE
4@ HOU
3v CLE
3v MIN
3@ NYY

I'd take .500 over this stretch all day but doubt that happens.
 
farce said:
WAR for pitcher is not an apples to apples comparison with WAR for everyday players. Starting pitchers only play 30 games a year.
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Why not? WAR is basically asking the question, "how many more runs did your team score, and how many fewer did your team give up, by virtue of having you on the team instead of a rando off the waiver wire." That can be used for pitchers as well. To my knowledge, virtually every baseball prediction model uses full team WAR, including for pitchers, in assessing the quality of a team.

WAR is the signature stat for hitters because it facilitates cross-positional comparisons, which we have to do when deciding on awards like MVP. For instance, if you're trying to figure out whether the MVP should be the good-hitting CF who steals bases or the 1B who won the Triple Crown, WAR can help make the comparison apples-to-apples. Or if you're trying to figure out whether to move your bad-defense, good hitting SS to 2B or 3B, you'd want to know how much positional value you're giving up.

None of this is needed for pitchers, because it's only one position. You don't need WAR to tell you about K rate or HR rate -- you can just look at those stats directly. And there's sort of an unwritten rule now that we don't compare hitters and pitchers for awards. Pitchers have the CY, hitters have the MVP, and it's all good. So pitcher WAR isn't as necessary for discussion. It doesn't make it an invalid stat.

BTW, the history of WAR is a bit weird. I used to be into baseball stats in the 90s when the community known as "Baseball Prospectus" rolled out advanced stats like WAR. It's an ideological choice as much as anything. That community consisted largely of conservative, investment analyst types who relied on a type of Econ 101-level "marginal value added" assumption in making that choice. Why not "Wins Above Average"? That choice is not inconsequential. Let's say, for instance, that there are 20 good 2B in the league and 30 good 1B. Well, in WAR, the best 2B gets compared against a really bad player, and the best 1B gets compared against a decent one. That's fine, but it's a big advantage for the 2B that's based largely on the suckiness of the bottom-feeders. I would contend that if you're trying to build a champion, WAA is better than WAR, because you're not likely to have any replacement-level players. If you're playing to win, then you can make trades and sign players so that the worst player you have is merely below-average. And that will be true of your competitors too. So if I'm choosing whether to upgrade at one position, I don't want to know how much better it makes me when measured against the worst players; I want to know how much better it makes me when measured against my actual players.
 
After every home game, the Yankees play "New York, New York" over the loud speakers. If they win, they play the Frank Sinatra version. When they lose, they play the Liza Minnelli version. Drawing my own petty conclusions...
 
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