Where do we go from here?

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wmheel1287 said:
I would propose that we institute a workable immigration system that is largely open to anyone willing to be productive and work. Do that and you have my blessing to shoot anyone crossing the border illegally without a trial or even apprehension.
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100% with you on sentence one. 100% not with you on sentence two.
 
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heelinhell said:
If the mass deportation is implemented ( I have my doubts) then I would support as part of the plan to identify any employer who hired said captured illegal immigrant who will be deported and charge that employer with a felony for each illegal hired with a punishment up to 20 years in prison.

This would deter employers from hiring illegals which in turn would deter illegals from entering our country to seek employment for a better way of life.
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I have long said this was the real solution to the problem, but the GOP want the illegal immigrants - 1 for the bogeyman and 2 for the cheap labor to enrich their overlords.

Farmers remain pro-GOP despite knowing that a crackdown would spell disaster on their livelihood, because they know the con and that the GOP will never act.

The wild card here is Trump who lies, misspeaks, lies to cover misspeaking, claims he actually did something, will do something he never intended just because he said he would do it, etc etc - i.e. he is old dynamite that is sweating nitroglycerin. The really dangerous thing is you have a pyromaniac in Stephen Miller ready to get his hands on the sticks.
 
E-Verify, which was created by a Democratic president, is just sitting right there if we want to use it. But I'm confident the small business owners who are overwhelmingly conservative have no desire to use it.
 
altmin said:
I have long said this was the real solution to the problem, but the GOP want the illegal immigrants - 1 for the bogeyman and 2 for the cheap labor to enrich their overlords.

Farmers remain pro-GOP despite knowing that a crackdown would spell disaster on their livelihood, because they know the con and that the GOP will never act.

The wild card here is Trump who lies, misspeaks, lies to cover misspeaking, claims he actually did something, will do something he never intended just because he said he would do it, etc etc - i.e. he is old dynamite that is sweating nitroglycerin. The really dangerous thing is you have a pyromaniac in Stephen Miller ready to get his hands on the sticks.
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The bogeyman factor is huge. Kinda wish the Dems would come out and call it for what it is, but I know that would just result in conservative backlash conflating it with wanting “open borders.”
 
heel17 said:
Then the way forward is to act and "code" as a moderate or as a "common man" and find an economic message / opponent to go after and ram it home every single day. Obama won on healthcare, opportunity, and jobs while seeming like a cool dude to the millions of voters who barely pay attention.

Honestly I think "weird" worked for a bit for the Dems as it highlighted to the 5-10% of persuadable swing state voters that RFK Jr, JD Vance, Trump, and their clown car is indeed a clown car. Run as the "normal" person who is fighting for the little guy of all stripes.
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And yet after about three weeks they just stopped using the weird term and ignored it. It does seem as if her campaign switched strategies after she was nominated. They should have continued to go at Trump directly, but instead they started courting Never Trump Republicans. Maybe the reason they stopped calling Trump Republicans weirdos was because they were afraid it would also turn off Republicans they were trying to recruit. And that was a huge mistake - I've read that after all of her campaign's vigorous efforts to win over Republicans who were sick of Trump, she got the exact same percentage of the GOP vote that Biden got - 6%. Hopefully this disaster will finally convince even the Democratic high command that appealing to Republicans isn't a winning strategy in the Age of Trump -they belong to him now, and they're not leaving the cult for anything or anyone else.
 
Mulberry Heel said:
And yet after about three weeks they just stopped using the weird term and ignored it. It does seem as if her campaign switched strategies after she was nominated. They should have continued to go at Trump directly, but instead they started courting Never Trump Republicans. Maybe the reason they stopped calling Trump Republicans weirdos was because they were afraid it would also turn off Republicans they were trying to recruit. And that was a huge mistake - I've read that after all of her campaign's vigorous efforts to win over Republicans who were sick of Trump, she got the exact same percentage of the GOP vote that Biden got - 6%. Hopefully this disaster will finally convince even the Democratic high command that appealing to Republicans isn't a winning strategy in the Age of Trump -they belong to him now, and they're not leaving the cult for anything or anyone else.
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YES
Somehow-I don't know how-get out the folks that voted for Obama and Ole Joe
 
I thought about starting a new thread for this but chose to go ahead and post it here. This is an excellent overview of how we got here and some ideas on where we go from here. Jon Stewart and HCR make some great points. Please take some time and watch this:

 
gregh1 said:
Lol, imagine her face reading those notes back to other repub strategists. "Okay, that's one attack vector from the Dems we can ignore... And there's probably many many more"
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They should’ve had a smear campaign with the slogan “Dumb and Dangerous” plastered with clips from his rallies and first term. So much content out there Dems could’ve used with a simple message to make it stick.
 
HandsonFire said:
Some of you might find this post interesting.


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Surrender gets you nothing. If his granddaddy saw what this guy dealt with compared to what he did, he'd beat the shit out of the ungrateful bastard. This asshole had a bunch of black people and some white make sacrifices so he can have a say and it's made a difference. It's not fixed and still needs work but that's for the young. Got no use for people like this.

You see it was the extremes on the right and left where neither have the patience to let our country grow. They think there's a destination instead of a process. One of those concepts encompasses the surprises of the future much better.
 
HandsonFire said:
Some of you might find this post interesting.


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I stopped reading after this sentence: "After discussing with my friends and community we came to the conclusion that Kamala was objectively better for society than Trump."

I'll probably finish later as I am interested, but that statement completely supports the point of voting against ones better interest that I don't understand.

If people know which policies are better for them, not participating hurts themselves as well as the rest of us.
 
I posted this in another thread, but I think it fits here as well.

One thing that ought to be noted, as it's become clearer as more election results are posted, is just how much of this GOP victory was a victory for Trump and not necessarily the party as a whole. In state after state we're seeing Republican Senate or House candidates running well behind Trump and losing. The latest Republican to lose is Sam Brown in Nevada, who got over 70,000 fewer votes than Trump. And we're seeing this pattern over and over again across the country. It really does seem as if voters loved them some Trump but were much less enthusiastic about other members of his party. It's small comfort for the short term, but I do wonder if Trumpism will be transferable to any of the current crop of future GOP presidential contenders, including even people like Haley or Youngkin or Vance. I have doubts that any of them could bring out the vote as Trump did in 2020 and this year. But of course that doesn't excuse the failures of the Democrats or their need to connect with more voters.
 
heelinhell said:
If the mass deportation is implemented ( I have my doubts) then I would support as part of the plan to identify any employer who hired said captured illegal immigrant who will be deported and charge that employer with a felony for each illegal hired with a punishment up to 20 years in prison.

This would deter employers from hiring illegals which in turn would deter illegals from entering our country to seek employment for a better way of life.
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I agree about going after the employers of illegals. But I also think the narrative that the illegals are “only taking jobs that Americans don’t want” is irritating to many tradesmen that don’t see this as accurate in their world. In many agricultural and meat processing jobs this is probably true, but many local Joe tradesmen get undercut on quotes from basically immigrant crews. I have seen this on several jobs I’ve had quoted in various types of trades and always go with the local Joe types, trying to do my part to support them. It definitely does reduce the amount they can realistically quote, however.
 
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