So-called Anti-Woke, Anti-DEI policy catch-all

[Duke Mu]

Looking into it, the consensus is that William the Conquerer had darker brown hair, but his son William II had red hair.

 

[gtyellowjacket]

Looking into it, the consensus is that William the Conquerer had darker brown hair, but his son William II had red hair.

There is no consensus. There are no contemporary or near contemporary written accounts of William I's hair color. There is the Bayeux tapestry which maybe illustrated William with brown hair if the dye hasn't changed in 10 centuries but also included dragons so take that for what its worth. There was an account by a monk named Orderic Vitalis who knew people that knew William I but probably never met William I himself, which described William I as having a "ruddy" appearance. Some historians take that to mean it like we would with skin but other historians say it was a way to describe reddish brown hair.

And as you mention, William II had red hair. Many of his nobles that had Scandinavian ancestors would have had red hair. Your theory that gingers were persecuted by Normans is interesting but I don't think it holds up.

 

[ZenMode]

Care to elaborate?

In regard to environment, the further you go back, the more there are only white people to do most everything. Yes, I realized that Italians and Jews were not always viewed as being white. White people were the ones who were building bridges, growing crops, committing crimes, performing the majority of every function there was to do. The US, the further you go back, has also been increasingly Christian. In Christianity, men and women often have certain roles and responsibilities.

Biologically speaking, throughout the animal kingdom, males and females are just different and those differences often, but not always, impact choices made in life.

 

[sringwal]

In regard to environment, the further you go back, the more there are only white people to do most everything. Yes, I realized that Italians and Jews were not always viewed as being white. White people were the ones who were building bridges, growing crops, committing crimes, performing the majority of every function there was to do. The US, the further you go back, has also been increasingly Christian. In Christianity, men and women often have certain roles and responsibilities.

This is an oversimplification for a variety of reasons, but I am still interested to see where you are going with this. How does the above claim, in your mind, relate to the present moment? How will, in the future, historians view the now, as a moment in history, in the long chain of events that is the American Experiment?

 

[finesse]

The U.S., at the time the Constitution was signed was the least Christian it ever was. Something like 20-25% went to church in the states. In N.C. and Georgia, it was in single figures.

 

[nycfan]

The U.S., at the time the Constitution was signed was the least Christian it ever was. Something like 20-25% went to church in the states. In N.C. and Georgia, it was in single figures.

Church-going in that agrarian/hunter-trapper and spread-out society wasn’t a great measure of religious beliefs, TBH.

 

[mpaer]

The U.S., at the time the Constitution was signed was the least Christian it ever was. Something like 20-25% went to church in the states. In N.C. and Georgia, it was in single figures.

Wel it was tough to be an Episcopalin back then LOL

 

[finesse]

Church-going in that agrarian/hunter-trapper and spread-out society wasn’t a great measure of religious beliefs, TBH.

Empirically speaking, I'm not so impressed with that argument since I joined Bear Marsh Baptist Church in Beautancus, N.C. and it was founded in 1757. Rodney Stark, a noted religious historian seemed to have thought it notable as well.

 

[ZenMode]

This is an oversimplification for a variety of reasons, but I am still interested to see where you are going with this. How does the above claim, in your mind, relate to the present moment? How will, in the future, historians view the now, as a moment in history, in the long chain of events that is the American Experiment?

How anyone views any given period of time is far too subjective for me to even speculate on. If you listen to some people today, as it relates to racism, you might think we were still in the 1950s. On the other side are people who want to pretend that racism is all but inoculated. The truth lies somewhere in the middle, of course. The same is true for misogyny.

What I would say is this... If we got rid of every racist and every misogynist on the planet, there are still going to be environmental and biological factors that influence every single person walking the Earth. Mexicans are going to like and play soccer, black people are going to like and play basketball and white people are going to like and play ice hockey...well, I'm not because I think it's boring as hell, but nothing in those three generalities is something that needs to be fixed, per se. Should we encourage kids, regardless of race, nationality, gender etc, to pursue any sport, career or hobby they want? Absolutely.

The problem I have with a portion of the Democratic Party is that everything is a fire drill and everything needs to be "fixed" if it's not completely in line with population percentages. There appears to be an unwillingness to acknowledge that people are different and it's ok to be different.

 

[sringwal]

 

[finesse]

Not when your difference is to the ability and willingness to use your inherited advantage to take advantage of others.

 

[ZenMode]

Not when your difference is to the ability and willingness to use your inherited advantage to take advantage of others.

Like LeBron getting his shitty kid drafted by the Lakers?

It's ghost chasing. It's something that can't ever be disproved and can be used as the basis for liberal fire drills indefinitely.

 

[finesse]

In a microcosmic manner.

 

[Mulberry Heel]

The U.S., at the time the Constitution was signed was the least Christian it ever was. Something like 20-25% went to church in the states. In N.C. and Georgia, it was in single figures.

Modern conservative Christians would likely be horrified by the religious beliefs of many of the Founding Fathers. Even those who were more openly Christian (Washington, Hamilton) held views that were well removed from those of the modern Religious Right in religious matters and dogma. Denying that the miracles of the Bible actually happened, that Jesus Christ was divine and the product of a virgin birth, and so on. John Adams, for example, believed that religion "was essential for society", but also that "institutional Christianity" had been the cause of much suffering in the world.

 

[finesse]

Modern conservative Christians would likely be horrified by the religious beliefs of many of the Founding Fathers. Even those who were more openly Christian held views that were well removed from those of the modern Religious Right in religious matters and dogma.

So does about any other Christian ever. Maybe not Reverend Ike. It's based on that same prosperity gospel.

 

[Tarheeljoe]

 

[nycfan]

Arlington website scrubs bio of Lawrence Joel, Winston-Salem Medal of Honor winner​

Arlington website scrubs bio of Lawrence Joel, Winston-Salem Medal of Honor winner

Changes to the cemetery's official website have also made it more difficult to learn of the bravery of another local Black Medal of Honor recipient, Henry Johnson. Johnson won the

journalnow.com

“A link to the biography and war-time heroics of Lawrence Joel is among those that have been scrubbed from the website of Arlington National Cemetery, a move that is part of the federal government's push to eliminate all references to diversity, equity and inclusion on its websites.

In addition, the changes to the cemetery's official website have also made it more difficult to learn of the bravery of another local Black Medal of Honor recipient, Henry Johnson.

Dozens of links on Arlington's official website have been unpublished over the last few weeks, including those leading to short biographies of prominent Black, women and Hispanic service members. Meanwhile, the links to notable politicians and sports figures remain active. …”

 

[nycfan]

Arlington website scrubs bio of Lawrence Joel, Winston-Salem Medal of Honor winner​

Arlington website scrubs bio of Lawrence Joel, Winston-Salem Medal of Honor winner

Changes to the cemetery's official website have also made it more difficult to learn of the bravery of another local Black Medal of Honor recipient, Henry Johnson. Johnson won the

journalnow.com

“A link to the biography and war-time heroics of Lawrence Joel is among those that have been scrubbed from the website of Arlington National Cemetery, a move that is part of the federal government's push to eliminate all references to diversity, equity and inclusion on its websites.

In addition, the changes to the cemetery's official website have also made it more difficult to learn of the bravery of another local Black Medal of Honor recipient, Henry Johnson.

Dozens of links on Arlington's official website have been unpublished over the last few weeks, including those leading to short biographies of prominent Black, women and Hispanic service members. Meanwhile, the links to notable politicians and sports figures remain active. …”

“… Arlington's website allowed people to easily search for the graves and learn the backstory of some the country's war heroes under a heading entitled "Notable Graves."

Underneath that heading, a website visitor could click under sub-headings for notable Black, women and Hispanic service members. Those three sub-headings have now disappeared from the website.

Joel's biography was listed under Medal of Honor recipients, however, most of the links to those recipients, including Joel's and Johnson's, no longer exist.

Johnson's bio had been listed under notable Blacks and Medal of Honor recipients. But with those links no longer available, visitors can now find it under Prominent Military Figures, a page that appears to have remained untouched.

By scrubbing Joel's bio from the Arlington website, visitors may never know that the man buried in Section 46 of the cemetery saved 13 soldiers during a Viet Cong attack north of Saigon in November, 1965. Suffering from gunshot wounds to his legs, Joel crawled through a battlefield over a 24-hour period to aid his fellow soldiers. …”

 

[nycfan]

“… Arlington's website allowed people to easily search for the graves and learn the backstory of some the country's war heroes under a heading entitled "Notable Graves."

Underneath that heading, a website visitor could click under sub-headings for notable Black, women and Hispanic service members. Those three sub-headings have now disappeared from the website.

Joel's biography was listed under Medal of Honor recipients, however, most of the links to those recipients, including Joel's and Johnson's, no longer exist.

Johnson's bio had been listed under notable Blacks and Medal of Honor recipients. But with those links no longer available, visitors can now find it under Prominent Military Figures, a page that appears to have remained untouched.

By scrubbing Joel's bio from the Arlington website, visitors may never know that the man buried in Section 46 of the cemetery saved 13 soldiers during a Viet Cong attack north of Saigon in November, 1965. Suffering from gunshot wounds to his legs, Joel crawled through a battlefield over a 24-hour period to aid his fellow soldiers. …”

“… Johnson may soon find himself again unwittingly in the crosshairs of the DEI backlash.

In 2023, Fort Polk in Louisiana was renamed Fort Johnson in his honor. However, President Donald Trump has vowed to return forts to their original names. Those name changes are happening gradually, most recently with the name Fort Benning being restored after being Fort Moore for the last few years.

Lt. Gen. Leonidas Polk was a Confederate commander. …”

 

[TarSpiel]

The U.S., at the time the Constitution was signed was the least Christian it ever was. Something like 20-25% went to church in the states. In N.C. and Georgia, it was in single figures.

To be fair, a lot of that was probably because people lived on farms and in the country prohibitively far from established churches